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+--- Thread: Capital Ship Purchase Proposal (/showthread.php?tid=7633)
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - mwerte - 04-09-2008
' Wrote:Many of the official factions already dictate who can and cannot have their battleships. I rp that commodore windsor is the admiralty's liason, and the admiralty talks to the queen. Through this, I can claim that anyone else making such claims is an imposter, or claim that any battleship has been stolen. I can back it up with the QCRF. The RM, KNF, SA, and 101st each have a version of this mechanism, so any arguments against elitism is already moot.THIS is what makes such a system elitist. The "I was here before you and so therefore I can dictate what you fly" type attitude.
As RoS we'll occasionally see an indie Dessie or a BS and I always try to talk to them in RP first. if they respond in RP then I'm content. They don't even have to have a story behind it because Ingame RP > Forum RP.
And yes, for the record I'm against this proposal but would like to see BS and Cruisers moved to guard systems only.
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - Titan - 04-09-2008
That's right Elgato, as I said, we're far too quick to point a finger at someone and judge instead of trying to figure them out and understand them. The lack of RP is the main problem and as Del said some simply don't want to RP, sure, there are bad apples like that, every server, every community has them on this world. But there are and I can guarantee that, tons more people that simply do not know how to RP, but they can be taught and they certainly can be either made or already are..willing. The restrictions would in no way work and will never happen, but the fact that we, the players, can do something about this ourselves by helping others is entirely possible. Put a little faith in these people and at least try to talk before pointing a finger and saying "Cap whore!".
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - Eppy - 04-09-2008
Well, as is sales of the Outcast Dreadnought are suspended entirely in Outcast space, as that involves docking on Corsica, which is forbidden, and I haven't seen an indie Outcast Dreadnought (other than Glyph's) in over a month! I'd say it's been fairly successful just moving them to Guard systems, and I'd like to see it done with all the others, too, but I think people will really think twice about hitting the 'Buy' button if the know that there are lots and lots of people out there who can have them deleted for it...I know I sure as hell would.
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - skoko - 04-09-2008
' Wrote:Again this would bring up the reason why all other proposals like this have been rejected, its elitist, and does not belong in an online community. Everyone should have a fair chance of acquiring vessels that they want. Giving the faction leaders the ability do dictate what ships someone who's independent can and can not have, is a bit too much in my opinion.
Agreed.... my friend, you are right... most of indy cap pilots make a fatal mistake sooner or later and end up banned. On the other hand there is people like you who entered this game as unknown indy cap whore and turned into respected player on this server.... That is why, I think no one can dictate conditions for buying cap ships....
My point is
Every person have right to choose what he/she wants to fly and then make effort to prove him/her self on this server
Most of us are victims of cap whoring, YES, we must get used to it .... or in next version of Disco scrap all cap ships except Gb and problem solved....
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - chopper - 04-09-2008
Nah, I wasn't supporting the idea. And I wasn't supporting the idea of 'faction leaders' issuing it.
Maybe admin team?
About elitism as you put it.. Well, this whole server is pretty much elitism if you want to hear the truth.
Asking for people to RP is elitism.
Asking for people to respect our rules which they maybe don't agree with is also elitism.
It's nothing new.
I don't know your definition of elitism, but I know that my definition of elitism has nothing to do with proposed suggestion.
And I learn about elitism daily!
Elitism is something like.. Not being able to join the Phantoms.
Or not being able to get a Terrorist ID. Or not being able to become a Keeper.
Because you RP lousier then them. And they don't want you. Since they keep their standards, which you can't fulfill.
Or not being able to fly a Liberty dread in your faction, but your leader can fly it.
Or even not being able to become an admin.
Question is, is that a positive elitism or a negative one?
Reasons are : People could abuse Terrorist ID.
Well, people can abuse a Battleship as well, but it's still free for all ain't it?
I mean, disco is full of these things. And some are good, some are bad.
But most of them support RP and gameplay.
So, if putting that kind of positive 'elitism' is going to help the situation on the server, I will give my acceptance.
Much worse, in my opinion, are double standards. Which isn't rare as well.
I will say it again.
Collecting resources for your battleship isn't elitism. You would have a proof of your resources, and no one would be able to trick you out.
It wouldn't lower the percentage of capital ships, but it might teach people some RP basics.
That's what this is all about, after all, right?
Oh and, I also had a capital ship. I was trade-whoring for two weeks to get my Zoner Juggernaut..
I flown it to Tau-31 to protect 'traders' which were abusing bugged route there.
It took me around 1 hour of bouncing to go trough the asteroid field ( I didn't know about the gaps then).
2 Corsair GB's came at Harris. They killed me. I docked on Harris and exchanged the thing for an X-shuttle.
My BS history ends there. :-)
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - pchwang - 04-09-2008
Exactly...good RP builds respect, which leads to mutual trust.
