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+--- Thread: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF (/showthread.php?tid=130647)
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - Fluffyball - 06-16-2015
(06-16-2015, 02:56 PM)Alley Wrote:(06-16-2015, 02:50 PM)Fluffyball Wrote: I'm against that, alongside with very few people. Why? Pirate ID is already pretty restricted (generic stuff only) and Freelancer IFF is the only advantage of Pirate ID - as we said that as a fair trade for "undetectable" ship, unless scanned.
I'm telling you this: if someone was to choose between Pirate ID and Outcast ID, he or she would pick up Outcasts ID, because it sacrifices only Rheinland and gives way more options than Pirate ID in Sirius-wide piracy. You also shouldn't forget that Pirate ID clearly states that it can protect same-IFF ships and bases.
In short: forcing Pirate IFF will make that ID dead. If you are going to force IFF, allow pirates to pirate freely everywhere as it was before, without silly artificial restrictions.
You may end up limiting Outcast ID in the future, just saying.
I'm pretty sure there would be an ID rework if the IFF was forced on the Pirate ID. We could also provide a few Indie Pirate bases in sirius, but that sounds a little bit redundant as they can just dock on Freelancer bases.
That's why I'm saying it's kind of pointless to force such an IFF. If we are going to give that exact ID an IFF like that, why shouldn't we give Miner IFF for Miner ID?
As I wrote down already, Freelancer IFF is the only advantage of Pirate ID over the house pirates, especially when we take into account that Pirate ID is aleady underpowered and restricted inside House Space.
People will jump onto Outcast ID with Freelancer IFF, I can guarantee that.
BUT, keep in mind, if it was an optional IFF, I'm not against it.
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - SpaceTime - 06-16-2015
I support the new IFF with one condition.
That Pirate IFF should not be forced on you. So if you maximize your OC rep for example you can /droprep the Pirate IFF so that you adopt the Outcast IFF and thus be able to maintain some RP variation for your unlawful group/character.
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - Jessitrescott - 06-16-2015
well my suggestion is that he must have either a pirate iff or any unlawfull iff .
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - Fluffyball - 06-16-2015
(06-16-2015, 03:06 PM)Jessitrescott Wrote: well my suggestion is that he must have either a pirate iff or any unlawfull iff .
We could remove Pirate ID completely then. In our opinion, with Pirate ID being VERY limited nowadays, Freelancer IFF is the only thing that makes Pirate ID useful. The strong point of that ID is that it can't be really detected at the first glance AS they are just "bad" Freelancers.
Outcasts will be shot on sight, but Pirate, in the afar, won't be, unless something will be pretty suspicious. I mean, we aren't speaking about Pirate ID with Zoner IFF, what would be pretty scumbag, on what I can agree.
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - SpaceTime - 06-16-2015
Toris...
How is the Pirate ID limited when you have unlimited ZoI and the ability to create alliances with any unlawful groups that you want?
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - Fluffyball - 06-16-2015
(06-16-2015, 03:16 PM)SpaceTime Wrote: Toris...
How is the Pirate ID limited when you have unlimited ZoI and the ability to create alliances with any unlawful groups that you want?
Outcast ID has the very same ZOI, minus Gallia (but Gallic Borderworlds) and Rheinland. Additionally, you can't pirate anyone in the House Space on Pirate ID - but OC can attack literally anyone red for them except the transports. My opinion is: if we are going to force IFF, let's go back to the original lines on Pirate ID. Freelancer IFF makes Pirate ID a pretty interesting alternative to the "FLASHING ME I AM OC SHOOT ME" characters.
Just think about it in that way.
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - Binski - 06-16-2015
Well to me its 'archaic' almost to still think of the use of a Freelancer IFF in this situation as an 'abuse'. Its an IFF, a signal we 'broadcast'. Freelancer is neither friend nor foe, and most pirates choose on their own (as free unlawfuls) on how to broadcast. Its similar to a flag being flown. Why would it be impossible for a Pirate ID'd player to use a Freelancer IFF? I believe the option to have a Pirate IFF is AWESOME, yet to force players to change is a negative action. Many will prefer to broadcast as 'Pirates' on their own, like sporting a Pirate ID itself, its like flying an old 'jolly roger' flag.
