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+--- Thread: Zero G Construction (/showthread.php?tid=3032)
Zero G Construction - Jack Archer - 06-07-2007
So I had an Idea to put out there for the RP server. I was on a server not long ago where you could get a base put in the mod, but you would have to do some stuff for it. this would be:
Buying Property
- buy legaly the space for the Base For Eg. Wikes Ice Field in the Omega of off Cambridge
Down Payment
- For The Company to start store the Equipment and materials to build the base
Materials Shipping.
- Ship all materails need for a base (for eg. 10000 untis of Basic Alloys, 2500 untis of Constrution Machinery etc.)
- this could either be done by one person or Shipping companies or freelancers could be contracted to haul the Cargo for so much a run.
- This would be supervised by a Faction, It was Zero G for us, and they would tell the Modders when the shipping was done
Final Payment
- Final Payment of ALL costs
The prices and goods would have to be pre set. I'm just suggesting the Idea but it would make for excellent RP since Shipping comapanies (IND for example) would be shipping for a reason, not just to make money
Zero G Construction - Dab - 06-07-2007
I like this idea.. I've suggested things like it in the past actually.. I'd be willing to make the bases being bought, since I won't have time this summer to take active jobs modding guard or non-guard systems. But adding a base, and some other few things I can do.
Zero G Construction - Panzer - 06-07-2007
Oh, yeah, I don't like it, I LOVE it
Will fit IMG ideally, remote bases in distant parts, yummie. Matter of making this work like clockwork.
1st: deterring price, for big clans only. 2nd: sizeable prospective profits.
I'd also add maintenance costs. Not too high, but constant and requiring attention. If a group fails to satisfy these costs, the base becomes inoperable. Abandoned. Later, anyone wishing to use it (anyone may) has to pay 50% the construction costs to get it back up.
These bases would need to be goods prodcers/dropoff points, elements of trade routes to make their construction worthwile.
What else could be done?
Not only bases, but trade lanes and jumpgates as well. Oh my, so may possibilities, this could really turn into an RTS.
Buyin a base, setting up goods production, commencing ship construction, upgrading the base to accomodate more production facilities... That much cash for an eagle fighter assembly line, that much for Albatros cruisers...
Goods price reduction/raise would also require a base upgrade...
And finally there would be more business in the empty systems. Disco may get much richer with this.
Zero G Construction - Eppy - 06-07-2007
I like it, too. However, ther should be limits-I don't think maintenance fees are a good idea, either. Factions should only be allowed to own a certain number of depots.
Zero G Construction - Yngen - 06-07-2007
very cool
Considerations should be made in where factions can build these bases.
You mentioned a base at the Omega 5 hole...no doubt to make it really easy to pirate the most popular trade route in the game. I would think it only appropriate to have a corsair or BHG base there. You also have to consider that systems like Cambridge might be owned by other player factions, like the SF. You would have to gain permission from that faction to build a base in their home system. Reasonable locations, ones within your NPC-affiliated faction's zone of influence, could be fun.
I'm curious though, if the base maintanence requirement is implimented, what happens when the faction fails to pay its base bills? The modders would then have to go back into the mod and remove the base, right? That could get complicated for our busy admins.
Zero G Construction - Eppy - 06-07-2007
It'd be virtually impossible to enforce. It would require them to issue a new version of the mod every time a faction fogets to pay their bills. That's why that part won't work.
Zero G Construction - Vaporlinx - 06-07-2007
The closest thing to what ure talking abouts is something that was in 88flak ( i think thats the name). It had a commodity that you could buy that says you can land on certain predetermined bases. I never really messed with it all that much soo i dont know all the specifics. If the engine will allow you to keep an npc in place ( a construction ship for example) players could jettison the building materials near it, and it tractor them. once it has the necessary materials, it notifies one of the admins (igiss) that it has the materials (completed construction) . There does become a problem though, havening to re download the mod every time a base is completed. Perhaps if discovery's frameworks were more modular, say 3 or so files, one for added ships. one for added systems/bases, and one for all the other little things, it depends on how modular freelancers framework is, it may not be doable without a download client that gets the new(updated) files and installs them automatically.
