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+--- Thread: Zoners (/showthread.php?tid=98709)
RE: Zoners - Anaximander - 06-10-2013
(06-10-2013, 05:22 PM)rainth345 Wrote: I don't see how asking for permission "to dock and buy" an Aquillon from Pueblo Bonito frustrates RP....
Because I am forced to ask an entity that holds no right to MY FACTION's (Zoners) ship for permission to buy it. It creates a non-sensical scenario where I have to ask you for something that doesn't belong to you or get killed in the process. How to immerse in that?
(06-10-2013, 05:22 PM)rainth345 Wrote: Even so... your problems of "acquiring" the ship you want will be over when .87 comes.... the buying point will now be moved to O-74. So there's something to rejoice about....
Yes something to rejoice for you and I both it seems.
(06-10-2013, 05:22 PM)rainth345 Wrote: Never have we intended to disrupt the "smugglers" passing through our system... in fact we allow them free passage with no fee whatsoever....
Except when you kill them though, with but a forum post of warning.
(06-10-2013, 05:22 PM)rainth345 Wrote: Even though we frown upon them... we don't try to stop them.
As above.
(06-10-2013, 05:22 PM)rainth345 Wrote: And please... unlike the ZA... we TAZ find, disseminate, and squeeze out EVERY POSSIBLE WAY to solve a situation DIPLOMATICALLY.
How is a brutally efficient base set to kill all that pass through from T-29 a "diplomatic solution"?
(06-10-2013, 05:22 PM)rainth345 Wrote: And that means without the use of force.
Define "force" - a base with a whole lot of weapon platforms set to shoot any and all non-registered boats isn't "use of force"?
EDIT: Your words to me are the essence of what I know TAZ for: Benign, wise, compassionate. Yet your bases behave(d) like Darth Vader's Death Star...
RE: Zoners - Thyrzul - 06-10-2013
(06-10-2013, 06:18 PM)Anaximander Wrote: Except when you kill them though, with but a forum post of warning.
They were told so, after all who's fault they went there regardless? There is a cake with a sign next to it saying it's poisoned. You eat it, you die, who's fault is that?
(06-10-2013, 06:18 PM)Anaximander Wrote: How is a brutally efficient base set to kill all that pass through T-29 a diplomatic solution?
That wasn't the solution, that was the incident. Seriously, wtf?
(06-10-2013, 06:18 PM)Anaximander Wrote: Define "force" - a base with a whole lot of weapon platforms set to shoot any and all non-registered boats isn't "use of force"?
See above. Seriously, why are you still beating a dead horse?
RE: Zoners - Anaximander - 06-10-2013
You said the reason one of them was built was to guard the sanctity of Bonito.
You said the reason the other one was set to kill all was because a couple of Outcast indies had been shooting at it.
You had problems (respectively rude guests and naughty Outcasts) and you used the weapon platforms of those bases to solve those problems. That's a solution, albeit not a diplomatic one.
EDIT: Nevermind though, we are going really far off topic. I hope you also see the point that it is within reason to believe that it is too narrow a circle of people that decide what everyone's experiences should be interpreted as, especially when it comes to bases that are highly deadly and very difficult to remove, and especially when they perform actions you wouldn't be allowed to on your ID. It's not good enough that 5 TAZ players and 5 101st players can agree on this is ok, with all the consequences associated for everyone else using those ID's. That's the danger with official faction exclusive access to bases - too few people are handed too much power without any checks and balances, it's not a guarantee of "better" bases at all.
RE: Zoners - Thyrzul - 06-10-2013
Official factions have way more responsibilities than advantages, sad to see, but these days it benefits the individual more to be independent from the official faction than be part of it.
RE: Zoners - Anaximander - 06-10-2013
That's debatable. Let's agree to disagree.
RE: Zoners - Trail - 06-10-2013
(06-10-2013, 07:06 PM)Thyrzul Wrote:Official factions have way more responsibilities than advantages, sad to see, but these days it benefits the individual more to be independent from the official faction than be part of it.
Sad, but true. If you are playing an independent character you are only bound by the rules. Someone part of an official faction has to also abide by a faction / community standard as other players can give feedback on the faction and player in question. But to be clear I favor additional rewards and reasons to be in an official faction.
RE: Zoners - Anaximander - 06-10-2013
Well someone playing as an independent also has to conform to the roleplay the official faction dictate, without having any real influence on it. Indies got responsibilities but no powers.
