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+--- Thread: Missions are not worth it anymore (/showthread.php?tid=164646)
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - Titan* - 09-22-2018
You actually need 41-42-43 but mostly 42 and 43 level missions to make 150m+ per hour. Its starting from 4.2mil i think
I still think battleship bases should give battleship missions only, then reduce loot drops on NPC caps etc
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - Antonio - 09-22-2018
(09-22-2018, 11:27 AM)Greylock97 Wrote:(09-22-2018, 11:13 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: I think it would be better to change Hurricanes so that they can exclusively be mounted on Light Battleships.[color=white]RIP Antonio hurricane spam on his toku.
Catering for PvE over PvP should be a last last last resort, and it's not needed here. Hurricanes are solid enough in PvP and don't need a change there. Even if hurricanes didn't exist, nightmares would just replace them. Then what? Nuke every high damage missile in the game to cater for missions? No.
I have to agree that a global nerf wasn't necessary. Xi, Cambridge, Tau and whatnot are the spots that should've been hit and here are a few ways to do it:
1. Move house pilot sellpoints far away from the missions so people have to stack up valuable loot and then lose time hauling it to a sellpoint. They also risk dying in every additional mission they do.
2. Remove house pilots and standardize credit cards so all of them give the same reward and then work from there.
And in general choose what systems will be the mission making ones, standardize them so they can only be done in 4 sectors next to each other so people actually have a reasonable chance of finding you outside of your base, adjust it so the price doesn't go over 100m per hour. Missions can be activity hotspots but they certainly aren't now.
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - Aaron_Cianci - 09-22-2018
(09-22-2018, 02:40 PM)Antonio Wrote: Catering for PvE over PvP should be a last last last resort, and it's not needed here.
Two things:
1. You argued for these missions to be nerfed. By your own acknowledgement, there were only a few places that were worthwhile to do them. Couldn't be bothered to go find someone at one of the few locations it was valuable?
2. Why is it so important to you to screw up other people's game play, just because it isn't your game play?
As a new player trying desperately to catch up to everyone else, these changes severely impact my ability to participate on the server, and have made all the effort put into getting my battleship significantly less worth it.
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - Antonio - 09-22-2018
I did argue for them to be nerfed, rightfully so. I can't however impact how they got nerfed, you'll have to consult devs about that. Right now there are 2 viable money making methods in the game - ore trading and missions. Latter was twice as good as the former. If that isn't the simplest way to explain a blatant disbalance, I don't know what is. The only thing I wanted is for them to be equally viable; whether it ends up in buffing trade, only nerfing hotspots for missions or entire rework is not up to me nor do I have an impact on that.
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - Aaron_Cianci - 09-22-2018
(09-22-2018, 02:54 PM)Antonio Wrote: I did argue for them to be nerfed, rightfully so. I can't however impact how they got nerfed, you'll have to consult devs about that. Right now there are 2 viable money making methods in the game - ore trading and missions. Latter was twice as good as the former. If that isn't the simplest way to explain a blatant disbalance, I don't know what is. The only thing I wanted is for them to be equally viable; whether it ends up in buffing trade, only nerfing hotspots for missions or entire rework is not up to me nor do I have an impact on that.
There's one viable method now. You contributed directly to the destruction of the other one, because you thought it was unfair. Which it wasn't. You might have been able to manage $200 million an hour from those missions, but I certainly wasn't. I was lucky to do half that, because I'm not as skilled as you are.
You cannot foist blame off on the developers solely because the way they "fixed" a problem that wasn't really a problem wasn't under your control. You argued for it to be changed, and you got what you wanted. You are a faction leader. You are a loud voice on the server. Your opinion carries weight. Unfortunately, I've seen repeatedly during several discussions that you assume that everyone plays your way, and that everyone works the same way you do. It represents an insensitivity and lack of respect to every other player who doesn't play your way. And now it has had a direct cost to the server and players who don't play your way.
I can only hope that some of these changes are reverted, because I have no interest in sitting around shooting at rocks. My ability or inability to make an income to support my actual game play - which is primarily role play, not PvP - has a direct relationship to whether or not I stick around.
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - Lythrilux - 09-22-2018
(09-22-2018, 02:40 PM)Antonio Wrote:(09-22-2018, 11:27 AM)Greylock97 Wrote:(09-22-2018, 11:13 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: I think it would be better to change Hurricanes so that they can exclusively be mounted on Light Battleships.[color=white]RIP Antonio hurricane spam on his toku.
