Discovery Gaming Community

The only thing that I can't get about the idea of Junker base in Sigma 17 - why would junkers go there to build a base?

Ask yourself "why" more, pls.

(12-11-2013, 11:42 PM)Syrus Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-11-2013, 08:19 PM)xiphos Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-11-2013, 01:03 PM)Syrus Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-11-2013, 08:37 AM)Curios Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-11-2013, 08:28 AM)xiphos Wrote: [ -> ]Wait wait wait. Are we talking about the same system?

I guess not...

I guess he meant that little bunch of scrap and metal chunks floating in Sigma 17 where the Fp used to be.

Yep. Exactly what I meant. It'd be "easiest" to build a base when there are already parts around that one might be able to salvage.

And then maybe people also salvaged stuff from Sigma-13 and brought it there and poof ... Base there!

Well, just a suggestion.

Ok. We are talking about the same System. But then again. A Junker base in Sigma 17 in an area near the Jumpgate isn't exactly what Samura would tolerate with Planet Kurile as a major piece for their food production ( Alien Organism for Junyo Fish). Or am i totally wrong with the Location of Freeport 7's scrap?

Considering the influence the GMG probably has around those areas I don't think it'd be impossible for Junkers to build a base there. And as was already said, conflict can bring activity.

OH. The GMG. Yeah. Almost forgot about them..........

(12-11-2013, 09:35 PM)LunaticOnTheGrass Wrote: [ -> ]It's in the same system, yeah. And maybe Junkers combing about the station could bring reason for the Hogosha/Samura to fight the Junkers in the system.

Conflict breeds activity after all.

Like the new Outcasts/Corsair bases in Sigma 13? Like the new FA base in Honshu? Like the GC Base in Shikoku? Well. Not the best example's maybe. It's dead Kusari after all. But just because there are new base doesn't mean a new conflict. And the Hogosha are almost non existent.

In my 3 years at Disco, i met 2 or 3 Junkers in Sigma 13 with Yanagi around. And i did the Kusari to Rheinland run a lot.

(12-12-2013, 06:24 AM)Curios Wrote: [ -> ]The only thing that I can't get about the idea of Junker base in Sigma 17 - why would junkers go there to build a base?

Ask yourself "why" more, pls.

Well. I like Syrus idea:

(12-11-2013, 11:42 PM)Syrus Wrote: [ -> ]'Then there are the Junkers, who just lost their base in Sigma-13. Looking for new opportunities they could start taking apart the Freeport's scrap field while trying to get undermine the Hogosha/Samura influence in the area. It would also be a good route for Cardamine into the systems in RP, since the Taus have become more dangerous due to the GRN

Especially the Cardamine part. But then they should build the base somewhere else in Sigma 17. Not directly where a GMG patrol can see them docking with Cardi. And i guess Cryer wouldn't be so happy with Cardamine Transport's directly at their doorstep.

I am all for new Bases in Sirius. But they should makes sense. A Junker base in Sigma 17 near the Jumpgate wouldn't makes sense imo. Junkers try to hide as much as they can. Shady deals and stuff.

(12-12-2013, 04:36 AM)Echo 7-7 Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-11-2013, 11:45 PM)Trogdor Wrote: [ -> ]They are? I haven't seen any ingame, and there's no forum activity from them. Their roll call thread was last updated 2 months ago. What are you using as a basis for your argument that they are not dead?

Not trying to be disrespectful, it just seems a waste to have a system with 4 bases in it for a faction that maybe has one or two people left, and because of its location hardly anyone will ever visit.

And I already pointed out the other benefits.

Cayman is an exception since it is not just a Guard system, but a faction's home system too. Now that RoS exists as an NPC faction, it's far more efficient (because of the time required to create a NPC faction from scratch) to make the ID open to the public, similarly to how the Coalition ID was made public. While the decision is not one I can make on my own, it reflects recent Dev policies.

Besides, there don't need to be any more Zoner bases in that region.

If anyone wanted to play Reapers, I'd agree with you, but again: where is there evidence to support the idea that people want to play Reapers?
-Their ships are just borderworld fighters with a few little pieces tacked on.
-Their roleplay is basically Primary Goal: Zoner. Secondary Goal: pew SCRA, which is something you can do as half a dozen other factions. There just isn't much substance here to make the roleplay compelling; it feels like a faction whose only purpose is to give the SCRA yet another faction to shoot at (like they need it) and their lore is a halfhearted attempt to justify it.
-The official faction being gone implies that the people who were most interested in the faction's existence are gone or no longer care.
-The mod has too many factions as it is. If we are going to reduce this, this faction and the hellfires should probably be the first to go. InRP, they lost, died out, no longer had the resources to accomplish their goals, etc.

Making the faction open isn't going to solve these problems. You compare their situation to the SCRA; was the SCRA dying? They seem to be fairly active yet, both on the forums and ingame.

The Zoners don't need more bases in that region? Uhh... have you seen how many bases the Corsairs have in the systems surrounding Gamma? They've got, what.. 4 systems and at least 8 bases back there?! o_o;

Furthermore, moving the Zoners to Cayman would have a number of benefits:
-You get to reclaim all of the bases in O-74 and use them for other things.
-You get another system that you can either delete to reduce clutter, or use to reorganize the Omicrons in such a way that promotes activity.
-Cayman would become the new seat of Zoner...ness, creating a population center that is far away from any other major power. This is completely in line with Zoner philosophy. The Zoners would finally have a home system that isn't basically right next to the heart of another major faction.
-It would make sense that the Zoners may want to evacuate Omega 49, since Lanzarote is effectively useless and there are apparently ground wars on Canaria's surface.
-The NPC faction may (or may not - they could continue living there but cede ownership of the stations to the Zoners) go away, but Cayman, and the fancy bases in it that are currently gathering dust and cobwebs, would be used. To me, this is a much more efficient use of the dev team's time and effort than what you suggest.



