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+--- Thread: What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread (/showthread.php?tid=10594)
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - ScornStar - 07-24-2008
Wow Dab. Thats is how I'd pass time before I found Freelancer. Good points. Perhaps the route we take between JG and or JH is subspace. Something between string theory's newish concept of "branes"( like membrane) The layers, that devide demensions and thus give way to "places?" where the local laws of physics do not apply and thus we are able to travel at insaneo speeds.
Look up Carl Sagen and string theory. See what you can find on Branes it will be a good read but not a simple one. I think you can handle it.
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - Tenacity - 07-24-2008
so we're talking about quantum theory now eh? :P
Technically speaking, faster-than-light travel, or even just exactly-lightspeed travel, isnt possible. Once matter accelerates to the speed of light, it breaks apart at a subatomic level and becomes energy - changing from molecules into EM radiation (aka light, sometimes visible, sometimes not).
So yes, you could make an object go as fast as (or maybe fasterthan) the speed of light - but once it reaches that speed it ceases to exist as physical matter. The issue isnt going that fast, it's slowing back down; matter can converto to energy, but energy cannot convert back to matter. Not sure about you but I dont want to be stuck as a beam of light for all eternity =P
That also goes into pulsars/quasars and nuetron stars, which all are degrading at a molecular level and emitting extremely high amounts of EM radiation as the matter they're made of decays. Theoretically, the Universe could - aeons from now - 'cease to exist in a material state, as it would eventually consume itself, converting all matter in the universe into energy. It's all just theory though, we wont know until something like that actually happens, in which case we wont care because we'll all be dead =)
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - Blodo - 07-24-2008
Einstein's theory only applies to conventional means of accelerating though. Engines will never work in this way. The most plausible way for a jump gate to work would be for it to work similarly to a wormhole, utilising the curvature of space to do a sort of a shortcut, much like what you could do if you curved a piece of paper then blown a hole through it with a pen. The relativity theory does not apply then, since the speed of light is never actually exceeded by the vessel. Considering how both gates and holes work similarly to how a wormhole would, I figure it's just different names for the same thing, except without the problems that modern physics points out, that are either partially or fully theoretical (like the need for exotic matter).
As a fun fact: Einstein's relativity theory says that the faster you travel relative to a non moving observer, the slower time goes for you relative to the observer (in this case the rest of humanity). So following this theory the moment you reach light speed relative to the rest of the universe, time stops for you. I'll leave you with the ensuing time paradox on your mind:P
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - Tenacity - 07-24-2008
' Wrote:Einstein's theory only applies to conventional means of accelerating though. Engines will never work in this way. The most plausible way for a jump gate to work would be for it to work similarly to a wormhole, utilising the curvature of space to do a sort of a shortcut, much like what you could do if you curved a piece of paper then blown a hole through it with a pen. The relativity theory does not apply then, since the speed of light is never actually exceeded by the vessel. Considering how both gates and holes work similarly to how a wormhole would, I figure it's just different names for the same thing, except without the problems that modern physics points out, that are either partially or fully theoretical (like exotic matter).
The problem with that is, as far as we know - wormholes dont exist. The only thing that can bend space is a black hole, due to an exceptionally powerful gravitational field - and even it doesnt truly 'bend' space, it simply sucks everything nearby to a single point, breaking it apart in the process.
Quote:As a fun fact: Einstein's relativity theory says that the faster you travel relative to a non moving observer, the slower time goes for you relative to the observer (in this case the rest of humanity). So following this theory the moment you reach light speed relative to the rest of the universe, time stops for you. I'll leave you with the ensuing time paradox on your mind:P
The problem is that you dont ever reach light speed's velocity over everything else - light still travels as fast as you're going, so the universe doesnt appear to stop, you just 'ascend' to seeing different things.
There's a time travel theory based on that though - basically saying if you travel directly away from the earth at 1/4 the speed of light for one year, and then travel back at the same speed; by the time you reach earth again only 2 years will have passed for you, but eight years will have passed for everyone else on earth.
