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+--- Forum: Discovery Mod General Discussion (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=37)
+--- Thread: Information about upcoming Zoner changes (/showthread.php?tid=112325)
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - t0l - 02-27-2014
the Fearless is ass ugly
you need your eyes checked
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - sindroms - 02-27-2014
![[Image: UMJZMI3.png]](http://i.imgur.com/UMJZMI3.png)
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - Coin - 02-27-2014
(02-27-2014, 12:03 PM)Kazinsal Wrote: The server works, we are treating no one any less here than we usually do, administration and roleplaying are not being mixed in a way that constituted powergaming or metagaming here (this is a development thing), and if you want my ass fired for ignoring rule violations in this thread, then the irony of claiming I'm mad about not getting a Corvo is so thick you could drown fish in it.
really kaz?
(02-26-2014, 08:04 AM)Kazinsal Wrote: This is why no one takes Zoners seriously.
you've managed to ignore the question - 'Why are the CL licensed to hand out zoner tech?'
development thing now is it? a few pages back it was about realism, until it was pointed out that the zoners are a wallpaper faction so SP wouldn't be over before trent got his jumpgate access, and now this is about
(02-26-2014, 03:59 PM)Jinx Wrote: if it is decided that going for transparency was indeed a good idea opposed to simply give you the results when its done.
seriously, this is not how to get what you want. You initiate a process of dialogue, and you then use reason and logic to persuade the people involved that what you are proposing is in their best interests. Its called politics. You're a dev of a small mod of an out-moded game, and you are treating a subset of the community, who coincidentally didn't hand over one of their toys to you, in a terribly high-handed manner. It is almost as if you have never been a manager/leader in your life. the realpolitik thing to do would have been to say to jinx, 'err, hold fire on that transport-for-cap-thing until the corvo thing dies down'. This is not transparency in the way that you think it is. transparency is saying 'what would you like to happen, and then selecting from the options given to create something wonderful - that the community loves you for. Telling people "we know what is best for you - now stop arguing, and don't mention the corvo" is like trying to act in the play, direct the play, write the theme tune, sing the theme tune, and be the critic as well as the audience. Im not saying that every faction should have input into every other faction, cos that would just be mayhem, but a simple 'official factions please provide us with a tl;dr of your current rp', and then you can 'suggest' directions. the leaders of the factions feel that their contributions are valued and valid, and a sense of community is engendered.
I'm concerned that , as a leader of this community, a simple well-known fact seems to have slipped your mind: Leaders govern with the consent of the populace. you can brand me a doomsayer all you like, but the fact remains that this mod is not as popular as it used to be. SC and ED are not out, WoW is dead in the water... is the whole planet playing candy crush? I couldn't give two hairy lugnuts about the transport or cap issue, im trying to get a developer to think about gameplay. transports are too easy to kill. this will get dull. i do not crave boredom, but excitement, which is why I ride motorbikes in south-east asia. I will be completely honest here, I don't play as much any more, as i find it really tediuous that no-one tries to pirate me, and there is no-one to pirate. delete the cloaks and jumpdrives, and have a goldrush in dublin, with the sell point somewhere like sig 19.
turning the caps into transports will not add any personal sense of achievement. grinding out a core four base, and then making jumpdrives etc etc, I can see that creating amazing sense of achievement - but we should not have been grinding out cloaks and JD's but armour or shields - things that would give us an edge in a fight, not things that made us impossible to find.
I'm not raging, or qqing or butthurt about the loss of zoner caps at all. im not mad at you, and im certainly not trying to point out your failings in a karlotta-style "nyah nyah you're stupid" pointless rant. I consider you to be a gamer who has put a significant amount of time into this community - 5 1/2 years is a long time - and all im trying to do is say "with the information that you have supplied thus far, you are making a mistake, and good friends don't let other friends make mistakes". you can take it the wrong way, and think that this is a personal attack, and become defensive, but lets be realistic - I've put in as much time as you have as into this community. you've been a developer, and ive been a player. without a developer, there is no game, t'is true. but without players, there is no game either.
Retconning is not the way forward. Please can you outline the other options that you considered, and explain why you thought amputation was the best surgery, cos I just don't get it.
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(02-27-2014, 01:03 PM)RichardNW Wrote:We over use this term a lot; we use it to mean 'i find this mildly amusing', but i did in actual fact laugh out loud. do you think it's like a balding man shaving his hair?(02-27-2014, 11:42 AM)Coin Wrote: if the social contract is breached, then players will leave. I hear that entropyis nice this time of year
Ya know, I think they are trying to whittle down the playerbase so that when the game eventually dies it won't be that big of a loss for them.
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - Soul Reaper - 02-27-2014
MFW zoner caps
![[Image: tom2.jpg]](http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/1814/1795/1600/tom2.jpg)
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - Highland Laddie - 02-27-2014
Quote:I'm concerned that , as a leader of this community, a simple well-known fact seems to have slipped your mind: Leaders govern with the consent of the populace.
Again...this is not a democracy. It's a game server. You play at the will of the server administrators and their designated staff. Know your place.
Quote:transports are too easy to kill. this will get dull.
You say this without knowing any of the stats on the new ships, so this is complete assumption and ignorance. This makes the argument much less valid.
Quote:I don't play as much any more, as i find it really tediuous that no-one tries to pirate me, and there is no-one to pirate.
This seems to run contrary to what is said in other threads about how there are so many transports out there power trading now and not enough pirates. So, there's a disconnect in your reality somewhere.
