Discovery Gaming Community

Does anyone know the reason for this annoying side-to-side movement of larger ships when you hit F2 or F3? Is there a solution to it when creating new ship?

This has been the case since time immemorial. I have no idea what causes it, but I suspect if fixing it were a possibility it would've been fixed long ago. Even if it can be, we have much higher priorities code wise at the moment.

Isn't it to help with auto pilot through asteroid fields since the ship can wiggle between them?

(04-28-2018, 04:32 PM)Durandal Wrote: [ -> ]This has been the case since time immemorial. I have no idea what causes it, but I suspect if fixing it were a possibility it would've been fixed long ago. Even if it can be, we have much higher priorities code wise at the moment.

If it is related to ship file, then I am interested due to prospect of unique faction ships that might overcome this issue.
If it is global issue, then yeah, I feel you.

If it was related to a ship file, the solution would be to fix them all.

It's global. I vaguely recall something about it being worse the further from the centre of the system you are, but it comes with Freelancer and is yet to be solved.

You can try make analysis of ship files which have this issue and ships which not. Im know, bison and jormungard have this, while pilgrim (his model even longer than bison) and bustard dont.

The Neph does it as well I just scroll the mouse wheel and the ship stops the bob and weave. It has to do with the larger ships the length and the center point of the ship that causes it. You do not see the course corrections on the much smaller ship because it does not have that canter lever . The problem is also evident on the mod I been working on I have a super dread that bobs up and down if I put it in auto cruise to a way point much in the same way the Neph does.

I remember looking into this a long time ago.

I believe the problem is in steering, inertia, mass ratios. I played with them a bit.
Since I do not fly caps much, Im not sure how much it will mess up other things and overall balance.

Ship config is in:
c:\Games\Freelancer Discovery\DATA\SHIPS\shiparch.ini
Some info about it: https://discoverygc.com/forums/showthrea...pid1262536

This is the part I believe affecting movement:
Example is original nickname = dsy_munificent (Nephilim)

I changed rotation_inertia to match steering_torque and it looks like it helped a lot.


P.S.: Remember to test things in Single Player mode and on a different copy of Freelancer. Make backups before messing with files.
P.P.S.: If you could provide examples of caps, that do wobble and those that do not, it would help in further testing.

I notice that this only happen to some of my ships , more specificly , ships that i have transfered in some way or another (from another player or from my other accaunt) , it never happened to ships that i originaly purchased and i DID NOT transfered them in any way (For example , it never happened to my former Atlantis which i purchased in Washington shipyard straight after restart and i never transfered it anywere ).

(04-28-2018, 10:02 PM)ronillon Wrote: [ -> ]I remember looking into this a long time ago.

I believe the problem is in steering, inertia, mass ratios. I played with them a bit.
Since I do not fly caps much, Im not sure how much it will mess up other things and overall balance.

Ship config is in:
c:\Games\Freelancer Discovery\DATA\SHIPS\shiparch.ini
Some info about it: https://discoverygc.com/forums/showthrea...pid1262536

This is the part I believe affecting movement:
Example is original nickname = dsy_munificent (Nephilim)

Code:

linear_drag = 1.000000
mass = 25000.000000
steering_torque = 4200000000.000000, 3600000000.000000, 4200000000.000000
angular_drag = 25000000000.000000, 25000000000.000000, 25000000000.000000
rotation_inertia = 900000000.000000, 900000000.000000, 900000000.000000
nudge_force = 3000000.000000
strafe_force = 1000000
strafe_power_usage = 2

I changed rotation_inertia to match steering_torque and it looks like it helped a lot.

