' Wrote:I disagree. IMG makes lots of money just like zoners by selling their ships and equipment to other factions. This is what made them rich. They dont support liberty, rhenland and much less kusary and Bretonia. If an indie buys their ship and then turns to the dark side its his option and if he decides to rob BMM republican shp. or other traders it does not concern IMG since its out of their ZOI and out of their diplomatic relations.
of course such a RP story would be needed to fill in the gaps.
don't be so hasty to make IMG careless about who they sell their ships just cause Raven Talon has in its description that it is sold on black market...it may be so...but that is only that ship...
IMG GB is their response to tensions between Kusari and Bretonia. It is should be used to protect their trade convoys and stations against BMM, BPA and sometimes even Kusari navy. IMG is right in the middle of bret/kusari conflict and IMG GB is purely their defense ship. Every news about that say that IMG already suffered many casualties in that conflicts so this ship gives them a bit more power. That ship is purely for their own purpose. They may sell one or two to friendlies though...
Albatross, despite its potential power is role play exploration vessel (and by stats it is weakest Bcruiser), and should be rare, so it can't be used for defense with reasonable effect.
' Wrote:don't be so hasty to make IMG careless about who they sell their ships just cause Raven Talon has in its description that it is sold on black market...it may be so...but that is only that ship...
Careless? I think i made myself clear that they do it on purpose! Just like the zoners, they sell one ship and produce 3 more just with the sheer profit they make. Im not sure weather the market is black but every litle bit helps them to
1) avoid conflicts
2) finance their own military force
3) become more influencial as an intergalactic mining & ship-construction guild.
' Wrote:IMG GB is their response to tensions between Kusari and Bretonia. It is should be used to protect their trade convoys and stations against BMM, BPA and sometimes even Kusari navy. IMG is right in the middle of bret/kusari conflict and IMG GB is purely their defense ship. Every news about that say that IMG already suffered many casualties in that conflicts so this ship gives them a bit more power. That ship is purely for their own purpose. They may sell one or two to friendlies though...
The IMG Gunboat does not have this text implemented in its description box, right?
So what prevents people from freely RPing. Its your freedom to bend the potential truth since there
are actually no real bounds in the first place. What makes you think that a gunboat cant wind up on the
black market? example from the real world: Nuclear and bio weapons. (they cost more then a warship.
are better protected but still thieves sell them to terrorists and government agencies.)
' Wrote:Albatross, despite its potential power is role play exploration vessel (and by stats it is weakest Bcruiser), and should be rare, so it can't be used for defense with reasonable effect.
It may be weak (all thou i managed to bring down a couple of cruisers/bombers with it.) but lets stay in RP shall we? Its the IMG's most potent vessel. Its designed so that it can defend the guild's interests and stations if they become hostile to one ot the houses. (or to fend off weaker outcast cruisers)
' Wrote:Careless? I think i made myself clear that they do it on purpose! Just like the zoners, they sell one ship and produce 3 more just with the sheer profit they make. Im not sure weather the market is black but every litle bit helps them to
1) avoid conflicts
2) finance their own military force
3) become more influencial as an intergalactic mining & ship-construction guild.
The IMG Gunboat does not have this text implemented in its description box, right?
So what prevents people from freely RPing. Its your freedom to bend the potential truth since there
are actually no real bounds in the first place. What makes you think that a gunboat cant wind up on the
black market? example from the real world: Nuclear and bio weapons. (they cost more then a warship.
are better protected but still thieves sell them to terrorists and government agencies.)
It may be weak (all thou i managed to bring down a couple of cruisers/bombers with it.) but lets stay in RP shall we? Its the IMG's most potent vessel. Its designed so that it can defend the guild's interests and stations if they become hostile to one ot the houses. (or to fend off weaker outcast cruisers)
Nice reply. I like that and it does solve the issue of what gunboat-less factions might do.
Have done Wild missions and its pretty tough without at least a gunboat.
well, the albatros ID card states that its actually really a deep space exploration vessel. its defensive power and offensive capabilities are just there to fend off aggressive contacts far from any resupply base. - it also states that its rare in the ID card, as far as i remember.
but yes, no matter what.... its one of the 3 only battlecruisers, which makes it at least the 3rd most powerful cruiser in the game ( when we think of battlecruisers to be essentially cruisers )
the gunboat however - i m often surprised how many factions claim to have a right to fly it. some of them "exploit" the fact that its a rather neutral gunboat - cause the players do not wish to take a side by choosing a rogue gunboat for example. ( a generic pirate would rather use a rogue gunboat, i think )
for all - we gotto keep in mind that the IMG is just that ... the independent miners guild. - that implies two things. - they are miners ( workers ) and they are a guild ( that means, a rather tightly knit community - unlike the zoners, that are ... NOT a guild, but only a group of people that are defined as zoners... the definition of the zoners comes form other people. - the definition of the IMG comes from themselves )
it would be easy and plausible if the IMG cut any foreign sales of their gear, cause - unlike the zoners.... they are primarily miners, meaning they make their primary profit by mining, not by selling equipment and trading commodities. - zoners are different, - zoners trade, but they do not really produce commodities. they build ships - and make a profit with them... but zoners also don t sell their ships to anyone. - they sell the kushan ships ( zoner developements ) they ( will ) sell the zoner gunboat freely, but anything bigger ( destroyer or juggernaut ) is zoner only. - the juggernaut is not even given to their closest allies - so zoners don t make money with "everything", too.
