Vigilante ID:
1. Cannot fulfill bounty contracts.
2. Cannot trade or escort traders.
3. Must display a faction affiliation.
4. Can only attack enemies of the faction affiliation the vigilante is displaying.
5. Cannot demand credits or cargo, but may attack transports.
6. May not dock on any unlawful, Police or Navy bases.
A vigilante is a private individual who legally or illegally punishes an alleged lawbreaker, or participates in a group which metes out extralegal punishment to an alleged lawbreaker. -Wikipedia
I am not trying to be rude or clever here with this, but it says that a vigilante isn't a faction's fighter stripped off of the advantages of that faction, or a merc that works for free who also hired himself.
I try to find an ID that will allow me to shoot slavers, while keeping me independent and somewhat lawful, because it is a lawful action after all. The old Vigilante ID allowed me to do that, and I was so happy with it. It was also one of the rarest IDs, you would never see enough people with that ID, it had many restrictions and barely enough places allowing you to dock. But it just felt right for me. Right now though, I can't seem to shoot a slaver and be independent without making myself a Pirate. Because it looks like Vigilante can't attack transports for their unlawful cargo anymore.
Will getting that faction's IFF allow me to shoot that faction's enemies, and also those that carry contraband according to that faction? Which sounds very unlikely because of that "5. Cannot demand credits or cargo, but may attack transports."
I thought about getting an IMG IFF as they have influence in Taus where I like to operate. Their enemies are Outcasts and BMM, but that meant that I could only stop slaver transports with Outcast ID and only for the purpose of killing them. Most of those slavers and smugglers have Freelancer Smuggler ID, Freelancer Slaver ID, and Junker ID. There is no lawful faction listing Junkers as their enemies, or other named IDs. Even if they were listed, this new vigilante would shoot them for being a Junker for example, not because they were holding unlawful cargo.
It just looks like Vigilante ID has become something for shooting people not because of their actions (like slavery, piracy, smuggling) but because of their affiliations, which just doesn't fit the theme.
Yes you are right.
The new Vigi ID is just PvP ID. I dont see any RP on it.
It was less used in 4.85 and now, its gonna be unused.
Everybody will better use faction ID, Freelancer or Merc ID, but still its not gonna be the same.
One good way of RP is gone.
Actually, that list makes a bit of sense. Only part I don't understand is why it can't do bounties. Other than that.....
Vigilantes always have a group of people they are protecting...that's the faction IFF.
Vigilantes aren't bodyguards, so it explains the no escorting traders bit.
Vigilantes aren't traders, except maybe if they have a dual life, and the mechanics and rules of Disco wont' allow that.
Vigilantes don't pirate, they may attack corrupt corporations to punish them, but they don't take the money. The money goes to the victims.
Vigilantes are only after the badguys attacking his/her specific clan/family/nation/city, hence the clause about attacking only the factions enemies.
There is plenty to roleplay with there. It's not what you are used to, and it sets more restrictions while at the same time opening up possibilities that were not allowed before, but there is plenty to role play with there.
As for the RP part I have to agree. Shooting a transport without placing a demand to drop contraband is...well...questionable. I couldn't think of some other reasons to shoot slaver ships, for example, than the hatred against them inRP. Or just bad experience or whatever. To see it from a neutral point, where emotions wouldn't play an important role, there would be no reason for shooting them if the transport loaded slaves. Maybe just to free them from that ship but that sounds a bit illogical. Shooting a ship to free slaves even with losses while maybe having the chance to get all of them 'healthy' and not scorched is kinda more than illogical. InRP the characters would seem stupid in my opinion. Some guy who drank too much and is then not knowing what he is doing exactly. Doesn't make sense for me to be honest.