However to force players, especially since the pirate ID is used for many to rp as generic unlawfuls, is more so an attempt to punish Pirate ID players (yet again) simply because the Freelancer IFF doesn't make it totally obvious what they are. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on ME. Meaning its not the end of the world if people learn the hard way a Freelancer IFF does not always mean you're safe. After the lesson is learned, people are weary and take responsibility for their own security. Thats life in Sirius, we've all played around the fact for years and its part of the lesson of how people learn to survive in the sector. This is why the game is great, its that immersive.
The option to have a Pirate IFF is a great addition. I see no need to add further restrictions. What happens if they choose to drop all IFF completely? No clues to friend or foe, so are we going to make it show an IFF no matter what? And in the end just to make trading all the more easier, and pirates all that much easier to avoid? After playing on the server for a short time, you realize you have to be careful no matter who you approach. People should not be looking to feel even more secure on their trading runs. With just as many oorp ways to track and avoid people using the chat list, forcing generic unlawfuls to drop the Freelancer IFF would basically be another nerf (which is not op, as most generic unlawfuls are indeed Freelance individuals anyways). Seeing it as an 'abuse' I think is a bad perspective on it, and traders that don't even want to have to work that hard to stay safe while flying should reconsider what they're doing. You should not always be able to see your potential enemies that easily, unless they want to be that overt. I think especially RP wise a pirate IFF will be a great option to have.
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - SpaceTime - 06-16-2015
Let's put aside Outcast and Corsairs, Toris. They are unique cases because of their sheer size.
The LWB ID or any other House unlawful group has a restricted ZoI, specified diplomacy and specified tech cells. Why would a LWB player be forced to have an IFF and a pirate ID'd group is not?
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - MÃmir - 06-16-2015
(06-16-2015, 02:28 PM)Alley Wrote: The reason this has been added is due to the constant abuse of the Freelancer IFF by numerous Pirate ID players. What we're not sure of is whether or not to force it on all Pirate ID players, as there are some people that genuinely play well using the Freelancer/others IFFs.
I submitted a practical SRP request to get the bleeding red Fugitive IFF or whatever for my indie pirate ages ago because I was tired of listening to allegations of "Freelancer IFF abuse", never got a reply and I even offered all the credits I had at the time and subsequently tried to start a discussion regarding the subject on the forum from the perspective of an indie pirate that just wants to pirate without people sending ridiculous // pm's.
I think it should be optional, and I'd like to know what you mean by abuse of the Freelancer IFF specifically? It's a widely used term, but I am not really sure it holds any meaning whatsoever.
Also I don't think polls are any good for this; I think you should just make a decision of your own; list the reasons why you came to that conclusion and be open for discussion during a trial period after seeing how things pan out.
RE: Poll: Independent Pirate IFF - Fluffyball - 06-16-2015
^ All what TheUnforgiven said.
Oh yes, regarding making alliances with bad guys:
Quote:2. All faction IDs are allowed to claim bounties within their zone of influence. Generic IDs are only allowed to claim bounties if clearly specified in the ID description.
Let's check Pirate ID.
Quote:Pilot carrying this unlawful ID is a Pirate, who:
- Can attack any ship in self-defense or to protect a ship of the same affiliation.
- Can demand cargo and credits from any ship, and attack them if they do not comply.
- Cannot use any transports with more than 3,600 cargo, except for the Pirate Train.
Allowed ships: Fighters, Freighters, Transports, Gunboats
Oh! They can't fulfill bounties! Yay...? And they can't ally with other unlawful groups as well.
And about Freelancer IFF abuse: What about Freelancers hired by unlawfuls, maybe even by the Pirate ID itself?