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+---- Thread: Supernovas! (/showthread.php?tid=8333)
Supernovas! - Treewyrm - 07-27-2008
' Wrote:It does 15k more damage for 10k more energy. Very ineffective, if you ask me.Did I tell already that refire and pp regen becomes more important then? Refire would hold it off still.
Supernovas! - chopper - 07-27-2008
Yes, I guess that refire could be a bit better for the Nomad one.
Supernovas! - Treewyrm - 07-27-2008
' Wrote:Yes, I guess that refire could be a bit better for the Nomad one.So that other SNs need refires added and taken into account with the stats of the respective bombers that are supposing to be used in conjunction with. Things are getting interesting now, eh? :-) Minimum refire rate would be calculated from pp regeneration rate and firing energy consumption. Any less would be held off by regen having no benefit in small refire rate. Works in reverse: small energy fingerprint would be held off by low refire. So they got to be adjusted accordingly to that.
Supernovas! - chopper - 07-27-2008
Not really, most of them are limited with energy consumption itself, refire has no meaning at all.
For example, Supernova as it is now spends some 38k energy when fired.
Snubnose regenerates 2400, Nomad bomber 2200.
Refire limits these so you can fire 1 SN each 6 seconds.
After you fire one with Snubnose, you are left with 20k of energy.
You need 7 seconds to fire it again, because that's how long it takes for energy to recharge from 20k to 38k.
Take Nomad bomber for example.
You fire a SN, and you are left with 10k. You need 13-14 seconds to recharge to 38k.
Take my example for Nomad SN.
Energy Usage - 31 000
So, when you fire, you are left with 17k of energy.
You need 9-10 seconds to regain energy to 38k.
Refire is meaningless.
If you increase regen rate, which won't happen, since it's balanced now, refire would get it's meaning.
Also, if you lower energy consumption to 20k, refire would get it's meaning again. But that won't happen too, because you would be able to fire 2 of these.
Energy consumption shouldn't go bellow 30k, and everything above 30k makes refire useless.
I hope I managed to explain it somehow, I'm bad with these phrases.:)
Supernovas! - globalplayer-svk - 07-27-2008
only one thing, increasing damage of sn, will make bombers uber against capital ships, now can 2 bombers kill bs ( good bomber pilots) with this increasing, can one bomber pilot kill cruiser alone.
Supernovas! - chopper - 07-27-2008
True.
And that's why I support Jinx's view about leaving all the same.
Some weapons are meant to be the same for everyone.
Supernovas! - Treewyrm - 07-27-2008
' Wrote:True.Well, we can agree to disagree then. I'm for variety in things around, more weapon classes and such things, for changes to happen making experience a bit varying, everchanging. Can't play same thing for too long, needs... changes to happen once in while, for something new to discover, to try, to see and to experiment with, such as weapon loadouts. Ingredients change and alchemy shifts. What will you find tomorrow?
And that's why I support Jinx's view about leaving all the same.
Some weapons are meant to be the same for everyone.
Supernovas! - chopper - 07-27-2008
It can go both ways. But if it's going this way, it better be damn well balanced.
And it's not, not in Clayph's suggestion, not in mine as well.
It probably can be done, but it would require a lot of work and more people working on it.
Supernovas! - McNeo - 07-27-2008
I dont think that capital ships will be left as they are now in the next version. I would be surprised if they didnt get a buff in some way, thats for sure.
Also, my proposed stats coming up now. They are more flexible than Choppers in my opinion, and I want to see what you think about them. I've also corrected some grammatical errors in the infocards, though some might've slipped through. I wont post the infocard though, as that just makes the post unneccessarily longer. The nomad one still remains the best, I think, but in my opinion its not unreasonable.