Zero G Construction - Dab - 06-08-2007
I think some of you guys are misinterpreting.. These won't be 'faction' bases. There will be no BSG base. The only bases that could be described as such would be 'Phantom' bases, since Igiss made a faction called that, and one that follows the same pattern as the PC faction did and does.
Any bases that will be constructed will be NPC-faction aligned. Such as any AW-bought and built base (in which case, I mod it for free.:P) would be a Zoner base.
There would be a limit as someone said.
My idea would be a mixture of Yngen's ideas, Jack's, and Templar's. BTW, Vapor, we WOULD have to have a new DL for each base.. If Igiss were to do it that way. From past experience, I can tell you he won't. Basically a faction would pay for it, pay a modder to create it, (Bigger stations should require more commodities. I could set up a list of how much of what would be needed for each base. Just remember, the numbers will be VERY large.) and then transport the materials. Weapon platforms would take additional funds and materials. I don't think Trade Lanes would be a good idea though.. After this is all done, the modder would submit the code lines containing the information for the base and objects added around it to Igiss who would add it in the mod.. You'd see it next version, just like if it were a new system being modded.
Now.. This could go two ways depending on what Igiss decides, if he decides to allow it at all. One; new bases would be allowed in Vanilla and non-vanilla systems. Allows vanilla systems to get a bit of a build up with input from PC factions on how to build it up. This would add alot of new bases, ships, etc and just have the feel of Sirius growing and developing. Two; Igiss might allow it for only guard and post-4.80 systms (empty ones mostly). This would allow those system to build up without making it a big huge entire-system job like it is when a faction buys and builds up a system from scratch. Instead, factions add little things here and there, and it all comes together to make a new system, all mixed up like Vanilla systems are with different factions and their bases, put where they are, based on what they can afford, rather than just what the modder decides would look/feel good at a certain spot.
I also agree that bases should at least be in a faction's area of influence. You wouldn't abd don't see Liberty out in Sigmas, so SA wouldn't be able to construct new bases there. They could in Ontario, Virginia, etc. You DO see Junkers, Corsairs, Outcasts, and GMG out there in those Sigmas, so JOS, TBH, or GoR could build new stations out in the new empty Sigmas. In terms of Vanilla systems, it would be a bit of a combination. Same as above, you have to have some valid reason for being there, as Liberty wouldn't have a base in Bretonia.. But say it was a BMM faction buying a new base. They could make a deal, ask for permission from whoever's ZoI that system belongs to. So say BMM would ask SF if they could make a new base out in Leeds, in that minable asteroid field. Well SF could say okay, they would say that to the modder and the modder would begin the construction, as it would be legalized. But say SF wanted to be greedy. They could demand 200 million credits from BMM for the use of space. This would stack up with all the other costs.
So in all it would be; 200 million for 'construction' permits from SF. Say; 900 million for purchasing of the land (price could vary depending on mineral locations, NPCs, and demand). Then; 1.4 billion for the base itself. Another 200 million for the Weapon Platforms. BMM patrols would be added in automatically by the modder. Then BMM would have to pay something like; 100 million for military patrols, or 50 million for police patrols. To stop pirate NPCs, smugglers, help with PC pirates, and just general protection. (Outcast patrols and Corsair patrols for a base would be 50-150 million for LFs and HFs around the area [which is determined by the location in the galaxy. Higher-level patrols out in Omicrons, than in Bretonia] and then 150 - 250 million for VHF patrols.) Commodities would be entered by the modder, who would also decide how much everything would cost. That way a faction can't make a base and turn it into an ultra-trade route.
So all in all; the base costs for a fully made, weapon platform protect, police AND military patrols, with the construction permit and land payments would be: 200 + 900 + 1400 + 200 + 100 + 50 = 2.85 billion credits. This would be something for like a small sized base. Medium would be like 2 billion, and then large ones would be like 2.8 or 3. Shipyards would be extremely expensive, but have nice trade routes and sell capital ships. So something like 5 billion. With an entire faction trading and pooling money together, its possible. Obviously, its more expensive than just paying a modder to build a system straight up in an empty system. But thats only for your guard system. Or home system. Plus with this you can get bases put into vanilla systems and ones already owned by another faction. Since AW and HF are closely allied, it would be possible that we would allow them up in Omicron-74 (forget temporarily that they are Lane Hackers, this is just figurative and for an example). Well since AW already had that built as a home system, HF can't just pay a modder to mod it. HF already had a home system, so they couldn't pay for a new system to be constructed. They would be forced to build a station. Well AW isn't too greedy (again figurative...:P) and allows it for free. No construction permit fees. But still alot of money required. However, the pay off is having a base of their own in their allies home system. Lots of defence, a staging base they own, and where they wanted it. It would cost alot depending on the base, but it would be in a location it previously couldn't have been.
