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+---- Thread: Capital ship balance Propasals (/showthread.php?tid=7888)
Capital ship balance Propasals - X-Lancer - 04-19-2008
Gunboat class
BHG Gunship
That ship turn as fast as a bomber..and its size,, very very small..reduce its power capacity and recharge rate to be fair..
Cruiser class
Albatross Battlecruiser
No thruster for Albatross Battlecruiser while other BC having fun with it? not fair...
Liberty Assault Battlecruiser
this ship has same turn rate with Albatross Battlecruiser..and it has bigger powerplant than any other BC...either change its powerplant like other BC or decrease the turn rate..
Battleship class
Liberty Dreadnought
Liberty Dreadnought..compare to the size of the ship to Bretonia Battleship. they are basicly have the same size..Bretonia ship just has a bigger head than Liberty dread..so why same size of the ship..but Bretonia BS has 14 turret and Liberty Dread only has 12? Liberty dread should have 1 or 2 more turret slot..
Battlestar
Battlestar should have higher armour than Dragon Battleship because it has bigger size..
Bounty Hunter Battleship
a serious unbalance ship. has the smaller size than the Osiris.(BHG BS is about half of the lenght of Liberty Dread..Osiris is about the same lenght with Liberty Dread, the width of the BHG BS at the front is smaller than Osiris. at the back which is the biggest part is abit fatter than Liberty Dread) but has higher armour and have 14 gun can shoot forward and 13 gun shoot side way..strongly recommand that reduce the turret slot to 12 or 13
Osiris
Bring back the old ship states(the states in 4.83) and increase its strafe force so it can dodge enemy's fire perfectly at least at the distance of 1K~1.5K..
PS: Osiris only can have 10 gun shoot forward..there are a big blind spots for the 2 guns at the back..it makes it cant shoot forward..so dont bitching about Osiris has too much firepower...and of course..all gun can shoot 360 degrees for Osiris would be AWSOME!
Capital ship balance Propasals - Eppy - 04-19-2008
No. Sorry, Lancer, but the Liberty Dreadnought has half the forward cross-section of the Bretonian Battleship and damn near as much armor. It's got plenty of guns and it can dodge like hell; indeed, it has more armor than the freaking Outcast Battleship, which has a bigger cross section and is twice is log (Now THERE'S a ship that needs help). The Liberty Dreadnought was and still is one of the best ships in the game, period, across all class spectrums. I chased off flights of Phantom bombers in the damn thing when I still had mine, I'm not too worried. The BHG BS has extremely low armor and has a cross-section bigger than the Osiris. No need to change it.
Capital ship balance Propasals - X-Lancer - 04-19-2008
' Wrote:No. Sorry, Lancer, but the Liberty Dreadnought has half the forward cross-section of the Bretonian Battleship and damn near as much armor. It's got plenty of guns and it can dodge like hell; indeed, it has more armor than the freaking Outcast Battleship, which has a bigger cross section and is twice is long (Now THERE'S a ship that needs help). The Liberty Dreadnought was and still is one of the best ships in the game, period, across all class spectrums. I chased off flights of Phantom bombers in the damn thing when I still had mine, I'm not too worried. The BHG BS has extremely low armor and has a cross-section bigger than the Osiris. No need to change it.
Outcast BS..yea...it's so freaking long...didnt thought about Outcast BS..sry...but..BHG BS its main body it's about the same cross-section as Liberty Dreadnought....and half of the lenght of the Liberty Dread..and cross-section doesnt mean everything...is the whole size of the ship..it's the smallest BS in game IMO(BHG stuff always is the smallest.GS..Cruiser..BC.)...and think in your way...Osiris/Liberty Dreadnought has much longer cross-section than a BHG BS..so they should have mroe turrets? than BHG's 14 Turret slot BS?
PS: and ppl doesnt use cross-section of your ship to fight..usually..
