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+--- Thread: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. (/showthread.php?tid=150641)
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - Sombs - 05-29-2017
(05-29-2017, 10:15 AM)sindroms Wrote: * sindroms waves hand vaguely
"Some advanced sneaky tech hoarders that use JH Gens as means of transportation...something something. Religious, because why not."
@Teerin "Eh, good enough I suppose."
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - Enkidu - 05-29-2017
(05-29-2017, 10:56 AM)Foxglove Wrote: It wasn't the K'Hara playerfaction at large who said it would be a bad idea to spawn Nomad capitals in house space. It was me and a vocal minority of my faction. The problems with it have been illustrated by you well enough, but it can be amended easily: Use the Wild. The Wild are intended to do these sorts of things, attacking stuff in house space, because they fit in. I could go into detail about this, but it wouldn't get us anywhere. The Cultists are a thing and I honestly don't see what is so bad about it.
Bottom line, the idea of these PvE events is a good one. The enemy to shoot didn't really matter because at the end of the day it was simply for fun. This is why the Cultists as a big bad aren't too bad of an idea.
The problem with "Simply for fun" is that you can justify all sorts of things via "simply for fun". Fun should always come first - but long term fun should be valued equivalently. Changing the rules of the universe without expanding pre-existing concepts that require expansion - for example, the hypergates, the Daam K'vosh, the Nomads, Humanity's spread into Sirius and implied spread beyond, tension in the Sirius sector, Cassiopeia, or even helping any of the number of factions nobody wants to play and haven't wanted to play for years, is wrong. It's the wrong focus.
I love Unknown systems and the concept of sci-data rewards, but the Cultists are not a sustainable concept as they're a purely arcade element that shatters the immersion of the universe.
Edit:
(05-29-2017, 10:57 AM)Sombra Hookier Wrote:(05-29-2017, 10:15 AM)sindroms Wrote: * sindroms waves hand vaguely
"Some advanced sneaky tech hoarders that use JH Gens as means of transportation...something something. Religious, because why not."
@Teerin "Eh, good enough I suppose."
Do we really want "good enough I suppose"?
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - diamond1 - 05-29-2017
I just brewed a few ideas on the spot,
1. Research rp comodities such as survey teams, research equipment, etc. currently have nearly no use besides for roleplay. why not put them into use allowing a specific faction to gain access through adapting technology to stabilise the wormhole. kinda like the effects of a jumphole generator. (first faction, first pick. And said faction can spread the data to allies through forum roleplay giving them a chance to jump in.)
2. With scientific data gained in events, this allows a singular ship to gain access to long-dead factions and use them to participate in events ( must have excellent roleplay compatability). similar to when the cultists first arrived and there was someone behind the wheel, and like the one event where a player got access to an ish'tar and joined the nomad event a few months back, i do believe. i mean, you get a plausable flagship if anyone can reach that much, why not give access to event/long gone factions with still potential rp. no other means of obtaining it and say sharing accounts for it is forbidden.
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - Enkidu - 05-29-2017
(05-29-2017, 11:01 AM)diamond1 Wrote: I just brewed a few ideas on the spot,
1. Research rp comodities such as survey teams, research equipment, etc. currently have nearly no use besides for roleplay. why not put them into use allowing a specific faction to gain access through adapting technology to stabilise the wormhole. kinda like the effects of a jumphole generator. (first faction, first pick. And said faction can spread the data to allies through forum roleplay giving them a chance to jump in.)
2. With scientific data gained in events, this allows a singular ship to gain access to long-dead factions and use them to participate in events ( must have excellent roleplay compatability). similar to when the cultists first arrived and there was someone behind the wheel, and like the one event where a player got access to an ish'tar and joined the nomad event a few months back, i do believe. i mean, you get a plausable flagship if anyone can reach that much, why not give access to event/long gone factions with still potential rp. no other means of obtaining it and say sharing accounts for it is forbidden.
This is actually really cool. And likely doable.
