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+---- Thread: Battle Razors.. (/showthread.php?tid=18505)
Battle Razors.. - Caribe - 03-28-2009
I'M wondering how the heck can you ONE shot kill something in this game. At least it SHOULD take TWO shots. One for the shield and one for the hull.
Battle Razors.. - Camtheman Of Freelancer4Ever - 03-28-2009
I am also trying to figure that out, the mechanics say you MUST take out the shield BEFORE hull.
Battle Razors.. - Jinx - 03-28-2009
ok - i have read the first 40 posts and the last 10 ...
battle razors:
they are the weapons of choice vs. ships of gunship / gunboat size. - by the sheer stats ( damage / speed ) they appear to be perfect weapons. - but they are by far the most inefficient weapons in the game ( that applies to the BATTLESHIP RAZORS )
the problem with cruisers is - cruiser powerplants range from 1.800.000 to 3.600.000.000 - thats twice as large in one shipclass.
if we applied that to the battleships - we d have small ones with 7.000.000 up to large ones with 14.000.000 energy - but there we "only" have 7.000.000 to 9.000.000. so one can see the trouble there. - razors for battleships are 100% balanced - razors on cruisers are a bugger - and that is why they do not have a speed of 1600 of course.
how to hit a bomber in a cruiser with a 800ms gun? - only when the bomber is coming really close .... the projectile size of the razor is as small as any other projectile ( except the flak, which is as large as a large transport ) - so at around 500-1000 range - a bomber is fairly SAFE from them.... provided he dodges a bit of course.
why was that done so?
bombers have an easy life - and thats a fact. - their main defense is their agility and size. capital ships need a whole lot more skill than bomberpilots to harm each other. - so of course a 280ms supernova has an easier time hitting a destroyer than a 800ms razor has hitting a bomber - that is - unless both ships were the same size and speed.
furthermore - a bomber can thrust to 200 and accelerate the SN to 480ms - the destroyer can practicly do the same with the razor 940ms - but due to its lower speed, thats of no great use for that matter.
a problem we got is that a battlecruiser can indeed basicly spam battlerazors - BUT - a battlecruiser is not a kusari destroyer. it is much much MUCH larger, slow like a tortoise and usually uses turret view vs. bombers instead of jousting them. a kusari destroyer however is fast - has a smaller powerplant and is harder to hit. - but it still takes a very good gunner to hit a bomber. and we don t want to punish high skill and blame it on the weapon ... when we award high skill on fighter classes instead of blaming it on the weapon... .
about a fight of 3 bombers vs. 1 kusari destroyer. - i m a bit at a loss there. - it hasn t worked to have one bomber play the bait and dodge while the other 2 sit behind the ku-destroyer and pick it apart? - it takes quite some coordination to work as a "team" but we also expect a capital ship to work like a team with escorts - just having 2 buddies with fighters doesn t make an escort after all - it takes coordination.
from what i read - i am not at all convinced that the razors need any second glance, nither gunboat, cruiser or battleship razors.
razors are weapons that have a steep learning curve on the already steep learning curve of capital ship weapons. - if someone is lucky - or very good with them - he gets rewarded with a good kill. ... . much like a good bomber pilot that once in a while gets rewarded with a supernova insta kill vs. a fighter.
i must admit though - i m not flying a cruiser / destroyer and i have only PvPed vs. a destroyer 2 times ( in a civi bomber with nova [ not supernova ] torp ) so far.
Battle Razors.. - Asgardian - 03-28-2009
Maybe the bomber pilots just weren't that good?:unsure:
Like Jinx said, the Razor turrets are quite inefficient; only being good against gunboats mainly. If you can snipe a damn bomber with it, you're just a damn good shot. If the bombers are silly enough to be within sniping distance, thats their fault.
Battle Razors.. - Rudo - 03-28-2009
' Wrote:I'M wondering how the heck can you ONE shot kill something in this game. At least it SHOULD take TWO shots. One for the shield and one for the hull.
Guess it was a 1-2 salvo, tightly grouped. Weapons grouping and a steady hand.
Think Mini Razor/SN 1-2 shots on bombers/fighters.
Battle Razors.. - Tenacity - 03-28-2009
I dunno if people here are playing with 0ms latency or what, but just as a comparison... 10 minutes ago I was testing weapons fire on my carrier against an order gunboat. The order gunboat, being one of the largest profile gunboats in the mod, should be fairly easy to hit.
I was shooting at him with 15 order cruiser turrets, which have 1000m/s speed - the fastest weapons available to us, solaris turrets aside.
At 500-800m range, I landed maybe one shot out of every five on him while he was actively dodging...
I have no idea how you guys are sniping bombers at 1k range with an even slower weapon, there's just no way.
Battle Razors.. - hribek - 03-28-2009
Ehh. Hitting NPC gunboats with Novas?
Now not hitting anything amall in your wannabe-light-carrier XXL Order Battlecruiser?
I honestly wonder what other extraordinary experience could be mentioned in such a flammable topic that just deserves to fall into the shadows of oblivion as a very bad joke?
*cracks whip*
Back to your ships!
P.S.: This really is a pointless discussion.
P.P.S.: If you want to post a balance-related topic because you just got owned by someone who actually knows how to use stuff, please get owned at least two more times to figure out if, by chance, you're not doing something wrong yourself.
Restecp. :yu:
Battle Razors.. - JakeSG - 03-28-2009
This forum rage is still going? I thought it might have finally died whilst my net was out.
Anyways, Eternal, I do hope that was sarcasm back around a dozen posts, else my sig applies. Yes! Let's nerf bombers so that the best torp they can obtain takes > 500 shots just to take down a unarmoured Battleship's hull, nevermind its shields! And if it has armour, we effectively multiply it by four as well!
Battle Razors.. - El Nino - 03-28-2009
Look here Dab... How tha hell did ku desy even turn around and joust your friend bomber is beyond me... Kusari Desy is a prime target for Nova torpedos, just hit it say 4 times and it's out of weapons... shields can be dealt via guns or SN... keep it CD'd at all times.
If that fails get a destroyer of your own, all you need is a set of primaries, 1 pulse cannon and 1 bretonian missile. Spamm the missile on every joust. You will be amazed how easy a target that tiny destroyer is.
And back to Battle Razor, If it's any slower it's useless for it's main task, that is fighting gunboats... and then again if it's used for bombers that's perfectly acceptable since you need 2 of them to hit, when the shieilds are down... I wonder why nobody complains about battleship battle razors that can 1-2 bombers and have a whooping 1600 speed?
Those are all while being primarily anti-gb weapons perfectly acceptable anti-bomber weapons, since some gb's are bomber sized and some bombers are gb sized... Learn to counter the destroyer with a proper ship, say a destroyer of your own... The smaller the target more vulnerable to missiles it is. So word of the day would be "NOVA".
Battle Razors.. - ... kur nubėgo? - 03-28-2009
In my opinion it realy do needs reduced speed.
Why? - gamma is now very often invated by BHG| ships. Well I saw a few succesuful insta kill gs models wich are made like insta sn killin bombers. Only theyr "sn" is much faster. Besides of their capability to shot down fighters they have advantage agiasnt caps as well as the Razor is anti cap turret !
I saw a few bombers insta killed by gb?s, gs?s myself. Truelly very strange.