Capital ship balance Propasals - Jinx - 04-19-2008
arguing with the size of a ship - the "big" battleships should have a lot more armour. - and of course turrets. - or how comes that a ship more than twice the size of a liberty dreadnaught has "only" 14-16 turrets, and not 32 ( rheinland battleship, zoner battleship, nomad battleship, kusari battleship ) - and twice the armour.
its about the balance there - a liberty dreadnaught is small and can - if it keeps the distance - even dodge weaponfire in. so the number of turrets and the armour it has is secondary. as long as it survives, it will take an enemy down.
about the BHG battleship - i never used one. but its quite small, yes. - mind, i see enough people die in one, too - to a pair of little bombers. - not overpowered much, in my opinion.
the BHG gunship - its been discussed. anyway - saying it has a greater agility than bomber is fiction i think. - i used both, and i am very certain that even the civi bomber turns faster - not to mention the BHG bomber and catamaran. - even the praetorian is quicker when it comes to turning. - but is it unbalanced? .. don t think so - 2.5 multiplier on universal armour ( unless you wanne spend an entire fortune on an 8 armour ) makes it as vulnerable as a SHF ( once its shields are down ) - two good bombers - and they re down in 2 SNs. - whats left is something quite weak ( another 2 SNs take it down, if it has UA8 )
Capital ship balance Propasals - Robert.Fitzgerald - 04-19-2008
Jinx, I think it is more agile than the Barghest and the Waran. That's where the "more agile than bomber" thing comes from.
The problem with the gunship is it has great agility and the same turrets/powerplant as larger and slower gunboats. It can own fighters and bombers with missiles, while still firing 4 turrets.
Against a capital ship, it is still decent because of the agility. The low armour rating does make it a bit weak, though.
What's the exact damage of a supernova?
Capital ship balance Propasals - stewcool - 04-19-2008
I agree and disagree so umm...im just not gonna vote.
EDIT: I thought the Osiris maneuverability dropped. explains it
Capital ship balance Propasals - Jinx - 04-19-2008
the exact damage of one supernova is 139.000 damage. the base armour of a BHG gunship is 55.000 ( everyone will have a universal 8 armour 2.5 - which makes it 137.500 armor ) - actually, ONE SN shot once its shields are down - .... or in other words... doesn t matter if you have armour or not.
of course, with a cap8 armour, you ll have 220.000 armour ( but seriously, - it could be considered either mental or ooRP to stick a 890.000.000 $ armour on a 23.000.000 ship. )
now - the only part i do not agree with is - that the gunBOAT is considered "decommisioned" and old, while the orca is the new one. - it should be the other way round.... especially cause the gunboat is in line with the current capital ship designs, while the orca is .... a powerboat without water. ( and not too similar to the rest of the fleet ) - turn the descriptions around - making the small gunboat the advanced ship.
Capital ship balance Propasals - Robert.Fitzgerald - 04-19-2008
The Orca needs to be buffed, badly. The Forward cannon is a complete joke.
I would make the forward cannon have a better fire-arc and the 7th turret made forward firing. The only person I've ever seen using it was a person who didn't understand the rules...
The Orca should be the anti-capital ship, while the Gunship should be the anti-fighter.
Capital ship balance Propasals - Carlos_Benitez - 04-19-2008
The Bounty-Hunter Gunboat is far too difficult to take down with bombers, and not easy to take down with capital ships. They can out-turn my Praetorian. IMO they need serious balancing.
I also agree with the Osiris proposal.
Capital ship balance Propasals - NonSequitor - 04-19-2008
I tend to have a sceptically and a slightly cynical attitude concerning these kinds of "balance the ships" -posts.
We are human beings and thus our ability to be objective is often undermined by our own perceived interests.
Lately, there has been some talk about the BHG gunship as being uber and too effective in what it does. Much of the critique has come from players who pilot unlawlful chars, which ironically tend to have the best ships and equipment in the game.
I have a gunship and in spite of my own interests I can agree to some of the critique being leveled at it.
Even though it is a gunship (thus smaller than the gunboat), it definitely is on the petite side. Small ship, good powerplant and conveniently placed hardpoints. A bomber pilot's headache and a light cruiser pilot's reason for concern.
My suggestion: Deep-six the Orca completely. The ship doesn't resemble any of the other BHG ships (as was pointed out) and the front gun hardpoint location makes a good weapon nearly useless. Increase the size of the BHG gunship - make it a gunboat. Maybe a 15% size increase would do it. Decrease the turning rate a smidgen. Give it the Orca front gun. The upper bow turret hardpoint would be a good hardpoint for the front gun.
As for monkeying around with the powerplant, I would say "no". I assume the powerplant is as robust as it is due to the front gun. Firing the FG and all turrets drains the powerplant in rapid fashion. Of course the BHG gunship and IMG gunboat don't possess FGs, but many pilots just substitute with dual cerbs, energy-hogs in their own right.