And well...Vigilante ID making more for combat purposes...hmm, okay. A person who is trying to clear things up in Sirius with trying to help or whatever will have to fight a lot, yeah. Maybe more than others because they are operating almost everywhere in Sirius. But...like already mentioned above, the RP is missing. Sometimes the things about justice and so on also could be done by talking than by destruction. I like RP mixed with PvP more than PvP mixed with RP and just PvP. There are a lot of fights, and I think they are satisfying sufficiently so that there is still the wish for RPing, at least in my case. So why pulling off the chance to RP more...if there are so awesome possibilities to use that?
Also...I wouldn't understand why a Vigilante, who got the IMG IFF and is shooting the IMG's enemies only and so on shouldn't join the IMG completely then. Vigilante requires more freedom I think, at least in my opinion. Since I am not aware that Vigilante who are thinking they are doing the right thing, not for the affiliated faction but for 'taking care' of others and themselves. Not to make them dependend would be important imho. Without it they easily could buy the IMG ID and then doing the same...
Bottom line on the "can't demand cargo or credits" is that vigilantes may not profit from their actions . If they do they would be pirates. I don't see the issue with slavers to be honest - slavers or people carrying slaves are enemies of nearly all lawful factions. Just demand they release their entire cargohold at the nearest base and blow em up when they don't comply.
Adding in a "may demand contraband" is a problem since vigilantes tend to make up themselves what they consider contraband. It's a pain in the rear to set that on an unaffiliated ID.
' Wrote:Bottom line on the "can't demand cargo or credits" is that vigilantes may not profit from their actions . If they do they would be pirates. I don't see the issue with slavers to be honest - slavers or people carrying slaves are enemies of nearly all lawful factions. Just demand they release their entire cargohold at the nearest base and blow em up when they don't comply.
Adding in a "may demand contraband" is a problem since vigilantes tend to make up themselves what they consider contraband. It's a pain in the rear to set that on an unaffiliated ID.
What if vigilantes blow up a slaver and then wish to bring the slaves in the...cages / pods / wooden boxes / whatever to the nearest station to set them free? Of course the players selling them would make profits, but you can't say that dumping a bunch of freed slavers on a freeport is OORP, as a vigilante. You're supposed to be a lone fighter for in the name of justice, after all.
And really, most slavers / traders would rather try to make a getaway instead of dropping their entire load. It'd nullify their profits either way. Yes sure, it would make more sense to drop your cargo in a inRp manner, but to be honest, most traders / slavers I see try to pull a hardcore getaway instead of that. Since, as mentioned before, they'd lose their profit either way.
Yes, actual vigilantes would pick what is contraband and what is not as they see fit, but a vigilante is a person that takes law in his own hands in the first place. May that be by "bending" existing laws a bit or by following the laws of the houses, but trying to execute those laws on his own behalf. For stuff like that, it'd make sense to me to add a line of "a vigilante may or may not view certain illegal cargo as contraband." But that isn't exactly the point here, for now.
Furthermore, I agree with the other posts above me, except for the one I quoted above.
"With the current vigilante ID, a vigilante isn't anything more than a merc that works for free who also hired himself." pretty much sums it up to me.
You're better off joining the faction, being a merc or maybe even a pirate.
' Wrote: vigilantes may not profit from their actions .
Thats not a profit.
If you think it is, then why they dont make Slaves to be sold for 0-credits in other bases?(FP etc)
problem solved..
' Wrote:Thats not a profit.
If you think it is, then why they dont make Slaves to be sold for 0-credits in other bases?(FP etc)
problem solved..
That might actually be a way to solve that problem of "a vigilante may not profit from his actions", having slaves raking in 0 credits on freeports and lawful bases, with a few exceptions. Maybe.
Freeports generally only give you a piece of dried bread for a hold full of slaves so far anyway, having them give you 0 credits wouldn't make that much of a difference. That is, if vigilantes return to only being able to dock on freeports and img bases.
Problem with that is that we'd need to rely on player honesty to sell those things at those bases. Past experience tells us not to rely on players in that way.
If you'd rather be a merc, then be a merc. Vigilante has one advantage over mercs: You don't need an employer or standing bounty in order to attack your targets.
So does this mean that Vigilantes are no longer subject to 6.6?