Nomad Strangelet Cannon
Hull Damage - 159 000
Shield Damage - 75 500
Range - 2100m
Energy Usage - 32 000
Projectile Speed -272 m/s
Rheinland Plasma Cannon
Sternenfaust
Hull Damage - 145 000
Shield Damage - 72 500
Range - 1800 m
Energy Usage - 38 000
Projectile Speed - 273 m/s
Refire Rate - 0.15
Kusari Photon Mortar
Kagutsuchi
Hull Damage - 115 000
Shield Damage - 57 500
Range - 2200 m
Energy Usage - 31 000
Projectile Speed - 280 m/s
Refire Rate 0.22
Liberty Ion Cannon
Arbiter
Hull Damage - 128 000
Shield Damage - 64 000
Range - 1850 m
Projectile Speed - 281 m/s
Refire Rate - 0.20
Energy Usage - 35 500
Bretonia Tachyon Cannon
Obliterator
Hull Damage - 136 000
Shield Damage - 68 000
Range - 1850 m
Projectile Speed - 286 m/s
Refire Rate - 0.16
Energy Usage - 38 500
Corsair Neutron Blaster
Demeter
Hull Damage – 130 000
Shield Damage – 65 000
Range - 1550 m
Projectile Speed - 274 m/s
Refire Rate - 0.18
Energy Usage - 34 000
Outcast Particle Blaster
Basilisk
Hull Damage - 146 000
Shield Damage - 73 000
Range - 1900m
Projectile Speed - 294m/s
Refire Rate - 0.19
Energy Usage - 39 000
Zoner Antimatter Cannon
Auraka
Hull Damage - 138 000
Shield Damage - 69 000
Range - 2400m
Projectile Speed - 284m/s
Refire Rate - 0.18
Energy Usage – 38 500
Order Dark Matter Cannon
Serket
Hull Damage - 155 000
Shield Damage - 77 500
Range - 2100m
Projectile Speed - 264 m/s
Refire Rate - 0.15
Energy Usage - 40 500
Bounty Hunter Guild Laser Mortar
Remington
Hull Damage - 125 000
Shield Damage - 62 500
Range - 2250m
Projectile Speed - 299m/s
Refire Rate - 0.19
Energy Usage – 37 000
Blood Dragon Photon Mortar
Raiden
Hull Damage - 113 000
Shield Damage - 56 500
Range -1800 m
Energy Usage - 29 500
Projectile Speed - 277 m/s
Refire Rate 0.22
Red Hessian Tachyon Cannon
Vidar
Hull Damage - 145 000
Shield Damage - 72 500
Range - 1700 m
Energy Usage - 38 500
Projectile Speed - 289 m/s
Refire Rate - 0.14
Liberty Rogue Particle Blaster
Lilith
Hull Damage - 163 000
Shield Damage - 81 500
Range - 2300m
Projectile Speed - 297m/s
Refire Rate - 0.18
Energy Usage - 47 500
Original Supernova Stats for comparison.
Hull Damage: 132 000
Shield Damage: 66 000
Range: 1960m
Projectile Speed: 280m/s
Refire Rate: 0.17
Energy Usage: 38 000
Too much writing I know, but I think this is a better solution. I've looked over these figures three times and I am satisfied with them. Most of them are quite similar to the original proposal in some ways, so that made my job a little easier;).
Also, I put speed as the number one factor, even though the range I used is quite small. I know from experience that a little speed increase means a much higher chance to hit a fighter/bomber target.
Supernovas! - Jinx - 07-27-2008
when you re balancing - it sometimes helps to always think of oneself getting the weakest of the weapons and having to fight someone with the strongest. - if you re honest to yourself, you ll start to balance things objectivly.
so - for example, i would now think of being a BHG bomber fighting an osiris - and on the other hand i will think of a setting where i am an order bomber fighting a BHG battleship with the factionized SNs - and if i am honest to myself ( which is hard, i know ) - i can get to the point what i really like more.
btw. - i_am_rdy made an order bomber.... so the taidan is not the bomber to be used by the order... however, i believe that the order bomber will be one of the big ones - with the big powerplant. - so no real difference.
so - always think that it is your chars that get the weapon with the lowest damage and the worst stats, no matter what roleplay says - and think of fighting the faction with the best one. - if you come to the result that you think its all balanced, its fine ( at least from your point of view )
and if you lie to yourself - we ll ask igiss to swap all the stats:laugh:- give the nomads the zoner SN, the zoners the nomad SN, the order the BHG SN, the BHG the order SN, outcasts - corsairs etc etc. - and if you then scream that things are "unfair" - something went wrong with balancing.
edit: i know its tempting - but stop adding ten thousands of damage to the current supernova. 140.000 damage is ENOUGH - unless warships are greatly improved in both armour and shields.