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - diamond1 - 05-29-2017
(05-29-2017, 11:02 AM)Tænì Wrote:(05-29-2017, 11:01 AM)diamond1 Wrote: I just brewed a few ideas on the spot,
1. Research rp comodities such as survey teams, research equipment, etc. currently have nearly no use besides for roleplay. why not put them into use allowing a specific faction to gain access through adapting technology to stabilise the wormhole. kinda like the effects of a jumphole generator. (first faction, first pick. And said faction can spread the data to allies through forum roleplay giving them a chance to jump in.)
2. With scientific data gained in events, this allows a singular ship to gain access to long-dead factions and use them to participate in events ( must have excellent roleplay compatability). similar to when the cultists first arrived and there was someone behind the wheel, and like the one event where a player got access to an ish'tar and joined the nomad event a few months back, i do believe. i mean, you get a plausable flagship if anyone can reach that much, why not give access to event/long gone factions with still potential rp. no other means of obtaining it and say sharing accounts for it is forbidden.
This is actually really cool. And likely doable.
Please tell me you're joking. i'm serious. Are you kidding?
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - Snoflek - 05-29-2017
(05-29-2017, 11:02 AM)Tænì Wrote:(05-29-2017, 11:01 AM)diamond1 Wrote: I just brewed a few ideas on the spot,
1. Research rp comodities such as survey teams, research equipment, etc. currently have nearly no use besides for roleplay. why not put them into use allowing a specific faction to gain access through adapting technology to stabilise the wormhole. kinda like the effects of a jumphole generator. (first faction, first pick. And said faction can spread the data to allies through forum roleplay giving them a chance to jump in.)
2. With scientific data gained in events, this allows a singular ship to gain access to long-dead factions and use them to participate in events ( must have excellent roleplay compatability). similar to when the cultists first arrived and there was someone behind the wheel, and like the one event where a player got access to an ish'tar and joined the nomad event a few months back, i do believe. i mean, you get a plausable flagship if anyone can reach that much, why not give access to event/long gone factions with still potential rp. no other means of obtaining it and say sharing accounts for it is forbidden.
This is actually really cool. And likely doable.
I like these ideas, but Flagships make me think. What if each official faction got to build one 'super capital' ship? A beastly vessel more powerful than any battleship, guranteed to ensure dominance on the battlefield. Oh, and also one that gets deleted by admins should it be blown up, requiring a 2 month real time wait before it can be repaired/rebuilt, requiring large investments of resource and RP
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - Sombs - 05-29-2017
(05-29-2017, 10:56 AM)Tænì Wrote:(05-29-2017, 10:43 AM)Sombra Hookier Wrote: A faction that had a tech level even higher than the one of the nomads.
Why do we need to be super-dooper-kewl and ignore all the hard work people done over the years because shiny? The Nomads are meant to be an unknowable eldritch alien entity. This cheapens them.
It doesn't. In the end, it even makes them realize that there is reason to evolve even further. Suddenly, they aren't the creme de la creme of Sirius anymore. Because one group of people managed to adjust and got better than them. It's neither ignorant nor cheapening something. The balance is pretty much given, lore-wise, as humans exist in millions, nomads can regrow but the cultists have only so many numbers and ressources. You see them rarely. It's good that way, as they remain mysterious.
Now did people ask for them? Maybe not. Did people ask for Vagrants, UN|, SIS, Auxesia and what not? You can say the same about it. If anything, the Cultists make the lore more dynamic, as there is suddenly a shift in power.
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - Goliath - 05-29-2017
(05-29-2017, 11:03 AM)diamond1 Wrote:(05-29-2017, 11:02 AM)Tænì Wrote:(05-29-2017, 11:01 AM)diamond1 Wrote: I just brewed a few ideas on the spot,
1. Research rp comodities such as survey teams, research equipment, etc. currently have nearly no use besides for roleplay. why not put them into use allowing a specific faction to gain access through adapting technology to stabilise the wormhole. kinda like the effects of a jumphole generator. (first faction, first pick. And said faction can spread the data to allies through forum roleplay giving them a chance to jump in.)