Catering for PvE over PvP should be a last last last resort, and it's not needed here. Hurricanes are solid enough in PvP and don't need a change there. Even if hurricanes didn't exist, nightmares would just replace them. Then what? Nuke every high damage missile in the game to cater for missions? No.
I have to agree that a global nerf wasn't necessary. Xi, Cambridge, Tau and whatnot are the spots that should've been hit and here are a few ways to do it:
1. Move house pilot sellpoints far away from the missions so people have to stack up valuable loot and then lose time hauling it to a sellpoint. They also risk dying in every additional mission they do.
2. Remove house pilots and standardize credit cards so all of them give the same reward and then work from there.
And in general choose what systems will be the mission making ones, standardize them so they can only be done in 4 sectors next to each other so people actually have a reasonable chance of finding you outside of your base, adjust it so the price doesn't go over 100m per hour. Missions can be activity hotspots but they certainly aren't now.
Why did you not argue this in your circlejerk thread that gave the impression of a vocal minority that felt ALL missions were terrible? Or even more so, that you failed to explain in depth the intricacies of which part(s) of mission grinding was problematic, and instead presented to the community that the entire system was broken? It's not really your fault that people will blatantly agree with you without thinking things through properly, but you do have a responsibility to present a fair and transparent argument - especially since the Devs seemingly ate it up on a whim. This is a cautionary tale I think.
To address your points: I think the PvE system in Freelancer is unique in that it can actually lead to PvP encounters. PvE is part of the interaction soup which makes up the basis for server activity. I agree missions weren't perfect before, but these changes went in the completely wrong direction. I would like to see the pilot sell points moved to locations that would encourage people travelling across distances to sell them - it'd create an interesting hybridisation of missions and trading, and follow the vein of hostile players ambushing mission grinders.
What makes Hurricanes problematic is their usage on Heavy Battleships, who don't really have to sacrifice anything when they change their loadout. Limiting this, and making them Light Battleship exclusive torpedos, would at least make balancing missions much easier. Hurricanes are the only viable means for Light Battleships to do missions. Changes to Hurricanes, whilst they might only be minor inconvieniences to Heavy Battleships, are punishing to Light Battleships.
I don't really know if the overall profit needs to be looked at because even according to yourself it seems like it's really only Xi and a couple others that generate high profit with less effort as compared to others. Although perhaps tweaks to missions for factions with Light Battleships could be done to make them more profitable, as arguably they are considerably harder than places like Xi. Then again, that could be hard to do as nothing might stop someone with a Heavy Battleship docking on such bases and taking missions meant for Light Battleships.
In regards to mission zones, personally, I'd much prefer it if players were encouraged to venture into hostile home systems and the like for missions. It'd create good oppertunity for additional interactions. That's not to say missions aren't hotspots right now. I think it really is just a case of players being lazy and wanting interactions spoon-fed to them, rather than taking initative and shooting the mission grinders that are visible in the playerlist.
(09-22-2018, 02:54 PM)Antonio Wrote: Right now there are 2 viable money making methods in the game - ore trading and missions in Omicron Xi. Latter was twice as good as the former.
Fixed. Please stop generalising because that is exactly the problem here.
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - Goliath - 09-22-2018
If you don't like Hurricanes, then don't use them. There are other missle launchers for you to try out.
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - Thunderer - 09-22-2018
Why not simply make NPCs not clump together like some do, since some don't? That's the best way to nerf the triple Hurricane mission meta.
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - LaWey - 09-22-2018
So i dont got it. Instead of normal rework, NPC armor was just increased? So no normal mission placing, jus that fast decision?
I for example dont care about sair missions, but damn, we expected mission will be made normal EVERYWHERE, instead of just adding armor to NPC.
How can i help with placing missions in right places? Because this situation begin annoy me. No normal PvE content, increasing armor instead of system rework, just because lolgate can farm. Damn it.
Also yes, as mentioned above, just make ship spawn in multiple waves from different directions
RE: Missions are not worth it anymore - Lythrilux - 09-22-2018
(09-22-2018, 03:29 PM)Thunderer Wrote: Why not simply make NPCs not clump together like some do, since some don't? That's the best way to nerf the triple Hurricane mission meta.
We can't change NPC behaviour because it's hardcoded afaik. That's the real crux of the issue. Unfortunately, the other option is to artificially increase the difficulty of missions, but that leads to situations like this. It's why careful, measured, case-by-case changes to missions would be the appropriate course of action.