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+---- Forum: Faction Rules (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=46)
+---- Thread: Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity (/showthread.php?tid=62352)
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - Korny - 06-29-2011
' Wrote:Then all houses should have the same criteria, not all RP in the houses after all.
Now, if it's gonna be lowered it should be fair to lower the criteria for ALL factions.
I don't see it that way, sorry. Take the [LN] for example. It is really, really easy for Libertonian factions to maintain activity, simply because there's always something to do/other factions to interact with.
If you simply have no one to interact, and lets say you do log on your Kusarian char, and fly around the whole house and all you encounter is a few traders that aren't even interested in any form of interaction, it is certainly hard to be active, because it's no fun that way. Fun is what we're all seeking, isn't it ? Sure, everyone could just grind a few hours by doing nothing, but is that activity ?
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - Athenian - 06-29-2011
' Wrote:Everyone knows damn well the Aoi Isejin isn't just the 113th. They chose that tag because they didn't want to tag their infested characters. Yea, that was probably a mistake. Are you going to punish them for that mistake by disbanding the whole faction? Its rather obvious they have plenty of online time as a faction, that you can't find out by spending 10 seconds checking a server tool is irrelevant. This was completely unnecessary and you're not helping ANYONE with it. Bureaucratic bull**** is what this is.
The faction will abide by the same rules that apply to everyone else.
' Wrote:I dunno how you're measuring this, but the Iseijin have been well above the required activity for over a month, since the last warning, then the second it drops a little, you've pounced and revoked it.
We've actually recently put in a request with the Admins to shift the faction again and kill the KNF stuff that clearly doesn't work. We've been waiting on the Admins.
That is of course, if Jake put in the request. Please don't tell me Jake didn't put in the request.
I'm measuring using the activity tracker, set up with the tag provided by the factions involved.
Pouncing? Hardly. Activity notices are made every 30 days (the last one was 29 May - the faction had a warning.) http://discoverygc.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=100129
You chose the tag. You were told that if that tag didn't clock enough activity that the status would be revoked.
' Wrote:So a group of people either play on the (AFAIK untagged) Wilde IDed ships in their faction, which seems to me what it's really all about, or take a bit of a hiatus, and as a result the roleplay they have forged out for themselves over the course of months if not years is irrevocably nuked into the ground?
That seems unfair to me. Maybe force the faction to tag its Wilde ships so that they can be tracked, rather than just destroying it outright? I -know- they had warning, but still.
See above. This was debated at length.
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - alphadog - 06-29-2011
Apart from the "we told them, rules are rules, blabla", is there any actual reason to disband them? If not, why is the rule even there?
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - Akura - 06-29-2011
' Wrote:We've actually recently put in a request with the Admins to shift the faction again and kill the KNF stuff that clearly doesn't work. We've been waiting on the Admins.
That is of course, if Jake put in the request. Please don't tell me Jake didn't put in the request.
Knowing the utter failure of the 113th, the Iseijin recently wrote up a new plan to save our faction, as the KNF ID thing was a terrible idea and we needed to do /something/. I told Jake to PM it to the Admins over a week ago, but he's been busy in Kosovo so I guess it never happened.
This proposal would lead to the 113th going rogue, and the 113th| ships to be full Wild, overt and all. All of our ships would be tagged, and we'd have more than enough activity.
So here it is, public. As we've nothing to lose anyway.
Alright, we were going to wait for 4.86 to begin it's release cycle before we went about fixing the faction, but an opportunity came up that we've decided to push forward our ideas because it's now possible without a release.
Originally, come 4.86, the 113th Division of the Kusari Naval Forces collapses and it becomes widely known that the leadership crumbled and the group went rogue. In reality, the Nomad's original plan for Kusari shifted and the original Iseijin plan became redundant.
With the military resources provided by the Kusari Government and Naval Forces, the Aoi Iseijin have enough to defend their Tohoku fortress, and luckily, Kusari is still weak from the Tau Campaign, and is about to lose to Gallia. That combined with governmental shifts in Kusari guarantees that the Aoi Iseijin in Tohoku aren't taken down by the Kusari Naval Forces.
Come 4.86, the Aoi Iseijin were going to request an ID and small NPC faction, and with the future of the Nomads, we were going to begin work on diplomacy with our neighbours. The Iseijin already have an agreement with the Outcasts, a ceasefire with the Coalition, and a small friendship with the Gaians.
