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+--- Thread: Reasoning behind Eagle and Sabre nerf? (/showthread.php?tid=106631)
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RE: Reasoning behind Eagle and Sabre nerf? - Scumbag - 10-31-2013
Q Oh disaster, the precious ovepowered ships, oh, what did they do? What has disco come. Q
RE: Reasoning behind Eagle and Sabre nerf? - Black Widow - 10-31-2013
(10-31-2013, 03:20 AM)Coin Wrote:(10-31-2013, 12:19 AM)LunaticOnTheGrass Wrote: Honestly something that I feel makes some sense in regards to their nerf is how old the Sabre and Eagle lines are.
Both are still very viable, reliable ships, but as technology continues to improve in the colonies, the Eagle and Sabre might start to become outdated in the eyes of groups.
and sairs have to stick with the titan... slow, mine-sucking, energy-hungry gunned titan
Actually the Titan is buffed and for such a heavy fighter it out turns both eagle and sabre, which does not make sense?
For all the balancing devs tried to do, they actually screwed up the most basic fighter mechanics! Such nerfs are intentional as many here were QQing when for e.g the Eagle on Disco did have vanilla stats they were being pwned coz the eagle out turned everything and newb PVP'rs couldn't keep up.
Seems if you moan hard enough you can get anything nerfed, hence eagle has never been the same again.
RE: Reasoning behind Eagle and Sabre nerf? - aerelm - 10-31-2013
Nerfs are not supposed to be justifiable or even exist InRP. Meanwhile, Eagle was nerfed? That's news to me. Far as I know, it can no longer outturn light fighters, but has considerably more hull and a larger powercore. And the core nerf on the Sabre was so the other aspects of the ship can be buffed again. Consider it a drawback for having 7 forward firing guns.
Fixed that for you.
(10-31-2013, 03:20 AM)Coin Wrote: sairs choose to stick with the titan... scary, heavy-armored, forever-lasting cored titan
Fixed that for you.
RE: Reasoning behind Eagle and Sabre nerf? - Lythrilux - 10-31-2013
(10-31-2013, 08:25 AM)aerelm Wrote:Nerfs are not supposed to be justifiable or even exist InRP. Meanwhile, Eagle was nerfed? That's news to me. Far as I know, it can no longer outturn light fighters, but has considerably more hull and a larger powercore. And the core nerf on the Sabre was so the other aspects of the ship can be buffed again. Consider it a drawback for having 7 forward firing guns.
(10-31-2013, 03:20 AM)Coin Wrote: sairs choose to stick with the titan... scary, heavy-armored, forever-lasting cored titan
Fixed that for you.
It recived an agility nerfed that is hefty when combined with the eagles large size.
Eagles aren't very popular anymore due to that, though I'm sure things might change if it's wide model was replaced.
What other aspects on the sabre were buffed?
RE: Reasoning behind Eagle and Sabre nerf? - Syrus - 10-31-2013
I would guess the Eagle was nerfed because it outturned every VHF by far, could outturn most of the HFs and even some of the LFs, could use 7 guns to the sides if flown right and was pretty much the best VHF except maybe for the Sabre if you knew how to use the agility it had. Just my guess though.
Sabre ... 7 guns, hard to hit, good agility blah blah. There's a reason why the ship is one of the two most used ships.
It still retains its "hard to hit"-ability, almost even worse than before. Shots go through those holes by the dozen, especially MRs. Besides that it also got superior strafing now. Something that only three ships have. Not sure if that was an oversight or not tbh. Lower core is one thing ... the buffed agility and still being hard to hit (which is to be expected with that weird hull) means this thing is still a beast though.
So, while I see that the Eagle has obviously been nerfed, maybe a bit too much, but who knows, the Sabre is still in the upper regions of the list of the better ships.
RE: Reasoning behind Eagle and Sabre nerf? - aerelm - 10-31-2013
A "hefty" agility nerf which still puts it on top of the VHF agility list (Yes, there are a couple of VHFs slightly faster than the Eagle, but those are exceptions and are not considered "standard" case ships for obvious reasons). A papership with insane agility but considerably large hitbox (i.e. an ultimate "duel ship") despite not being technically broken balance-wise, is too specialized to fill the role of the "generic open to all all-arounder ship", which is why the stats on Eagle was adjusted to make it an actual generic fighter which can be used with every style and in every situation, while not being the "best" in any of the fields. So it's not really as much of a "nerf" as it's a "repurpose".
On the subject of the Sabre, nothing other than the powercore was touched for 87. Sabre has been overnerfed over and over with every mod version mainly due to its unusual hitbox full of holes and its forward firepower (And the broken strafing, needless to say). The late balance team was tryin to solve the issue by hammering its agility, but that was not the actual issue with the ship. Now that its forward firepower is somewhat adjusted with its new core, it can actually undergo a review and be rebalanced like a standard ship, without having to worry much about moving back toward the old sweet 85 Sabre.
So let's just put it this way - The current balance team no longer follows the "Don't fix what's been broken for too long" policy.
On the subject of the Sabre, nothing other than the powercore was touched for 87. Sabre has been overnerfed over and over with every mod version mainly due to its unusual hitbox full of holes and its forward firepower (And the broken strafing, needless to say). The late balance team was tryin to solve the issue by hammering its agility, but that was not the actual issue with the ship. Now that its forward firepower is somewhat adjusted with its new core, it can actually undergo a review and be rebalanced like a standard ship, without having to worry much about moving back toward the old sweet 85 Sabre.
So let's just put it this way - The current balance team no longer follows the "Don't fix what's been broken for too long" policy.
RE: Reasoning behind Eagle and Sabre nerf? - Govedo13 - 10-31-2013
In oder words R.I.P Eagle.
Saber wont be that bad because the increased DPS so the 7th gun would mean a bit more that would make up with the core nerf- still the few good PvPers with uber aim does not need core since they don't spray, the rest well....
I dare to say that both 4.86 Sabre and Eagle were perfect and needed no change, if the increased DPS buffed Sabre too much you could always downgrade the turret. The Eagle concept of yours is laughable, big ships does not last long in group fights, good example is Werewolf- ton of hull and bots but still huge side profile, slow Eagle means dead and useless Eagle. Dodging and agility are a way more important then any miserable 1000-2000 more hp or 5-10 bots more.
If I summarize it you made Sabre the said specific duel ship that used to be Eagle while killing Eagle in the process. As result practically we have one less VHF to choice,theoretically one can fly Virage or similar useless stuff if we count ships as numbers only.
Don't break what is not broken suits better.
RE: Reasoning behind Eagle and Sabre nerf? - Lythrilux - 10-31-2013
Sabre is... ehhh... The balance in 4.86 was fine, but I don't have any major problems with it now. However I wouldn't mind the powercore being swapped back.
The Eagle has lost it's place in my opinion. I like the logic in turning it into a generic all rounder, however as Govedo said it's way to big for such a role. A more perfect ship that fits the 'civilian all rounder' is the Ravens Talon. It has pretty rounded stats, to go along with a nice shape.
I find it a bit awkward though, that the eagle isn't fast. It's kinda implied by the name...