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+--- Thread: PVP-Dead. (/showthread.php?tid=165654)
RE: PVP-Dead. - Sombs - 11-08-2018
If the person you RP'd with was enjoying the RP as much as you did, they will move to continue the RP with you. Alternatively, forum-RP.
RE: PVP-Dead. - Backo - 11-08-2018
(11-08-2018, 10:32 PM)Sombra Hookier Wrote: I have to agree with Vasko. This seems all unnecessarily squishy, complicated and intransparent. I still don't think there is any valid reason that justifies a person to stay in the system they just died in, when there are so many other systems you can just move over to without causing inconvenience or unimmersive appearances, though, and can only shake my head at some arguments here. By all means, I am here for the RP only, but the vehemence of people trying to enforce a "I desperately need to stay in this one of 120 systems" is the exact opposite of RP behavior. Nice for you if you can stay, but it looks doofy to anyone else seeing it. Especially the guys who just shot you down.
Meanwhile you can do text RP on the forum, unharmed and even better, openly visible to other people who might enjoy the read. As one of the people who click through any comm or story thread and often remain to read it fully, I can only suggest to just take certain things inRP and roll with it. Not being selective about the events but being selective about the impact they had.
I still think it's better if people are given a chance to stay in their own system once killed. Hell, even if we instate some sort of chivalry code where the defeated can ask nicely their attacker(s) if they're allowed to return if not by the rules that permit it outright but with certain restrictions.
Even if seeing dead people around ruins immersion is an ok argument, you gotta consider the fact that a lot of times what happens is something like the following scenario:
Outcasts in Alpha see 4-5 Corsairs have logged in Gamma. Outcasts fly 4 systems to Gamma. Outcasts ruthlessly engage the Corsairs after a few lines of insults/threats. Outcasts perhaps defeat the Corsairs. Now the only people in Gamma are the Outcasts and since there's nothing to do they fly back to Alpha or somewhere else. Gamma is a dead town.
In such a scenario, what's stopping the Corsairs from returning? It's THEIR home system after all. If they've been rescued at all, they should be there anyways. Surely a Titan would be easy to replace? And if Escape Pods have 100% success rate unless the player himself behind said character that is being podded decides to kill it off, what exactly is stopping said character to be quickly saved by planetary defenses of Crete and jump into a new ship? I personally feel much more disillusioned with roleplay when I see a SRP defectee ship return after destruction, no matter the amount of hours of pvp-dead.
As for "Meanwhile you can do text RP on the forum" - meanwhile you can discord erp and never play the game either. Here we're trying to figure out how to make more people play the game, not how to turn into a forum roleplay game. Stories can sometimes be a great read, I've even followed some with big interest, but ultimately I'm here for the game itself. And lately the game feels too dead to grab my attention and desire to log.
RE: PVP-Dead. - Sombs - 11-08-2018
Once again you decided to take an argument to the extreme.
Still doesn't answer why having to stay in one particular system is so incredibly necessary that we need to make the rules even more complicated, especially for new players. The entire crap with the "You are dead but also not dead and while dead-but-not-dead in the same system under the following conditions" is just as hilarious as this weird rule about transports that dock away from combat are not considered PvP dead. I rather encourage people to make use of the full spectrum of Discovery's systems - and rather encourage them to sit in safe zones if they don't want to die - than having complicated rules, people baiting into sanctions and confusion about who can engage who because of PvP-dead statuses. Simply my personal opinion. I never said you need to take everything to the forum or ERP on discord. I actually believe that the people who do that are not spending as much time on that as people believe them to.