RE: Zoners - Occam Razor - 06-10-2013
(06-10-2013, 08:12 PM)Trail Wrote:(06-10-2013, 07:06 PM)Thyrzul Wrote:Official factions have way more responsibilities than advantages, sad to see, but these days it benefits the individual more to be independent from the official faction than be part of it.
Sad, but true. If you are playing an independent character you are only bound by the rules. Someone part of an official faction has to also abide by a faction / community standard as other players can give feedback on the faction and player in question. But to be clear I favor additional rewards and reasons to be in an official faction.
Also because playing in an official faction can be much more fun RP-wise. You got a background story, may RP with other factions in the name of yours, and also Fleet Actions with your faction are great.
RE: Zoners - Zen_Mechanics - 06-10-2013
(06-10-2013, 05:22 PM)rainth345 Wrote:(06-10-2013, 11:46 AM)Anaximander Wrote: You desperately want people to talk to you on the forum, so you create a gate-keeping base to guard a ship people are coming to pick up, knowing full well that it is a bug that the ship is only sold in your shop. You state that that is RP, but to me, if I wanted to pick up an Aquilon on a Zoner character, it would frustrate my sense of RP that I had to ask TAZ for permission for a Zoner ship.
I don't see how asking for permission "to dock and buy" an Aquillon from Pueblo Bonito frustrates RP....
In fact, doesn't it generate RP because there is a conversation between two parties? The reason we built Ravenhurst Watch was to stop lolwhuts from buying a Zoner capital ship... and then for some reason... decides to use it for "frowned" upon deeds...
Ex. The Two Outcast Corvo Cruisers....
Time and again we've seen Zoner ships used for piracy, aggression, and the such. And if you may have not noticed... we lifted the blockade a few week earlier...
Even so... your problems of "acquiring" the ship you want will be over when .87 comes.... the buying point will now be moved to O-74. So there's something to rejoice about....
(06-10-2013, 11:46 AM)Anaximander Wrote: (that you are situated along a vital trade route, and if you unsettle trade in the least you can expect the bigger guys on the block to crush you - not much difference between ZA and TAZ in this instance, really. Better English skills, nicer formatting and more skype friends, but the same self-sufficient approach, it seems).
Never have we intended to disrupt the "smugglers" passing through our system... in fact we allow them free passage with no fee whatsoever....
Even though we frown upon them... we don't try to stop them. ~Yes we frown upon them... especially Doc... since he is trying to cure Cardamine in-RP
And please... unlike the ZA... we TAZ find, disseminate, and squeeze out EVERY POSSIBLE WAY to solve a situation DIPLOMATICALLY.
And that means without the use of force.
Note: We are not responsible if Eris decides to bring her wrath upon you... we can only pray to Her Most Holy Lowness that she eases her judgement upon you. Thank you and have a nice day.
Right, "unlike" ZA, I wonder where is your "diplomacy" with the french, and it almost sound as if its a bad thing, surley you realize that in society there are many movements, not all of them are bound to be lefties. Ow and I might also add that you are Official, you have more responsibilites than a none-official faction, especialy when you have your own system. With that being said, I may find "Eris" to be de-grading and humiliating yet I don't match my factions beliefs to try and point something out. It would be better if you just use "common sense" - gracias.
RE: Zoners - Thyrzul - 06-10-2013
Doc had talks with the DeFrance boy a good while ago, I even stumbled upon it once, need a little search, but yeah, there were roleplay and diplomacy going on between TAZ and the Gallic Crown.
Indeed, it is sad that while it is understandable that we have more responsibilities as officials, I just don't find as many advantages of being official to counter said responsibilities. Might as well make a separate thread to discuss it later.
And it is ironic to see you talking about Eris in such a way when I regularly see some of your members from ZA greeting others in comms with "Kallisti". Are you Discordians too, or just thinking it is so cool and Zoner-ish to say hi with Kallisti? Do you actually know what it means and why TAZ folks greet with that? I wonder if I should ask the same about "common sense" too...
Indeed, it is sad that while it is understandable that we have more responsibilities as officials, I just don't find as many advantages of being official to counter said responsibilities. Might as well make a separate thread to discuss it later.
And it is ironic to see you talking about Eris in such a way when I regularly see some of your members from ZA greeting others in comms with "Kallisti". Are you Discordians too, or just thinking it is so cool and Zoner-ish to say hi with Kallisti? Do you actually know what it means and why TAZ folks greet with that? I wonder if I should ask the same about "common sense" too...