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - Colonel Z.e.r.o. - 07-24-2008
Man I wish I cared that much.
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - jammi - 07-24-2008
Just one thing, does 'superluminal' mean faster than lightspeed? In that case, go check any trade lane's infocard, where it makes references to trade lanes being able to make ships travel at superluminal speeds. Now this is confusing me, because that means ships are going faster than light, which contradicts everything you guys have just said, which means DA needs to sort it's science out... I'm confuzzled...
And also, what are the units of distance used? The 'K' I'm pretty sure doesn't mean Kilometers, and the 'm' isn't miles. I think. Newgate Prison in Manchester mentions it's thousands of miles through empty space to the nearest base, so what the hell is the 'K' and how do these units of distance relate to ship sizes?!
*Brain explodes*
And if the JHs were shut down, I guess the pirates would just take the long route and fly between systems, like the first colonists to arrive in Sirius did. The journey wuld take months though, so not really a viable option...
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - Blodo - 07-24-2008
Superluminal does indeed mean faster than light. As far as I know the trade lanes work using magnetism to thrust ships forwards until they reach the next ring and are thrusted again to keep the momentum.
On this note, I think we can all admit that trying to apply modern physics to Freelancer is nothing short of a joke:P
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - Dab - 07-24-2008
' Wrote:The problem with that is, as far as we know - wormholes dont exist. The only thing that can bend space is a black hole, due to an exceptionally powerful gravitational field - and even it doesnt truly 'bend' space, it simply sucks everything nearby to a single point, breaking it apart in the process.
Actually, according to some theories, everything in the universe 'bends' space, and that is what causes 'time'. If the object were to not bend space at all, time would not move. The sun bends a peice of space. That being our solar system. Earth similarly does. We ourselves don't bend time, for we are already inside of something that does, that being earth. Now don't go 'wha? That rediculous..' Because Einstein said this too.
Linky
Theory of Relativity is what causes gravity, not attractions of two objects on each other.. Think of the Sun as a funnel. Right now, the Earth is a marble you just started spinning along that funnel. Eventually the marble will slow down and fall into the middle. However, thats from the friction of the surface its rolling along, namely plastic. Earth is not experiencing friction, just the funnel-gravity of the Sun. So long as it maintains its high rate of speed, it will not fall into the sun.
As far as I understand it. The very depths of space between galaxies.. Time does not exist. The galaxies themselves are what makes time exist. The farther away from the galaxy you get, the less effect the funnel has on you, until the point where it effects you not at all. After that, only the effect of your own ship and darkmatter (if it exists) would move time. Since it is significantly smaller, it has a small effect than a solar system or planet, so time will move impossibly slowly. 1 minute will still feel like a minute to you, but that would be equivilant to years, possibly thousands, on a planet or in a solar system.
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - Dra1003 - 07-24-2008
bah i wish i was this smart the time space contineuim and space travel confuse me to the point of madness.. are there any sites with this info so i can read them?
What would happen - Hijacked into Science of FL thread - Tenacity - 07-24-2008
' Wrote:Just one thing, does 'superluminal' mean faster than lightspeed? In that case, go check any trade lane's infocard, where it makes references to trade lanes being able to make ships travel at superluminal speeds. Now this is confusing me, because that means ships are going faster than light, which contradicts everything you guys have just said, which means DA needs to sort it's science out... I'm confuzzled...
And also, what are the units of distance used? The 'K' I'm pretty sure doesn't mean Kilometers, and the 'm' isn't miles. I think. Newgate Prison in Manchester mentions it's thousands of miles through empty space to the nearest base, so what the hell is the 'K' and how do these units of distance relate to ship sizes?!
*Brain explodes*
And if the JHs were shut down, I guess the pirates would just take the long route and fly between systems, like the first colonists to arrive in Sirius did. The journey wuld take months though, so not really a viable option...
superluminal does mean faster than light, but tradelanes dont move you that fast.
K is for kilometers. In a tradelane you travel at 1000 meters per second, while lightspeed is something like 836,000 meters per second.