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+--- Thread: Fair warning (/showthread.php?tid=142736)
RE: Fair warning - Vendetta - 09-01-2016
(09-01-2016, 09:53 PM)Arioch Wrote:(09-01-2016, 09:52 PM)Vendetta Wrote: I caught @Dimon putting @"Auzari" 's SRP Engines on his D9 ship in-game inRP because he wanted to see what they looked like. They're custom engines which should only exist on the one ship.
And he removed them, and was told not to do that and he apologized.
Yes and that we're thankful for, but really should he have done it in the first place is what was implied. If we're going to discuss staff trust it's about knowing to not do things in the first place, which while Danny edited an .ini file while the server rules state not to, it should've been assumed that he was testing things. It wasn't so long ago that Blodo used to test on the main server quite frequently, and even Alley, which admin or not is still developer testing, and having Marduks spawned in the middle of a training session was no fun, which she apologized for.
Sometimes though, Sorry doesn't cut it. Common sense needs to be taken in to consideration rather than immediate accusation and suspicion.
EDIT: This whole debacle is about testing things on the live server and staff trust, which if one member of the green team tested one thing and removed it not long after to apologize, wouldn't it make sense for a member of the yellow team to test something too only to remove it later?
RE: Fair warning - Arioch - 09-01-2016
I don't agree with immediate accusation and suspicion. We agree there.
@Durandal Ok then why didn't he mention that to someone, knowing that a change to the INI would flag the anti cheat? I'm sorry but to claim "i didn't know that changing an ini would flag the anti cheat and i'd get tempbanned" is naive considering it's always been that way. Why couldn't he say "hey guys, this may flag the anti cheat cause I need to test this on the live server" and then all is good? I get you shouldn't have to do that for everything you do as a Dev, nor should you. But testing/changing files on the live server should at least get a heads up. Seems like a mix of bad communication on both sides.
RE: Fair warning - Kauket - 09-01-2016
tbh i caught him a day earlier with the effects before he cloaked away
RE: Fair warning - Durandal - 09-01-2016
There isn't anything mature about beating around the bush and using kind words to say ignorant things. I'm being honest, and I consider that to be a greater service to this community than providing any illusion of Discovery's staff being a well oiled machine. And as for Finn saying the sanction was reversed after Danny was talked to, he was spoken to before the ban was posted.
[2:21:59 PM] Danny-Lee Knoles: it's just eye candy that only I can see
[2:22:00 PM] Justin Hopkins: It's a trust thing.
[2:22:17 PM] Danny-Lee Knoles: that's all I'm gonna say to this topic
Danny speaking, my local time ^
http://cdn.che.moe/gutiuz.png
Sanction, 1 hour earlier ^
http://cdn.che.moe/hryldr.png
My current local time ^
RE: Fair warning - Goldberg - 09-01-2016
(09-01-2016, 09:54 PM)Durandal Wrote: I'm going to post this here, because Danny is shy or whatever apparently.
[4:42:38 PM] David Kobets (Jewkrainian) ☭: but uh
[4:42:41 PM] David Kobets (Jewkrainian) ☭: just a question
[4:42:47 PM] David Kobets (Jewkrainian) ☭: why do you need to test the gun on live players?
[4:42:52 PM] David Kobets (Jewkrainian) ☭: is it something about the impact thing?
[4:43:44 PM] Danny-Lee Knoles: yes
[4:43:48 PM] Danny-Lee Knoles: how does it handle in pvp
[4:43:57 PM] Danny-Lee Knoles: how eyes react to looking at it constantly
[4:44:15 PM] Danny-Lee Knoles: can you aim the gun if it's using that effect
He was doing his job as a developer and that isn't something he should be forced to revert. Pointing to private servers or any other half-fix as a workaround isn't going to cut it, and since Hannibal and Conrad were completely and totally unwilling to see the clear light of day, this got posted. I'm done with secrets, and I'm doing with people being screwed over for no reason.
Don't forget performance issues, even Freelancer is going to lag when we have like 10 Battleships fighting against 10 Battleships
Effects can bring performance problems, yes.
Anyway, kinda dumb, danny just editiet a file nothing else OMG OMG OMG BAN PLS PL0X
I agree with Justin here.
RE: Fair warning - Arioch - 09-01-2016
Posted =/= actual ban.
When I post a sanction it's after I've gone in and spent time on the Desk doing what I said. So just because it was POSTED after the discussion, doesn't mean when he went through and actually banned people was at the same time. he did it before posting it.
What SHOULD have happened is after that discussion, he immediately reversed the ban. That wasn't done, and there was a delay.
RE: Fair warning - Yber - 09-01-2016
both links trigger my antivirus lol
RE: Fair warning - Thunderer - 09-01-2016
I don't think it's hard to notify the admins beforehand and ask them to temporarily exclude the specific file from the anticheat. Could be done next time.
PS: So, a dev got tempbanned for "cheating". That's a pretty bad thing for trust towards the devs. Players would only take notice of what really happened if drama was made about it. Is this an attempt to clean the mud off of the devteam's reputation? If so, I don't think it was needed, and blaming it all on the admins was especially unneeded. You could have just made a short and simple appeal that everyone could read quickly.
RE: Fair warning - Vendetta - 09-01-2016
I'm not going to agree with either approach because both the staff teams need to learn to co-exist and cooperate without accusing one another of screwing something up. There's such a wedge between the two it's astonishing the community is even functioning at its current level.
A simple solution would've been to notify the admins of the intent to test. Another solution is for devs to be given rights to test and specific tagged ships to do so with an exemption from the anti-cheat, which can quite easily be revoked if abused.
But god damn it, talk to each other without getting angry. People aren't always going to be nice on the internet so don't expect peachy attitudes.
RE: Fair warning - Ace Razgriz - 09-01-2016
(09-01-2016, 10:01 PM)Legionnaire Wrote: danny just editiet a file nothing else OMG OMG OMG BAN PLS PL0X
I guess I need to re-iterate whats been said throughout this entire thread.
There is an automatic process in place whenever ANYONE triggers the anti-cheat
Danny didn't tell an admin he was explicitly testing on the main server
Danny got flagged
Automatically sanctioned due to the process *not run by a human*
Danny actually talks to a human staff member and gets things reversed, easily unsanctioned.
This could all be solved by white-listing [DEV] ships or something of the matter, and ONCE AGAIn I have to say how much pointless drama is being caused and that completely pointless insults and toxicity is coming out of this thread, simply because "Durandal"
(09-01-2016, 10:04 PM)Vendetta Wrote: A simple solution would've been to notify the admins of the intent to test. Another solution is for devs to be given rights to test and specific tagged ships to do so with an exemption from the anti-cheat, which can quite easily be revoked if abused.also that^^