If this goes out to the best possible situation...EVERYONE on the server can have a capship, and we can go back to having the all capship battles that we used to have. All it needs is a little magic and trust.
We can do two things:
1) Sanction people until they learn to RP.
2) Teach them how to RP.
While I'm personally in favor of the former, the latter is probably the better choice, as I favor the former due to the fact that I do not have the time and diligence to teach someone something about an internet game.
When people who do have capitalships learn to RP properly and make their presence known on the forums, the following will happen:
People acknowledge them and their RP.
People grow more accepting of them.
People begin to respect them.
People trust them.
It's all about trust. And here, the only way to build it is ingame, through your RP and interactions with your fellow players.
Remember that discovery is simply but an extension of real life. Things work the same way here...If you want to take your dad's vintage Aston Martin out for a spin and pick up some chicas, you need to earn his trust first.
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - Why? - 04-10-2008
Titan is 100% correct.
Jinx is 1000000% percent right.
You cannot force role play by telling people they cannot have something.
What that actually does is make them leave.
Players ruling players fails miserably every single time it is tried. The fewer people in charge, the better.
The things you people are talking about will drive people away. It is guaranteed. I have seen it happen with my own eyes.
Player councils, absurd insane rp rules, etc, etc, etc,.
There is only one end result of said things: An empty server.
Instead, how about pleasantly offering advice to the player you think is doing something wrong?
And I mean pleasantly.
Especially on the boards. The people you want in server will come to the boards first, and if they see flame filled threads, they will move on, without experiencing the good things that Disco has to offer.
I have see it happen before, as I mentioned.
The server was called Khaos Prime. It opened the day freelancer came out, and the modding started soon after. They were the first to offer a download, first new system, etc,etc,etc. They had many many extraordinarily talented coders and many very creative forum posters. The role play was great, and the server was always full.
But they forgot how to be nice to each other. And finally the flames and the absurd drama become too much, and half the server up and left to create a new one. It was called Excelcia.
Eventually, elitist role play and various flames and utter ridiculous hatred destroyed both servers.
Don't think that such a thing could not happen here, because it already started. Why do you think Angelfire had to 'take some time off?'
Disco has a phenomenal thing going. I really enjoy everyone here. But I see the signs, and I want to act as a warning.
I've seen too many communities end up in shambles because people forgot about being polite and respectful to everyone.
I really don't want it to happen again.
Edit: Just to make sure I am 100% clear, I believe the rules as they are right now is all that is needed. Everything else can be done in the game, via good role play.
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - Laowai - 04-10-2008
I agree with Jinx - again.
I read the RM cap ship ban thread with a fair bit of concern - the whole thing smacked of "We are telling you how to play here OUR way" - but thats a side issue.
I say leave the cap ships alone, stop whining about them, RP around people having them, use RP to deal with the issue, and yes - even help people to RP if they seem to be struggling with it.
A previous idea of giving faction leaders power over battleship purchases was completly denied by fellow Hoodlum in yet another cap ship post a while back - its not gonna happen, and until Igiss takes them out of the mod - they are here, get creative and deal with it. But i really think people should get off their high horse and stop trying to tell people what ship they should or shouldn't fly, or trying to make it harder or next to impossible to get certain ships that certain individuals dont like... thus achieving the same result by another means.
I'm having de ja vu here - Now here's what im thinking. Each time a group of bombers shows up and pwns my little cruiser, I'm going to start opening up "Bomber Whorage" posts... jumping up and down and looking to have them restricted.... wah wah because they ruin my day..... and if i cant have them restricted, im gonna have their prices changed, or only have certain people from certain factions be able to get them, i want to see less of them, because they interfere with my RP, and they show up to fights and blow up my ship nearly every time.....
Or not - i can just deal with it and Role Play the fact that they snapped my shiny cap ship......
oh.. wait, thats exactly what i HAVE done every time bombers have beaten my cruiser......
COME ON PEOPLE - it's not that hard.
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - skoko - 04-10-2008
' Wrote:Now here's what im thinking. Each time a group of bombers shows up and pwns my little cruiser, I'm going to start opening up "Bomber Whorage" posts... jumping up and down and looking to have them restricted.... wah wah because they ruin my day..... and if i cant have them restricted, im gonna have their prices changed, or only have certain people from certain factions be able to get them, i want to see less of them, because they interfere with my RP, and they show up to fights and blow up my ship nearly every time.....
That is funny ... haha... Yeeehaww let's crucify bomber whores !!!!
Seriously, I agree with you completely...
Capital Ship Purchase Proposal - chopper - 04-10-2008
Quote:Yeeehaww let's crucify bomber whores !!!!
:(:(:(