As for the Junkers rebuilding FP7 - Not a terrible idea, but the location isn't good, especially if we're going with the idea that it was the GMG that forced the Junkers out of Sig 13.

The Junkers also wouldn't build a Freeport, they'd build a Junker base.

cos they lost yanagi?

(12-12-2013, 10:56 AM)Trogdor Wrote: [ -> ]...

This post basically reads as if you're trying to sell out O-74 in favour of a system you personally find appealing. There's also very little justification for Zoners manufacturing the unique style of bases seen in Cayman. Besides, I'm sure the Phoenix would have a few things to say about having their system pillaged.

(12-12-2013, 11:37 AM)Echo 7-7 Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-12-2013, 10:56 AM)Trogdor Wrote: [ -> ]...

This post basically reads as if you're trying to sell out O-74 in favour of a system you personally find appealing. There's also very little justification for Zoners manufacturing the unique style of bases seen in Cayman. Besides, I'm sure the Phoenix would have a few things to say about having their system pillaged.

...

I listed many reasons why this move would benefit the faction and Disco. None of those reasons were "Because I think Cayman looks cool and I want it". If that's the sticking issue, by all means, just delete Cayman's bases, move O-74's bases into Cayman, and use Cayman's base models for something else.

(I will admit that I would prefer to use Cayman's base models for the Zoner guard system. The story would then be that the Zoners saw an opportunity in the decline of the Reapers and moved to Cayman, scrapping their own stations to escape being caught in the middle of so many warring factions. But if those have to go somewhere else to make the move happen, so be it. The move is more important, and would just be a straight-up retcon in this case.)

And I have a few things to say about Phoenix "owning" the Zoner guard system in the first place. The system's bases are supposed to belong to the entire faction, just like O-49 and Penny's. This is why those bases don't have player administrators. (At least, afaik). Also, "their" system isn't being 'pillaged' - just moved.

Anyway, O-74 is awful. It feels incredibly artificial, what with the jumphole being right next to FP9, the enormous minefield surrounding Corinth, the EXTRA BASE just for protecting Corinth, FP15 being so close to FP9... Furthermore, 74 is a crossroads, with several opposing factions using it to move around the Omicrons. Does this sound like a place the Zoners would build their most important stations?

Those stations shouldn't exist in RP in the first place. Guard systems are such a mess.

O-74 is... not good, but I'm not into sacrificing Cayman's current potential just to fix that system.

(12-12-2013, 12:15 PM)Trogdor Wrote: [ -> ]And I have a few things to say about Phoenix "owning" the Zoner guard system in the first place. [b]The system's bases are supposed to belong to the entire faction, just like O-49 and Penny's[b]. This is why those bases don't have player administrators. (At least, afaik). Also, "their" system isn't being 'pillaged' - just moved.

Now have i missed something here?

because i dont remember zoners being a faction in the 'singular' sense.

So how can systems be "owned" by the "whole" faction?

O-49 is actually under the 'stewardship' of OSI.

I get the sense that this is one of those "Zoner indies have no control QQ" responses.

* Sabru waits for trogdor and/or Tel to ramble on spewing anti-faction QQ.

(12-12-2013, 12:46 PM)Echo 7-7 Wrote: [ -> ]O-74 is... not good, but I'm not into sacrificing Cayman's current potential just to fix that system.

What current potential? @_@

(12-12-2013, 12:50 PM)Sabre Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-12-2013, 12:15 PM)Trogdor Wrote: [ -> ]And I have a few things to say about Phoenix "owning" the Zoner guard system in the first place. [b]The system's bases are supposed to belong to the entire faction, just like O-49 and Penny's[b]. This is why those bases don't have player administrators. (At least, afaik). Also, "their" system isn't being 'pillaged' - just moved.

Now have i missed something here?

because i dont remember zoners being a faction in the 'singular' sense.

So how can systems be "owned" by the "whole" faction?

Except they are. The official factions just like to pretend they're not, for their own convenience.

Do the TAZ/OSI/Phoenix each have their own shiplines, shipyards? No, they use *Zoner* tech that is faction-wide.

There are certain things that were judged long ago to be too important to allow any one faction or player-character to claim control over. They were to be shared, run by neutral NPCs. This is the philosophy that was in place when I joined Disco, it's the philosophy I agree with, and so it's the philosophy I argue for.

Furthermore, O74 was implemented before Phoenix/Omicroners even existed. Therefore they could not have built those bases; they claimed ownership of them long after they were built. Who owned them before? Neutral NPCs (Therefore, the whole faction).

This is not a desirable state of affairs. TAZ would not want Phoenix (Or some other group that takes ownership in the future) to be able to decide one day that TAZ is no longer able to use capital ships because they are ceasing shipments of ships and parts, would they?

Quote:O-49 is actually under the 'stewardship' of OSI.

Again, they 'claimed' it long after it existed, how would you like it if OSI blocked you from docking on Canaria, etc etc.

Quote:I get the sense that this is one of those "Zoner indies have no control QQ" responses.

* Sabre waits for trogdor and/or Tel to ramble on spewing anti-faction QQ.

Sabre once again proves he is not capable of having a discussion without being rude and/or insulting.

* Trogdor goes back to pretending Sabre doesn't exist.