Nephilim original

Code:

[Ship]
ids_name = 500548
ids_info = 500549
ids_info1 = 500550
ids_info2 = 458753
ids_info3 = 500551
nickname = dsy_munificent
ship_class = 18
type = FREIGHTER
mission_property = can_use_large_moors
LODranges = 0, 20000
msg_id_prefix = gcs_refer_shiparch_Breb
DA_archetype = ships\discovery\jinx\dsy_zonerdread_mk3.cmp
material_library = ships\discovery\jinx\dsy_zonerdread_mk3.mat
material_library = fx\envmapbasic.mat
envmap_material = envmapbasic
cockpit = cockpits\discovery\munificent.ini
max_bank_angle = 15
camera_offset = 115, 710
camera_angular_acceleration = 0.050000
camera_horizontal_turn_angle = 23
camera_vertical_turn_up_angle = 5
camera_vertical_turn_down_angle = 30
camera_turn_look_ahead_slerp_amount = 1.000000
pilot_mesh = generic_pilot
nanobot_limit = 0
shield_battery_limit = 2100
hit_pts = 2950000
hold_size = 1700
explosion_arch = dsy_generic_capital_explosion
surface_hit_effects = 0, small_hull_hit_light01, small_hull_hit_light02, small_hull_hit_light03
surface_hit_effects = 10000, small_hull_hit_medium01, small_hull_hit_medium02, small_hull_hit_medium03
surface_hit_effects = 100000, small_hull_hit_heavy01, small_hull_hit_heavy02, small_hull_hit_heavy03
bay_door_anim = Sc_open baydoor
bay_doors_open_snd = cargo_doors_open
bay_doors_close_snd = cargo_doors_close
HP_bay_surface = HpBayDoor01
HP_bay_external = HpBayDoor02
num_exhaust_nozzles = 10
shield_link = bigship_shield_600m, HpMount, HpShield01
HP_tractor_source = HpTractor_Source01
fuse = dsy_battleship_death_player_fuse, 0.000000, 1
fuse = intermed_damage_train01, 0.000000, 2625
fuse = intermed_damage_train02, 0.000000, 1313
hp_type = hp_turret_special_8, HpTurret13, HpTurret14, HpTurret15, HpTurret16
hp_type = hp_turret_special_9, HpTurret17, HpTurret18, HpTurret21, HpTurret22
hp_type = hp_turret_special_10, HpTurret01, HpTurret02, HpTurret03, HpTurret04, HpTurret05, HpTurret06, HpTurret07, HpTurret08, HpTurret09, HpTurret10, HpTurret11, HpTurret12, HpTurret19, HpTurret20
hp_type = hp_countermeasure_dropper, HpCM01
hp_type = hp_freighter_shield_special_2, HpShield01
hp_type = hp_freighter_shield_special_10, HpShield01
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_3, HpSpecialEquipment04
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_2, HpSpecialEquipment05
linear_drag = 1.000000
mass = 25000.000000
steering_torque = 4200000000.000000, 3600000000.000000, 4200000000.000000
angular_drag = 25000000000.000000, 25000000000.000000, 25000000000.000000
rotation_inertia = 900000000.000000, 900000000.000000, 900000000.000000
nudge_force = 3000000.000000
strafe_force = 1000000
strafe_power_usage = 2
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_1, HpSpecialEquipment01, HpSpecialEquipment02, HpSpecialEquipment03
hp_type = hp_fighter_shield_special_1, HpDockingBay01, HpDockingBay02
explosion_resistance = 1.0
[CollisionGroup]
explosion_resistance = 0.000000
obj = dsy_dummy_group
separable = true
parent_impulse = 0.000000
child_impulse = 0.000000
fuse = dsy_battleship_death_player_fuse, 0.000000, 1
mass = 0.000000
hit_pts = 10
root_health_proxy = false

Nephilim altered

Code:

[Ship]
ids_name = 500548
ids_info = 500549
ids_info1 = 500550
ids_info2 = 458753
ids_info3 = 500551
nickname = dsy_munificent
ship_class = 18
type = FREIGHTER
mission_property = can_use_large_moors
LODranges = 0, 20000
msg_id_prefix = gcs_refer_shiparch_Breb
DA_archetype = ships\discovery\jinx\dsy_zonerdread_mk3.cmp
material_library = ships\discovery\jinx\dsy_zonerdread_mk3.mat
material_library = fx\envmapbasic.mat
envmap_material = envmapbasic
cockpit = cockpits\discovery\munificent.ini
max_bank_angle = 15
camera_offset = 115, 710
camera_angular_acceleration = 0.050000
camera_horizontal_turn_angle = 23
camera_vertical_turn_up_angle = 5
camera_vertical_turn_down_angle = 30
camera_turn_look_ahead_slerp_amount = 1.000000
pilot_mesh = generic_pilot
nanobot_limit = 0
shield_battery_limit = 2100
hit_pts = 2950000
hold_size = 1700
explosion_arch = dsy_generic_capital_explosion
surface_hit_effects = 0, small_hull_hit_light01, small_hull_hit_light02, small_hull_hit_light03
surface_hit_effects = 10000, small_hull_hit_medium01, small_hull_hit_medium02, small_hull_hit_medium03
surface_hit_effects = 100000, small_hull_hit_heavy01, small_hull_hit_heavy02, small_hull_hit_heavy03
bay_door_anim = Sc_open baydoor
bay_doors_open_snd = cargo_doors_open
bay_doors_close_snd = cargo_doors_close
HP_bay_surface = HpBayDoor01
HP_bay_external = HpBayDoor02
num_exhaust_nozzles = 10
shield_link = bigship_shield_600m, HpMount, HpShield01
HP_tractor_source = HpTractor_Source01
fuse = dsy_battleship_death_player_fuse, 0.000000, 1
fuse = intermed_damage_train01, 0.000000, 2625
fuse = intermed_damage_train02, 0.000000, 1313
hp_type = hp_turret_special_8, HpTurret13, HpTurret14, HpTurret15, HpTurret16
hp_type = hp_turret_special_9, HpTurret17, HpTurret18, HpTurret21, HpTurret22
hp_type = hp_turret_special_10, HpTurret01, HpTurret02, HpTurret03, HpTurret04, HpTurret05, HpTurret06, HpTurret07, HpTurret08, HpTurret09, HpTurret10, HpTurret11, HpTurret12, HpTurret19, HpTurret20
hp_type = hp_countermeasure_dropper, HpCM01
hp_type = hp_freighter_shield_special_2, HpShield01
hp_type = hp_freighter_shield_special_10, HpShield01
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_3, HpSpecialEquipment04
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_2, HpSpecialEquipment05
linear_drag = 1.000000
mass = 25000.000000
steering_torque = 4200000000.000000, 3600000000.000000, 4200000000.000000
angular_drag = 25000000000.000000, 25000000000.000000, 25000000000.000000
rotation_inertia = 4200000000.000000, 3600000000.000000, 4200000000.000000
nudge_force = 3000000.000000
strafe_force = 1000000
strafe_power_usage = 2
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_1, HpSpecialEquipment01, HpSpecialEquipment02, HpSpecialEquipment03
hp_type = hp_fighter_shield_special_1, HpDockingBay01, HpDockingBay02
explosion_resistance = 1.0
[CollisionGroup]
explosion_resistance = 0.000000
obj = dsy_dummy_group
separable = true
parent_impulse = 0.000000
child_impulse = 0.000000
fuse = dsy_battleship_death_player_fuse, 0.000000, 1
mass = 0.000000
hit_pts = 10
root_health_proxy = false

Atlantis original

Code:

[Ship]
ids_name = 500813
ids_info = 500814
ids_info1 = 500815
ids_info2 = 458753
ids_info3 = 500816
nickname = dsy_providence
ship_class = 17
type = FREIGHTER
mission_property = can_use_large_moors
LODranges = 0, 20000
msg_id_prefix = gcs_refer_shiparch_Libb
DA_archetype = ships\discovery\massdriver\dsy_libcarrier.cmp
material_library = ships\discovery\massdriver\dsy_libcarrier.mat
material_library = fx\envmapbasic.mat
envmap_material = envmapbasic
cockpit = cockpits\discovery\li_carrier.ini
max_bank_angle = 15
camera_offset = 112, 610
camera_angular_acceleration = 0.050000
camera_horizontal_turn_angle = 23
camera_vertical_turn_up_angle = 5
camera_vertical_turn_down_angle = 30
camera_turn_look_ahead_slerp_amount = 1.000000
pilot_mesh = generic_pilot
nanobot_limit = 0
shield_battery_limit = 1600
hit_pts = 1900000
hold_size = 1800
explosion_arch = dsy_liberty_capital_explosion
surface_hit_effects = 0, small_hull_hit_light01, small_hull_hit_light02, small_hull_hit_light03
surface_hit_effects = 10000, small_hull_hit_medium01, small_hull_hit_medium02, small_hull_hit_medium03
surface_hit_effects = 100000, small_hull_hit_heavy01, small_hull_hit_heavy02, small_hull_hit_heavy03
bay_door_anim = Sc_open baydoor
bay_doors_open_snd = cargo_doors_open
bay_doors_close_snd = cargo_doors_close
HP_bay_surface = HpBayDoor01
HP_bay_external = HpBayDoor02
num_exhaust_nozzles = 3
shield_link = bigship_shield_400m, HpMount, HpShield01
HP_tractor_source = HpTractor_Source01
fuse = dsy_battleship_death_player_fuse, 0.000000, 1
fuse = intermed_damage_train01, 0.000000, 2625
fuse = intermed_damage_train02, 0.000000, 1313
hp_type = hp_turret_special_8, HpTurret03, HpTurret04
hp_type = hp_turret_special_9, HpTurret06, HpTurret07, HpTurret11, HpTurret12
hp_type = hp_turret_special_10, HpTurret01, HpTurret02, HpTurret05, HpTurret08, HpTurret09, HpTurret10, HpTurret13, HpTurret14, HpTurret15, HpTurret16, HpTurret17, HpTurret18, HpTurret19, HpTurret20, HpTurret21, HpTurret22, HpTurret23, HpTurret24, HpTurret25, HpTurret26, HpTurret27
hp_type = hp_countermeasure_dropper, HpCM01
hp_type = hp_freighter_shield_special_2, HpShield01
hp_type = hp_freighter_shield_special_10, HpShield01
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_3, HpSpecialEquipment04
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_2, HpSpecialEquipment05
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_1, HpSpecialEquipment01, HpSpecialEquipment02
hp_type = hp_fighter_shield_special_1, HpDockingBay01, HpDockingBay02, HpDockingBay03, HpDockingBay04
hp_type = hp_fighter_shield_special_2, HpDockingBay01, HpDockingBay02
hp_type = hp_fighter_shield_special_5, HpDockingBay01
linear_drag = 1.000000
mass = 15000.000000
steering_torque = 4000000000.000000, 4500000000.000000, 500000000.000000
angular_drag = 25000000000.000000, 25000000000.000000, 2500000000.000000
rotation_inertia = 1000000000.000000, 1000000000.000000, 200000000.000000
nudge_force = 3000000.000000
strafe_force = 1000000
strafe_power_usage = 2
explosion_resistance = 1.0
[CollisionGroup]
explosion_resistance = 0.000000
obj = dsy_dummy_group
separable = true
parent_impulse = 0.000000
child_impulse = 0.000000
fuse = dsy_battleship_death_player_fuse, 0.000000, 1
mass = 0.000000
hit_pts = 10
root_health_proxy = false

Atlantis altered

Code:

