+- Discovery Gaming Community (https://discoverygc.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Rules & Requests (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=6)
+--- Forum: Rules (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=25)
+--- Thread: Split from Admin Notice. (/showthread.php?tid=12653)
Split from Admin Notice. - Seth Karlo - 10-01-2008
-Seth Karlo
Split from Admin Notice. - MarvinCZ - 10-01-2008
I can say only this: Go to the first post and read it again, not only the title. Try to understand what it actually says.
My understanding is this (feel free to prove me wrong):
(Such) orders between players can be issued in-RP and enforced by roleplay reactions, but they can't be enforced by server rules.
-MarvinCZ
Split from Admin Notice. - jshkornmiller - 10-01-2008
~Darth Malak
I agree completely. Something i never understood but now it is clear to me.
Split from Admin Notice. - n00bl3t - 10-01-2008
' Wrote:That's different because korrd supports the right of factions to declare indies KOS and call them traitors or spys, because... well, just because!
Eh. I will not support you in this line.
' Wrote:One question.
What about player created factions? Such as the AW and SCRA? Our diplomacy swings with the roleplay that goes on between us, can factions then dictate? Or should this be on an individual basis only? (i.e. chopper goes and shoots up some SCRA and not even a treaty between us can stop him)
AW are defunct?
' Wrote:I'm assuming you are being sarcastic here.
Surprisingly, no.
' Wrote:If a player wants to be an independent, they need to prove themselves capable of good RP and self restraint. Most are incapable of that, and that is one reason I now support factions regulating independents - you know I was the primary opponent of such only a few months ago, but after seeing firsthand how much poorly-played indies can **** things up, my mind changed pretty quick.
I think jpo used the word poppycock. I have to agree.
If that is the case, then Independents are held to a higher standard and should be the ones making PVP-whoring rules in the first place.
' Wrote:Does this mean I can go to Reinland now.. buy a capship and they CANT say anything/do anything about it as long as I rp it?
Just curious...
Whilst it has sarcastic undertones, yes. Go for it.
' Wrote:So to all you mega-faction types ... give us non-faction whoring types a little breathing room.
/signed.
' Wrote:Until you've actually tried to run one yourself, kindly shut the **** up. You have no idea how difficult it is to keep people in line.
I run two. (Along with being a co-leader of one on another server.)
Independence for the win.
Split from Admin Notice. - Eppy - 10-01-2008
...
*shakes head*
Split from Admin Notice. - n00bl3t - 10-01-2008
' Wrote:...
*shakes head*
Eh.
I thought you left lurker.
Split from Admin Notice. - Tenacity - 10-01-2008
Quote:My understanding is this (feel free to prove me wrong):
(Such) orders between players can be issued in-RP and enforced by roleplay reactions, but they can't be enforced by server rules.
Ok, I'll prove you wrong:
Quote:Therefore, the recent "orders" posted from some players are null and void from a server rules standpoint. Any server-side enforcement of such edicts are illegal and sanctionable as OORP behavior, because they amount to forcing someone else to behave contrary to their faction's diplomacy. These edicts may be issued "in roleplay", and passive persuasion may be employed to support them, but no one else will be forced to follow them.
While this doesnt relate to the order-liberty treaty since we are not forcing it on any players, and anyone who doesnt want to acknowledge it is free to do so (but must take responsibility for their own actions if they do), this does relate to similar situations such as capship registration and the like-
What xoria is saying here is that any attempt to force a player-made RP rule on someone else will result in the 'enforcer' being sanctioned for OORP behavior. That's what this whole argument for the past 7 pages has been about - the admins are basically protecting indy players who want to dick around and do whatever they like without taking responsibility for their own actions.
Faction players can be punished and restricted by faction leaders. Indy players are loose cannons that have nobody capable of controlling or limiting their power. Right now, according to the admins, a player can go buy an osiris battleship, waltz into new york, and start blowing up everyone who comes within weapons range - the server rules protect him, even though he's being an absolute idiot by doing so and is severely diminishing the reputation of all other order players on the server through relation.
When other players see this osiris tearing things apart, they dont direct their anger for his oorp actions at HIM, they direct it at THE REST of the order, primarily black squadron. So, apparently the admins dont want factions controlling independents, but they want everyone else bitching at the factions when the independents mess up. That's the problem we're facing - indies take no responsibility, and it hurts everyone except them when they screw up.
I'm not in any factions. I tried to start and run the Junker's Union for a while and frankly it was much harder to keep together than I thought it would be, I was humbled by that at least - it changed my view on how factions and independents should coexist. Whenever an indy junker smuggler got caught and bitched up a storm about it, the people who caught him come to me saying "hey, keep your people in line, this junker was carrying contraband and you say you dont allow contraband!". Well how the hell am I supposed to control what someone does when they arent part of my faction? Simply put, I cant, and neither can any other faction here right now. The hatred and retaliation always goes to the official guys, even when they have no way to keep things under control without being sanctioned for their actions.
The rules need to stop protecting players who screw things up, or they need to stop punishing factions for trying to keep everyone in line.
Split from Admin Notice. - Seth Karlo - 10-01-2008
*Sighs*
@Epyon: Knew you'd be back.
@Everyone else... why must we all fight? Can't we settle this over a pint? *Ducks from a flying chair thrown across the room*
Obviously not... *Runs*
Seth Karlo
EDIT: Tenacity, I actually agree with a hell of a lot of what you said there.
Split from Admin Notice. - Stoat - 10-01-2008
The admin team are dead right on this one.
You can still RP your differences.
Dead simple.
In no way does this stop any indie or group from following their chosen RP.
Please untangle your knickers.
Split from Admin Notice. - n00bl3t - 10-01-2008
' Wrote:The admin team are dead right on this one.
You can still RP your differences.
Dead simple.
In no way does this stop any indie or group from following their chosen RP.
Please untangle your knickers.
Stoat, that works well.
/signed.