2. With scientific data gained in events, this allows a singular ship to gain access to long-dead factions and use them to participate in events ( must have excellent roleplay compatability). similar to when the cultists first arrived and there was someone behind the wheel, and like the one event where a player got access to an ish'tar and joined the nomad event a few months back, i do believe. i mean, you get a plausable flagship if anyone can reach that much, why not give access to event/long gone factions with still potential rp. no other means of obtaining it and say sharing accounts for it is forbidden.
This is actually really cool. And likely doable.
Please tell me you're joking. i'm serious. Are you kidding?
Four letters: C O O L
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - diamond1 - 05-29-2017
(05-29-2017, 11:04 AM)Sharkylapua Wrote:(05-29-2017, 11:03 AM)diamond1 Wrote:(05-29-2017, 11:02 AM)Tænì Wrote:(05-29-2017, 11:01 AM)diamond1 Wrote: I just brewed a few ideas on the spot,
1. Research rp comodities such as survey teams, research equipment, etc. currently have nearly no use besides for roleplay. why not put them into use allowing a specific faction to gain access through adapting technology to stabilise the wormhole. kinda like the effects of a jumphole generator. (first faction, first pick. And said faction can spread the data to allies through forum roleplay giving them a chance to jump in.)
2. With scientific data gained in events, this allows a singular ship to gain access to long-dead factions and use them to participate in events ( must have excellent roleplay compatability). similar to when the cultists first arrived and there was someone behind the wheel, and like the one event where a player got access to an ish'tar and joined the nomad event a few months back, i do believe. i mean, you get a plausable flagship if anyone can reach that much, why not give access to event/long gone factions with still potential rp. no other means of obtaining it and say sharing accounts for it is forbidden.
This is actually really cool. And likely doable.
Please tell me you're joking. i'm serious. Are you kidding?
Four letters: C O O L
... Welp that was a side blow, normally i get mocked for every idea i make.
RE: Retrospect: Events, PVE and Cultist Lore. - Enkidu - 05-29-2017
(05-29-2017, 11:04 AM)Sombra Hookier Wrote:(05-29-2017, 10:56 AM)Tænì Wrote:(05-29-2017, 10:43 AM)Sombra Hookier Wrote: A faction that had a tech level even higher than the one of the nomads.
Why do we need to be super-dooper-kewl and ignore all the hard work people done over the years because shiny? The Nomads are meant to be an unknowable eldritch alien entity. This cheapens them.
It doesn't. In the end, it even makes them realize that there is reason to evolve even further. Suddenly, they aren't the creme de la creme of Sirius anymore. Because one group of people managed to adjust and got better than them. It's neither ignorant nor cheapening something. The balance is pretty much given, lore-wise, as humans exist in millions, nomads can regrow but the cultists have only so many numbers and ressources. You see them rarely. It's good that way, as they remain mysterious.
Now did people ask for them? Maybe not. Did people ask for Vagrants, UN|, SIS, Auxesia and what not? You can say the same about it. If anything, the Cultists make the lore more dynamic, as there is suddenly a shift in power.
Vagrants is an idea with its roots in vanilla, UN| is an attempt to make a dead pirate faction playable and have roots in vanilla (80 years war), Auxesia fills the Marcus Walker/King-like role of the Nomad War - so does Harmony, in a very different capacity. I don't know anything about SIS.
Cultists would have been awesome if they were something braver and newer, not a handwave "whoomans suddently got this tech". I'd love it if they were a totally new alien race that used self-generated jumpholes to move around - that would be sinister, frightening, compelling. Humans (being the majority playable entities), shouldn't have this kind of power.
There's probably enough old models around that, with a slight retexture, we could have a first iteration of new aliens around. Unknowable aliens fit into FL lore - machine cultists/transhumanists? Probably; Auxesia isn't far off. However, Unknowable alien thing fits the PvE role better from an RP perspective. Otherwise we have to accept this bunch of people with near unlimited power have always been around.
I encourage brave new expansions to Disco. I'm someone who loves Gallia, loves the new Omicrons - I love the idea of unknown, dynamic systems and I hope to be able to help write lore/infocards for them as soon as I'm invited. But they need to be rooted in the universe.