Bait someone else, Vasko
RE: PVP-Dead. - Backo - 11-08-2018
With a server population of 20 people online, sometimes a single system is the ONLY system worthwhile for a given character. If I wanted to do nothing but PvE NPCs I'd play the campaign again. Excluding the Tau-29 event from 2-3 days back, the only 2 systems that ever looked worthwhile to be in on my Outcast were A) Omicron Delta and B) New York . Now let's say only Omicron Delta was my ZOI. I die there and sure I can go to all the other glorious systems such as Major, Tau-53, Omega-11, Drake, etc that have nobody in them. I'll sure have a great ton of fun interacting with the NPCs. I log the game to interact with other people and that is very hard when nearly all of the systems are devout of people to interact with. But you're going to say that people should just visit other systems, but guess what they rather log off than do that now. Currently we have more systems than players online. This means everyone can claim his own system where he isn't pvp dead and nobody will interact with anyone. Sounds fun, huh?
Personally most of the RP I've enjoyed lately has been with characters I don't know the people behind. People I don't feel all too comfortable to go and ask "hey I am dead here, how much of a bother would it be for you to fly 4 systems to the next freeport so we can continue the roleplay we had right before this?" If you have plenty of friends who are ready to do that for you, that's all great, but I imagine there's plenty of lone wolfs that want to have an enjoyable interaction continue after their pvp attackers have been done wiping the floor of system X.
RE: PVP-Dead. - Karlotta - 11-08-2018
I tend to agree with Sombra here.
We could replace "leave for one hour and not engage the players who killed them" with something like" may not approach hostile bases, go farther than 10k from an allied base, or engage anyone in the system they were killed in for 1 hour."
But is it really worth it?
If you think so, make a concrete example where you think the person should be allowed back right after or 5 minutes after his ship exploded, and how it can be made immersion breaking- and troll-proof.
Shortening the time to 1 hour is already something.
I'd also favor 1 hour over 45 minutes for simplicity in knowing when people are alive again, and because 30 and 45 minutes is hardly worth a differentiation between normal and contested systems.
RE: PVP-Dead. - Backo - 11-08-2018
(11-08-2018, 11:09 PM)Karlotta Wrote: " may not approach hostile bases, go farther than 10k from an allied base, or engage anyone in the system they were killed in for 1 hour."
That one I like actually.
RE: PVP-Dead. - Durandal - 11-08-2018
(11-08-2018, 11:09 PM)Karlotta Wrote: If you think so, make a concrete example where you think the person should be allowed back right after or 5 minutes after his ship exploded, and how it can be made immersion breaking- and troll-proof.
I'm probably going to regret replying to this, but I suggest you read this line of the proposed change very carefully.
Quote:May be considered a valid combat target after a grace period of 5 minutes after being given a chance to leave the system they were killed in.
This is the opposite of saying people can come back after five minutes. It is saying that if someone chooses to remain in a system they died in after five minutes, they become a valid target.
RE: PVP-Dead. - Sombs - 11-08-2018
I guess I simply made different experiences whenever I logged in the last four months. But then again, I never partook in PvP apart from the Helios battles, and there only as LF. To clarify, I didn't spend less than ten hours per week ingame, each week, which is pretty okay in my own opinion. Whatever happens on forum is additional fluff that doesn't touch my ingame time at all.
Always found something or someone, never died and had plenty of people to interact with between 16 and 23 UTC. Without logging with friends or set-up scenarios.
RE: PVP-Dead. - Backo - 11-08-2018
(11-08-2018, 11:15 PM)Durandal Wrote:Quote:May be considered a valid combat target after a grace period of 5 minutes after being given a chance to leave the system they were killed in.
This is the opposite of saying people can come back after five minutes. It is saying that if someone chooses to remain in a system they died in after five minutes, they become a valid target.
This could still be abusable. Like Corsairs all amassing into Alpha for a round two if the defenders manage to push them out. The only thing the defenders can do to stop any taunts is to re-engage them after the 5 minute grace mark. Which is also part of what I liked about Karlotta's suggestion of pvp-dead people being bound to friendly or at least neutral bases.
RE: PVP-Dead. - Goddess Astra - 11-08-2018
The problem with being bound to bases is that it's really difficult to actually figure out how that should work in practice.
Are you breaking the rules if you jump into a system where you died and there's no base within 10k?