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - Major_Mayhem - 02-27-2014
(02-27-2014, 04:14 PM)Highland Laddie Wrote:Quote:transports are too easy to kill. this will get dull.
You say this without knowing any of the stats on the new ships, so this is complete assumption and ignorance. This makes the argument much less valid.
If 2 Bombers can take on any battleship with relative ease, despite the Battleship having ... well ... Battleship weapons, Hull and Shield, this assumption is save. No matter what. If you just take away the battleship guns (and replace it with either GB or Transport turrets), all you have is a slow moving, immanouverable target.
(02-27-2014, 04:14 PM)Highland Laddie Wrote:As leader of a trading faction: B*llsh*t! I can fly around on the server, on primetime, thorugh the bottlenecks favourited by pirates and not a single pirate shows up.Quote:I don't play as much any more, as i find it really tediuous that no-one tries to pirate me, and there is no-one to pirate.This seems to run contrary to what is said in other threads about how there are so many transports out there power trading now and not enough pirates. So, there's a disconnect in your reality somewhere.
Few hours later a member of mine gets pirated at low server pop, like 5 times within 2 hours.
So, some people are unlucky (me) other get a chance to RP with pirates, does'mt have much to do with "reality" just an statiscitallly wrong perception, sometimes simply due to the timezone you're living in.
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - Highland Laddie - 02-27-2014
Quote: If 2 Bombers can take on any battleship with relative ease, despite the Battleship having ... well ... Battleship weapons, Hull and Shield, this assumption is save. No matter what. If you just take away the battleship guns (and replace it with either GB or Transport turrets), all you have is a slow moving, immanouverable target.
This also depends on the skills and weapons layouts of both the bomber pilots and the BS pilot, so there's more to this than you suggest. Also, the argument that just because there COULD be bombers out there means you MUST have a battleship isn't a valid argument. Otherwise, everybody should have battleships. Zoners should be just as capable of adapting to those situations as the rest of us and not relying on brute strength of BS to counter all opposition. Let's not forget they DO have other combat craft available to them. They also have allies.
Quote:As leader of a trading faction: B*llsh*t! I can fly around on the server, on primetime, thorugh the bottlenecks favourited by pirates and not a single pirate shows up.
Few hours later a member of mine gets pirated at low server pop, like 5 times within 2 hours.
So, some people are unlucky (me) other get a chance to RP with pirates, does'mt have much to do with "reality" just an statiscitallly wrong perception, sometimes simply due to the timezone you're living in.
I'm also the leader of a trading faction, and I'm mostly on at low-activity times, so I'm aware how it goes. I was trying to establish a connection between this thread and this one:
http://discoverygc.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=112531&page=3
It seems people are complaining that there are too many traders around and not enough pirates. My question to that is then simply: "then why don't you make a pirate and go chase the traders?"
But, keeping with that line of thought...if there are so few pirates out there now anyways, that makes the claim that Zoners need a BS to counter pirate threats even more invalid.
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - Major_Mayhem - 02-27-2014
(02-27-2014, 05:20 PM)Highland Laddie Wrote: But, keeping with that line of thought...if there are so few pirates out there now anyways, that makes the claim that Zoners need a BS to counter pirate threats even more invalid.
On behalf of official factions, this argument has never been made. Not having read the major part of the posts in this channel, I assumed it would have something to do with the defencive capabilities of the Zoners and not use the capital ships to trade.
It is clear that many not so legal-factions have laid their eyes on Zoner Property, so Capital Sips might come in handy if need be. The TAZ and Phoenix exert their right of armed neutrality in order to discourage the Outcast of taking over Baffin, for example.
Removing the capical shipline would encurage said faction to forcefully take over Baffin. As there is enough RP for the strained relationship between TAZ and Outcast.
I am not, in no way argumenting the fact that Zoner lore does not support Capital ships. Since, it simply does not. However, it is also contradictory to the lore for anyone else beside the 5 houses to have battleships, or any capital ships for that matter.
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - Highland Laddie - 02-27-2014
Quote:I am not, in no way argumenting the fact that Zoner lore does not support Capital ships. Since, it simply does not. However, it is also contradictory to the lore for anyone else beside the 5 houses to have battleships, or any capital ships for that matter.
I think there are arguments to be made inRP for why at least the MAJOR pirate factions could produce and maintain capships that have a lot more validity than the Zoners do, but those factions also balance that benefit out by being unlawful. Zoners, with such extensive neutrality AND such presence in close proximity to House space, would have a hard time justifying it, imo.
Quote:It is clear that many not so legal-factions have laid their eyes on Zoner Property, so Capital Sips might come in handy if need be. The TAZ and Phoenix exert their right of armed neutrality in order to discourage the Outcast of taking over Baffin, for example.
While it may be plausible, the potential of an armed conflict doesn't necessitate a battleship to defend oneself. GMG are proof of this.
I would also be in favor of allowing SRPs to official factions ONLY for maybe 1-2 BS class ships to balance this out.
RE: Information about upcoming Zoner changes - Nexus Ark - 02-27-2014
(02-27-2014, 05:55 PM)Highland Laddie Wrote: While it may be plausible, the potential of an armed conflict doesn't necessitate a battleship to defend oneself. GMG are proof of this.
GMG had a whole system of Nebulae and exploding pockets to their advantage, where the same cannot be said in the Omicrons to launch a guerrilla warfare with. Not to mention the GMG in lore now owns 2 of the 3 Rhineland battleship in existence at the moment.