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+--- Thread: Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? (/showthread.php?tid=50109)
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - ProwlerPC - 11-25-2010
' Wrote:Well, you save the world (twice) and bankrupt the Soviet Union and then come back to me and tell how it feels, =P
Get into a World War from the beginning instead of coming in fresh at the end, don't bother telling me how it feels afterwards, both you and I have no experience in any of this to compare it to.
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - McNeo - 11-25-2010
' Wrote:Well, you save the world (twice) and bankrupt the Soviet Union and then come back to me and tell how it feels, =P
Liberty wont charge into Rhienland, most likely due to possible downfalls in Diplomatic Relations... although with only 4 houses to bribe/extort it may be easier to take over one than say with 193 or however many countries (nation states) we have.
I dont think Liberty is like Gallia, Gallia wants to steamroll everyone that hurt it in the past (Liberty and Bretonia, Irony considering french dont like us much even now...)
Liberty (from my POV) wants to teach Rhienland a lesson for its libel/slander
' Wrote:Get into a World War from the beginning instead of coming in fresh at the end, don't bother telling me how it feels afterwards, both you and I have no experience in any of this to compare it to.
Careful, we're getting into that much-disapproved-of political discussion.
Aside from this, Liberty also has Boron and Platinum. I can't believe I even overlooked those. There's also planet Pittsburgh, which is one big excavation site.
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - Mayhem - 11-25-2010
I Don't beleive Liberty would steamroll Rheinland. I actually think the Rheinland people would unite better as a people if Liberty were to get any closer then they are. Although I imagine alot of people would be the same if such a Large force was close to your territory?
You also have the Revolutionaries, who oppose the government, but would rather not see their precious Fatherland destroyed by foreigners. In RP the Revolutionaries aren't a small group of people, I imagine they are quite a large force.
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - lw'nafh - 11-25-2010
' Wrote:I Don't beleive Liberty would steamroll Rheinland. I actually think the Rheinland people would unite better as a people if Liberty were to get any closer then they are. Although I imagine alot of people would be the same if such a Large force was close to your territory?
You also have the Revolutionaries, who oppose the government, but would rather not see their precious Fatherland destroyed by foreigners. In RP the Revolutionaries aren't a small group of people, I imagine they are quite a large force.
This, the RHA in particular is a group that no one should take lightly, at least in Discovery lore.
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - pipboy - 11-25-2010
' Wrote:The SP mission where you enter Rheinland comes to mind, with the dozens of capital ships positioned at every Jump Gate.I'm trying to see how that logic only applies to Rheinland. Liberty could put even more ships around each entrance to Liberty. So how exactly would Rheinland take Texas using that logic?
' Wrote:Dont forget that it is canon lore.and rheinland has 2 points to jump to texas but moving there whole fleet to take system will need lot of time too..Hamburg also has 2 points to enter it. Again, that logic can be turned both ways.
' Wrote:How much effort the USA needs to expend on doing what? If they -really- wanted to end the ridiculous notion of insurgency, they would've glassed the middle east. Sure, it'll cost a couple of Cold-War era multi-warhead ICBMs, but that's no great loss to their arsenal.McNeo makes a good point here. If the USA really wanted to put an end to the war in Afghanistan and the Middle East, and the USA was desperate and no longer cared about world opinion, they could end both fights in minutes. That would leave the USA completely free to fight on other fronts. It would take about as much effort to "end" both of those wars as it is taking me to write this sentence.
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - Gaz83 - 11-25-2010
' Wrote:I'm trying to see how that logic only applies to Rheinland. Liberty could put even more ships around each entrance to Liberty. So how exactly would Rheinland take Texas using that logic?
Hamburg also has 2 points to enter it. Again, that logic can be turned both ways.
McNeo makes a good point here. If the USA really wanted to put an end to the war in Afghanistan and the Middle East, and the USA was desperate and no longer cared about world opinion, they could end both fights in minutes. That would leave the USA completely free to fight on other fronts. It would take about as much effort to "end" both of those wars as it is taking me to write this sentence.
Yes, well, mr expert.
You are making one flawed assumption.