These prices are to keep factions from having the maximum number of new ones in just one version, or the maximum amount of new ones for each new version. I resort back to EVE examples here again. Outposts are near-invincible and untakable stations. You have to steal sovereignty in the system before you can take it. Sov is given and taken on the principles of POS. Player Owned Stations, or Starbases. The corporation or alliance with more Starbases (POS) in a system, usually gets sovereignty. Sometimes this is different, like if corp A has 15 large control towered POSs, and corp B has 25 small control towered POSs. The large towers are worth 3 small towers, both in cost, requirements, benefits, and sovereignty. Well. Outpost is around 30 billion ISK (Intersteller Kredits) to set up. Thats a rough equivilant of about 150 billion credits here. Thats right. 150 billion.. A small POS takes about 1-1.5 billion, depending on what kind of structures you put in it, and what kind of defenses you buy. Equvilant of about 5-7.5 billion credits in FL. Medium sized is about 3 billion. Large is around 10-15. Bare-bone (meaning not upgraded) Deathstars (equivilant of a very strong destroyable battleship) are about 6 billion. 5 billion FL credits are equal to 1 billion EVE ISK.
It takes alliances with corps in them that are multi-hundred member, and in some cases, multi-thousand member corps to get the kind of money to build these kind of things up, and still defend themselves, and attack others. Heck, BoB is roughly 5,000 members strong. They have about 50 Outposts, hundreds of POSs, and who knows how many upgraded deathstars. (NOT the Star Wars kind of DS..) All the while warring with a few other alliances. Now, they make about 2 Outposts in about 6 months.. They are fighting about 32 alliances, they have about 8 on their side. They are winning too.. But see here is my point. Even when they were not fighting 32 alliances, they only got enough for an Outpost every couple months. An Outpost every 2 months IF they did not work on buying a Titan or Motherships. Now say there is a corp with 500 members. It'll take them nearly 8 months for a single Outpost. With the kind of prices I'm offering, you can get a new base every month or 2, if you work at trading. Heck.. IND would have MANY stations.. But thats because they have about 12 traders who trade ALL THE TIME. -.- As you have noticed, they may have tons of money and trading ships, but their military isn't the equivilant of most factions here. So you can buy a base, or you can upgrade your military. But you aren't going to be able to do both without alot of hard work.
If Igiss gives the okay to start doing this, or at least to start planning and thinking of how to begin this and the facts needed to begin it, I'll work up lists of prices for everything. We'd need to find out if Admins would determine prices of locations, or the modders, or if the people who's ZoI it is located in decide, instead of just charging you to have permission to buy it.
Zero G Construction - Vaporlinx - 06-08-2007
Pfft downloading the whole mod would be well, a lot of waisted space, perhaps, just downloading the affected files (i dont know how many it is for stations and the like, but to add a mkII ship its 3 or so ini files) Id much rather download a megs worths of new data every week then the whole mod:P
It would also be nice if got a custom mod client ( to handle these downloads, and install them)
Zero G Construction - Qunitinius~Verginix - 06-08-2007
Wow, Dab, that would cost less to buy a god-damn system then to buy 1 base. What are your trying to frikking pull here?! NO ONE in their right mind would pay that kidna cash so they can have a landable asteriod in the middle of no-where. I like this idea, but what you are proposing seams a bit too much. Remember, this is not EVE, this is freelancer. BIG DIFFERENCE.
Now, I am seriously doubting that it would take a modder to go into say leeds, adn click in the middle of an asteroid feild and hit 'Place New Base' or whatever the button is in FLE and viola, there is your new base. It might take a bit longer to add in trade routs and stuff, but nothing compared to what you are talking about.
Verginix Out