now a problem with IMG gear is that there is no IMG faction - just like the BHG. no faction that claims to be THE faction. - that is a blessing as well as a curse. it allows much more freedom and a lot more roleplay opportunities than in factions that claim to be THE faction. - but it also allows more exploits and free interpretation.
a little rule would be to look for at least the most present playerfaciton - in case of the IMG, that might be the =CR= and ask them. that is not a registration or anything, its simply communication - and a good backup for any player that wishes to fly a ship that does not scream his faction ID. - in the case of a generic faction, that is quite important - as a generic faction does not tell anything about what the buyer is going to do with the ship.
just yesterday i saw a BHG bomber for example. - it was piloted by a mercenary who admitted that he HATES BHGs... - funny thing he is flying one of their ships then. - the rules say he can, but the RP is at the very least questionable. - so i think its hard to make a general rule about who can and who cannot use IMG gear. - it can be decided from case to case... unless you re an ally of the IMG or IMG IDed.
despite what people say...IMG is on the lawful side, GB is clearly Military vessel...Pirate in lawful GB is rather a stretch
Also, just for information, IMG equip is not free for all type...Its to be used by IMG and their allies. Generic pirate should have hell of a role play story to be able to use that ship for pirating.
About GB; description it doesn't say there that it is sold on free market too...doesn't it? So you assume that it is, just like i assumed that it is made for IMG defense purposes (which have much more sense)...(on my side there is a fact that i made that ship to serve exact that purpose)
There is also one other thing...descriptions are easily enough to change. Now that IMG gets uniformed ship line it will be limited for its usage for sure...IMG is IMG, ITS NOT GENERIC...
IMG GB can be flown by IMG, Zoners (for now) and ALG by default (maybe even Freelancers). All other factions must have valid reason or nice role play contract with CR to own that ship. (and some do)
I find rather funny how people want to use that ship simply cause it is good (or cause they wont chose sides in unlawful world) and for that reason they call it generic, but nobody doesn't want to use rest of IMG equip, like vampires or matterthiefs...if you use IMG GB, then you chose a side...and its to be lawful.
If you think that pirates can fly those ship use one with generic pirate ID and enter Alpha...lets see how u do there
I have seen this with Raven Talon before, and now again with IMG GB...and whats worse, RT is sold on Zoner planet with clear description how it should be sold and used, IMG GB isn't...No pirate can land on Kurile, and not even enter in Tau 44.
The thing not addressed here is there is a little sloppy imbalance in ship types of what quality available to which factions.
There are reasons to want to use a gunboat in rp--in our case with Junkers--and to say, "Well--just work with the available ships" limits our rp in some particular cases. We can buy a cruiser at our base and a bomber and a slew of fighters but no gunboat. Fact is we need a cruiser less and a gunboat more.
Now we could all go buy cruisers and be "in rp" (I'm being facetious there) but fact is we don't need or want to.
So unlawful gunboats don't go down well with a faction that "lives" in lawful space. The Hogosha have a similar problem though the Kusari Explorer fills the gunboat niche nicely for them.
IMG--by virtue that its "independent--at least is somewhat plausible. We'll be happy to rp a purchase elsewhere or with new ships but its a good overall choice until a better alternative is presented.
' Wrote:We'll be happy to rp a purchase elsewhere or with new ships but its a good overall choice until a better alternative is presented.
that we all understand and we are working on it...:)
' Wrote:that we all understand and we are working on it...:)
look, It was more like a suggestion list, not trying to start a flame war here. There is no neutral GB yet so we got to use what we got. And what i said about the black market was only a RP suggestion, if someone has a better RP reason how to get the ship then by all means it might prove to be a "hell-of-a-good-story".
Anyway, people that fly generic pirate or mercenary chars are at a loss here, even junkers. Their need for gunboats is as big as ours.
edit: even xenos
me no flamee...just stating.
i am sure the xenos understand--haha
What people also fail to realise is that the IMG aren't openly "Blast the BMM to jazzy and back". Its more of a company rivalry than anything, much less hostilities toward Bretonia.
"U want meh field?!"
"YA! I want ur field!"
"U no geet meh field! This are meh field!"
"O teh noez!"
The IMG even have a base on a trade lane in Cambridge. Somehow I doubt that its anything more than "don't throw you trash in my back yard, my back yard's full" attitude, especially with a Bretonian battleship just one lane away ready to clear out the IMG if they start destroying Bretonia's prime resource assets.
The IMG are the IMG because BMM exploits the workers. As one rumor says, "My brother works for the BMM. Man, I'd never work for them. They work their people to death and when you collapse they dock your pay for sleeping on the job." Or something along those lines.
Just clearing up the common misconception that IMG is openly hostile to Bretonia.
Now, for the Pirate in the IMG GB... No. Please no. As has been stated, we're lawful. We have Falkland to protect from the hordes of Outcasts pouring out from Alpha and we probably wont sell some indy pirate a GB so he can tax anything with a cargo ship. Truly the idea of neutral pirate is rubbish. It just gives people an excuse to bum-rape anything that flies by for 2 mill or 500K or whatever fee you charge regardless of affiliation. So please, pick a side.
... Do any of the people posting here even HAVE an IMG character? O.o