[Ship]
ids_name = 500813
ids_info = 500814
ids_info1 = 500815
ids_info2 = 458753
ids_info3 = 500816
nickname = dsy_providence
ship_class = 17
type = FREIGHTER
mission_property = can_use_large_moors
LODranges = 0, 20000
msg_id_prefix = gcs_refer_shiparch_Libb
DA_archetype = ships\discovery\massdriver\dsy_libcarrier.cmp
material_library = ships\discovery\massdriver\dsy_libcarrier.mat
material_library = fx\envmapbasic.mat
envmap_material = envmapbasic
cockpit = cockpits\discovery\li_carrier.ini
max_bank_angle = 15
camera_offset = 112, 610
camera_angular_acceleration = 0.050000
camera_horizontal_turn_angle = 23
camera_vertical_turn_up_angle = 5
camera_vertical_turn_down_angle = 30
camera_turn_look_ahead_slerp_amount = 1.000000
pilot_mesh = generic_pilot
nanobot_limit = 0
shield_battery_limit = 1600
hit_pts = 1900000
hold_size = 1800
explosion_arch = dsy_liberty_capital_explosion
surface_hit_effects = 0, small_hull_hit_light01, small_hull_hit_light02, small_hull_hit_light03
surface_hit_effects = 10000, small_hull_hit_medium01, small_hull_hit_medium02, small_hull_hit_medium03
surface_hit_effects = 100000, small_hull_hit_heavy01, small_hull_hit_heavy02, small_hull_hit_heavy03
bay_door_anim = Sc_open baydoor
bay_doors_open_snd = cargo_doors_open
bay_doors_close_snd = cargo_doors_close
HP_bay_surface = HpBayDoor01
HP_bay_external = HpBayDoor02
num_exhaust_nozzles = 3
shield_link = bigship_shield_400m, HpMount, HpShield01
HP_tractor_source = HpTractor_Source01
fuse = dsy_battleship_death_player_fuse, 0.000000, 1
fuse = intermed_damage_train01, 0.000000, 2625
fuse = intermed_damage_train02, 0.000000, 1313
hp_type = hp_turret_special_8, HpTurret03, HpTurret04
hp_type = hp_turret_special_9, HpTurret06, HpTurret07, HpTurret11, HpTurret12
hp_type = hp_turret_special_10, HpTurret01, HpTurret02, HpTurret05, HpTurret08, HpTurret09, HpTurret10, HpTurret13, HpTurret14, HpTurret15, HpTurret16, HpTurret17, HpTurret18, HpTurret19, HpTurret20, HpTurret21, HpTurret22, HpTurret23, HpTurret24, HpTurret25, HpTurret26, HpTurret27
hp_type = hp_countermeasure_dropper, HpCM01
hp_type = hp_freighter_shield_special_2, HpShield01
hp_type = hp_freighter_shield_special_10, HpShield01
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_3, HpSpecialEquipment04
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_2, HpSpecialEquipment05
hp_type = hp_elite_shield_special_1, HpSpecialEquipment01, HpSpecialEquipment02
hp_type = hp_fighter_shield_special_1, HpDockingBay01, HpDockingBay02, HpDockingBay03, HpDockingBay04
hp_type = hp_fighter_shield_special_2, HpDockingBay01, HpDockingBay02
hp_type = hp_fighter_shield_special_5, HpDockingBay01
linear_drag = 1.000000
mass = 15000.000000
steering_torque = 4000000000.000000, 4500000000.000000, 500000000.000000
angular_drag = 25000000000.000000, 25000000000.000000, 2500000000.000000
rotation_inertia = 4000000000.000000, 4500000000.000000, 500000000.000000
nudge_force = 3000000.000000
strafe_force = 1000000
strafe_power_usage = 2
explosion_resistance = 1.0
[CollisionGroup]
explosion_resistance = 0.000000
obj = dsy_dummy_group
separable = true
parent_impulse = 0.000000
child_impulse = 0.000000
fuse = dsy_battleship_death_player_fuse, 0.000000, 1
mass = 0.000000
hit_pts = 10
root_health_proxy = false

P.S.: Remember to test things in Single Player mode and on a different copy of Freelancer. Make backups before messing with files.
P.P.S.: If you could provide examples of caps, that do wobble and those that do not, it would help in further testing.

The reason this 'helped' is because rotation inertia defines the time it takes for your ship to reach max speed in a turn, often known as response time or reaction time, which is a major part of balance. Changing those values around is not a feasible solution.