The Aoi Iseijin will then spend time befriending the Gas Miners Guild and Golden Chrysanthemums, and will finally attempt to create a fragile alliance with the Blood Dragons. This will most likely lead to the return of all Blood Dragon technology, as large gamble for the Iseijin. This idea is that we promise to assist the Blood Dragons and Golden Chrysanthemums with their takeover of Kusari, in return for being left alone on the edges of Kusari. Whether this is a clever trick to take Kusari and them stab them in the back, is still to be decided.
The reason we needed our own ID to carry out this plan, is because the Aoi Iseijin have been using the Wild ID, which suits the Das Wilde fine, but doesn't suit the future of our faction. The Wild ID has repninjas in place to make it hostile to every Sirius faction, which suits the Das Wilde fine as they're an offensive military arm of the Nomads, this chokes the Iseijin however, and forces us into hostility with every other faction on the server.
SPOILER ALERT. In the coming version of Discovery, the Nomads continue their defensive stand in the Omicrons, but will reach out to other groups and come to peaceful agreements. SPOILER ALERT.
The Iseijin are the beginning wave of this future, where the Das Wilde are violent, cruel and ruthless, the Iseijin are deceptive, clever and conservative. The Iseijin intend to make friends close to them, and make the Nomads seem like less of a threat to factions whom they make contact with.
We intend to talk to some groups, instead of shooting them, because after all this is Discovery Roleplay, is it not? Half to more than half of Roleplay is talk, we want less people to shoot, and less aggressive roleplay in general.
But what can you do to help us, why am I telling you this? Well, we couldn't use an ID before, we had no choice but to wait until 4.86 for our own ID to be proposed, accepted and made. But if you draw your eyes to the Reapers of Sirius, they managed to take the redundant NovaPG ID as their own, through the use of FLHook.
As you may well already know, the Phantoms recently disbanded, (http://discoverygc.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=98354) and their ID now lays about gathering dust in the halls of their former homes. What we're asking, is that you read over our proposal, and should you decide to, FLHook this ID for us and remove a metaphorical chokechain from our throats.
With this new ID, we would be able to have our own seperate set of Repninjas, allowing us to finally execute Diplomacy with other groups as we intend to. The idea with this is to draw the Aoi Iseijin away from the "Kill all in sight" mentality and allow us fit into Discovery like other factions do, we're tired of being everyone's enemies, we want to roleplay with groups around us, we want to talk instead of shooting people.
These changes are already in effect, we've proposed balanced Wild weapons, so that the Wild can stop using Nomad Weapons and use tech balanced for them.
The end result is the Aoi Iseijin faction using Kusari Naval Tech, (Kusari and Sirius Civvy on top of that) working on Diplomacy with the Kusari Unlawfuls and close neighbours. This means we can end up being white celled to the Blood Dragons, Golden Chrysanthemums and Gas Miners Guild, and green to Kusari and Nomad Technology. Being set white repped to the Outcasts and Gaians would be ideal too, but only so that we're not shot at, docking can be denied via the ID.
Our new ID can be similar to the Wild ID, reading:
"Pilot carrying this ID is a member of the Aoi Iseijin, who :
* Can attack hostile ships within their Zone of Influence
* Can land only on Allied bases
* Can demand cargo from any non-Allied ships
* Cannot demand credits from anyone
* Cannot fulfill bounty contracts
Allowed ships: Fighters, Freighters, Transports, Gunboats, Cruisers, Battleships
Carrying unmounted IDs in your ship, as well as not equipping an ID, is a serious crime."
With this, the Aoi Iseijin will clean up all of our tech usage and organise the faction for the future, creating the fall of the 113th as a Roleplay event, and beginning relations with our possible new friends. If this ID proposal is approved, we'd have to present a new faction status on the forums, and allow the public to have their say and the Administation to vote on confirming the changes in the faction.
Thank you for taking time to read this proposal, and we hope to clean up our act for everybody's benefit.