And that is that some such super weapon that no one has ever heard about exists within the freelancer universe.
Can you please tell me where such weapon exists in the FL universe please.
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - McNeo - 11-25-2010
I believe dresden was flattened in two days by ww2 era weapons. With the technology and weaponry in the employ of spacebound navies of the future, who knows what kind of superweapons they could deploy?
"Mister expert", nukes also exist in FL. A nuclear submarine now has enough of them to take out many millions of lives, how many can a spacebound battleship deploy from orbit around a planet?
They're just not billed "super weapons" because otherwise there really would be no inter-house wars on disco, due to the good ol' concept of mutually assured destruction. Shame that things here dont make sense.
Nukes would also unbalance the game if they were configured like the good ol' supernova mine of yore (50000 hull, 25000 shield, zero energy use to fire). I dunno about you, but nukes kinda unbalance the game of RL too, since it means that a small nation can retaliate on a very unbalanced scale against a much larger, well funded opponent. We dont have them here, probably because it'd be a whole lot less fun if we did. Not because of any lore reason.
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - Gaz83 - 11-25-2010
' Wrote:I believe dresden was flattened in two days by ww2 era weapons.
"Mister expert", nukes also exist in FL. A nuclear submarine now has enough of them to take out many millions of lives, how many can a spacebound battleship deploy from orbit around a planet?
They're just not billed "super weapons" because otherwise there really would be no inter-house wars on disco, due to the good ol' concept of mutually assured destruction. Shame that things here dont make sense.
Nukes would also unbalance the game if they were configured like the good ol' supernova mine of yore (50000 hull, 25000 shield, zero energy use to fire).
Yes, but you are making the mistake of assuming that rheinland does not possess the same weapon, and a defense for said weapon.
So "mr expert" wil suffice for now thanks.
Theres one thing they teach you in the army and that is: never under estimate your enemy.
Well I've told a lie really, they teach you much more than that, but that was the only part I felt relevant to this topic.
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - Walker - 11-25-2010
Quote:Yes, but you are making the mistake of assuming that rheinland does not possess the same weapon, and a defense for said weapon.
Screw it! They have MANPADS! Stop flying Helicopters!
Screw it! They BVR-AAM's! Stop flying Jet Aircraft!
Screw it! Russia is producing the PAK FA! The F-22A is utterly useless!
Screw it! They are using 7.62x51mm rounds with steel core penetrators! Get rid of our Ballistics Vests!
Screw it! They got ATGM's! Get 'yer arses out of that Abrams!
I think I made my point.
Applying the appropriate counter/defense to anything is the epitome of intelligent stratagem and warfare. Just because the other side has a counter, does not mean that the buck stops there. The saying that...
"The Victor is not the one who made the most correct decisions, but the one who screwed up the least.
Applies very nicely to this situation. I've been present in War Games that had seen my men and the other side exchanging fire for several hours. We would attempt to gain a positional advantage (Flank them, get closer to frag, etc... etc... Of course you have your 'free throws' like 40 mm grenade launchers, but those only go so far.) their commander would see what I was doing and act appropriately. He would refuse the flank or maneuver his men around to invalidate my tactics.
We ended up going back and forth; We tried ruses, we saw through each others feints. When one of us tried something, they countered, we tried to flip the counter over on them, sometimes it worked, sometimes both sides ended up going back to square one, which was often. Since we all acted appropriately, by the time it was declared a draw, I had hardly lost any of my men and likewise, the enemy's casualties were low as well.
If your going to compare two Military organizations, you need to look at a heck of a lot more than Firepower, Logistics, and Man Power.
Is Liberty REALLY more powerful than Rheinland? - lw'nafh - 11-25-2010
' Wrote:Screw it! They have MANPADS! Stop flying Helicopters!I laughed, though the actual point is hard to see tbh.
Screw it! They BVR-AAM's! Stop flying Jet Aircraft!
Screw it! Russia is producing the PAK FA! The F-22A is utterly useless!
Screw it! They are using 7.62x51mm rounds with steel core penetrators! Get rid of our Ballistics Vests!
Screw it! They got ATGM's! Get 'yer arses out of that Abrams!
I think I made my point.