- The Aoi Iseijin Leadership
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - Omi - 06-29-2011
This looks like rules and regulations steamrolling common sense. Do we actually know if the faction is inactive, or it it just the tagged bits of the faction which are inactive? For christ's sake, it shouldn't be so bloody difficult to edge some sort of exception in. The Iseijin are actively beneficial to the RP environment of this server; that should be ENOUGH! Not having to conform to some ridiculous requirement which the faction is incompatible with by virtue of being meant to not -fly- the tag. Hell, let's make them all fly their 113th| tagged ships and then it won't BE a Wilde faction any more, just auxiliary KNF!
EDIT: And the post above illustrates what I'm on about. Look how much time & effort has gone into that and the rest of the faction's works, but because of one bloody ridiculous rule with about as much flexibility as concrete it's all in jeopardy of being erased from existence.
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - Akura - 06-29-2011
' Wrote:This looks like rules and regulations steamrolling common sense. Do we actually know if the faction is inactive, or it it just the tagged bits of the faction which are inactive? For christ's sake, it shouldn't be so bloody difficult to edge some sort of exception in. The Iseijin are actively beneficial to the RP environment of this server; that should be ENOUGH! Not having to conform to some ridiculous requirement which the faction is incompatible with by virtue of being meant to not -fly- the tag. Hell, let's make them all fly their 113th| tagged ships and then it won't BE a Wilde faction any more, just auxiliary KNF!
My personal Iseijin Battleship has been online....
Amaterasu's.Visage 19/06/2011 20:39:48 04:47:55
Nick's fighter:
Kiri 24/06/2011 22:36:34 05:59:57
And that's just one of our ships. We had a raid on Minor with a whole load of untagged Iseijin, so it's not a matter of activity. It's a matter of tagged activity, which we were trying to fix if you read the above post.
Cheers for the support, it really is a complete joke some of this stuff. I'm sure plenty of people in the Order or the other Kusari factions can confirm that we've been online plenty.
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - Hielor - 06-29-2011
' Wrote:Doing okay =/= are active. As you can see in this sheet, many of the Kusari factions are close to get a warning, maybe you should change the criteria for active hours for certain houses, such as Gallia/Kusari, since it's obviously harder to maintain a good activity in them.Several Kusari factions are at more than double the required hours.
I fail to see why it's "harder to maintain activity" in Kusari. If you have six people who each log on for only one hour a week, then you meet the requirements.
Factions that die due to failing to meet the required activity have no one to blame but themselves.
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - Athenian - 06-29-2011
' Wrote:I don't see it that way, sorry. Take the [LN] for example. It is really, really easy for Libertonian factions to maintain activity, simply because there's always something to do/other factions to interact with.
If you simply have no one to interact, and lets say you do log on your Kusarian char, and fly around the whole house and all you encounter is a few traders that aren't even interested in any form of interaction, it is certainly hard to be active, because it's no fun that way. Fun is what we're all seeking, isn't it ? Sure, everyone could just grind a few hours by doing nothing, but is that activity ?
I see no reason why the rules for factions should be adjusted to allow a faction to enjoy its many privileges (and in the case of the Aoi Iseijin, those are very distinct privileges) when its members cannot generate an hour a day in activity over 30 days, especially when given notice to do so.
Yes, other Kusari factions come close to being warned - but they didn't. And the ones warned heeded the warning.
Rules are rules, bla, bla. Yeah, that's the spirit.
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - Hielor - 06-29-2011
' Wrote:The Iseijin are actively beneficial to the RP environment of this server; that should be ENOUGH!The activity tracker says otherwise.
Admin Notice: Faction Statuses Revoked; Warnings for Inactivity - Akura - 06-29-2011
' Wrote:I see no reason why the rules for factions should be adjusted to allow a faction to enjoy its many privileges (and in the case of the Aoi Iseijin, those are very distinct privileges) when its members cannot generate an hour a day in activity over 30 days, especially when given notice to do so.
Yes, other Kusari factions come close to being warned - but they didn't. And the ones warned heeded the warning.
Rules are rules, bla, bla. Yeah, that's the spirit.
I'm sorry we don't spend our time looking at activity lists to make sure that the half of our faction that is clearly a failure that we don't care about doesn't titanic.
We can prove that we're active enough, and that we're trying to fix it, and we were waiting on an admin vote so that we can move our faction forward and get more active.
' Wrote:The activity tracker says otherwise.
I can prove that our untagged ships make up the time required. We are active enough, more than enough. Just not on the right ships apparently, something we were waiting on the Admins to help us fix.