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Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Printable Version

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RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Thyrzul - 03-21-2014

Currently the issue is that people bring specific caps where they shouldn't bring those kind of caps, and fight LN with OC caps instead of Rogue, Hacker, etc Libertonian unlawful stuff... so are you suggesting we give Rogues caps on par with OC caps so it will be more appealing for "noobs" to chose to pew LN with? Sounds like trying to keep people raping one chunk of roleplay by raping another chunk of roleplay.

EDIT: Of course I'd whine, OC shouldn't bring too much caps anywhere outside of Omicrons, Taus, and maybe Sigmas. There might be people only for the pew, but there are also people believing RP isn't dead yet and are here for that. A good compromise between the two is that shooty-shooty people can freely shoot others where it is logical inRP.

About that three points, I agree with 1. and 3. without question and would be interested in what you mean by 2.



RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Govedo13 - 03-21-2014

Nope the issue is not there. The real issue is the lack of the server activity and the idiotic system layout.You are too focused in the stupid RP background.
Ignore for the moment that the ships "models" are labelled with ID "X".

The issue is that Liberty is the only place in the whole damn server with enough activity to justify logging and currently the OC ID is the only one that allows interacting and pewing the liberty caps with full cap line while having docking places to resupply.
If the rogues hackers etc had battleships then people would had used them in the same way that in 4.86 people used Rheinland caps to raid NY.
The previous experience showed that killing such activity hubs(Dublin, Corsair/OC war/Omegas etc) by idiiotic restrictions and idiotic system layout brought nothing both for RP concentrated and for PvP concentrated players.

Still the same issue but other "model" with other "X". Nothing new.

The bigger amount of players around obviously does not care about RP, they just want to use the biggest pewboat around to pew stuff, the faster that you get it the better. Also why should they care if the RP have no real in-game effects? I bet they would care if you force them to RP in order to get the biggest pewboats.


Simple example of 2 would be to give factions edge of something for the begging and see how it goes for lets say 3 months.
Then you can hit with the whole program for refactionising the server..
Small edge would be for example-MK2 Cap guns that could be made only in level 5 pob for example and are proper guns not the current peashooters but comes with huge resource cost and are lost upon death. Then suddenly the said PvP wannabes would be wiped quite fast when they ride NY and would want to join the factions to have the said pewsticks and therefore must also RP.
Carrot and stick approach nothing more. Right now there is no stick only tons of carrots for free, so people get bored pretty much since their stuff is not worthy enough and by removing the carrots you active nothing.


RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Thyrzul - 03-21-2014

That issue mostly stems from the fact that Pennsylvania is still the only starting system despite of the idea of a neutral starting system with one-way jumpholes to house and mini-house centers popping up from time to time. I'm not even sure if devs have ever considered the idea. That along with stupid buffers and useless systems, yes, that's part of the problem too, I did not ignore that. Let's not ignore the RP part of the problem either, please.

In 4.86 it was Rheinland who battled Liberty, now it is Gallia, and for a good while Magellan was quite an activity hub (probably still is), so no, you can't say that the OC ID is the only one capable to raid Liberty with a full shipline. The activity is same as before, just the faction changed, ships changed, because the story changed. See? It's not hard to follow RP and still maintain activity on the server. And it was not the issue of "model" with ID "X".

EDIT: Oh, I missed one minor detail. Having docking places to resupply? Like, behind enemy lines, in hostile space? That is just plain stupid, OC caps shouldn't have that, nobody should have that, Liberty wouldn't have that should they raid Alpha either, neither Rheinland had that while they were battling in Texas, and they were quite fine, etc... It's would be just stupid.



RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Divine - 03-21-2014

More rules, more restrictions, more of everything telling everyone how to do their RP. It should be set as guidelines and the official factions should be given the means to cut those short to overdo the guidelines too much.
Do that a bit longer, and you'll have a server of people like Thyrzul playing with Thyrzul for the sake of Thyrzul (names are purely random and are in no relation to actual or former discoverygc-members).

//Edit: Actually the Contari Lance should do this argument for the Outcast-side, but hey... that's too much asked already, isn't it. I take because such a restriction on the OC-ID spares them to deal with the needed RP regarding any independent OC-player (rough guess with no entitlement to correctness).


RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Thyrzul - 03-21-2014

(03-21-2014, 11:46 PM)Divine Wrote: Do that a bit longer, and you'll have a server of people like Thyrzul playing with Thyrzul for the sake of Thyrzul (names are purely random and are in no relation to actual or former discoverygc-members).

Your randomness makes me blush.

Div, that change would spare you too from having to deal said indies. From your earlier comments I read that inRP your side of Outcasts is against this kind of compromising of the Maltese Nation by those indies, corect me if I'm wrong.



RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Divine - 03-22-2014

You don't understand. The past official factions position had been that there have been player-made inRP-laws for the use of capital class vessels. This has been a RP issue to be dealt with.
Putting it on the ID does take the freedom away for everyone to decide if they wish to, or not, ignore the inRP-laws of the NPC-faction they want to represent.

I'm still not in favour of Outcast capital class warships freely roaming around in Liberty, yet I'm against more server-side rules and restrictions. It encourages people to think less, as they go by what is written out on their ID.

I'd personally rather have to deal with all the Outcast-independents that'd violate inRP player-made-laws as to've any more server-side restrictions forced upon people.


RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Thexare - 03-22-2014

(03-22-2014, 12:01 AM)Divine Wrote: You don't understand. The past official factions position had been that there have been player-made inRP-laws for the use of capital class vessels. This has been a RP issue to be dealt with.

Are you actually allowed to enforce that now? I haven't been directly involved in a long time, but last time I was, I was told I wasn't allowed to do anything about people doing what their IDs allowed, regardless of the RP reason.


RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Divine - 03-22-2014

(03-19-2014, 09:06 PM)Divine Wrote:
(03-18-2014, 09:56 PM)Divine Wrote: ...
For the Outcast independent players that roll with capital class warships into Liberty, feel free to waste them on the spot whenever you catch them.
If an Outcast independent (or even factioned player) does pirate within Liberty, feel free to waste them.
If you got a problem with official factions operations within libertonian borders, feel free to defend your territory if that is what you think is the proper reaction.

//Edit: I might add, because I don't get tired to do so, if Nacion Maltese would still have a properly done set of inRP-laws both official factions would finally agree upon, we could even deal with the Outcast capital class warships inRP as we used to back in the old days. But alas...
Outcasts used to have an inRP-law regulating the deployment of capital craft vessels within Liberty: The original set of inRP-laws along with the faction-rights allowed the that time official Outcast faction to have the residents of Liberty deal with the situations, and if nothing else worked out to stop the issue with independent capital craft trying to invade libertonian territory. An easy message with evidence by one of the local unlawful factions (Hackers/Rogues) usually had those indepentend players reputation with the Outcasts altered quite fast.

Would the Contari Lance finally get their [...] to the table and work out a standing new set of inRP laws, we could finally enforce such again. And deal with issues like the into Liberty running independent capital ships inRP again.

So as this still claims to be a RP-server, how about you all stop requesting such things on the forums, which will later eventually result in more ID-rule restrictions, and instead go bug the Contari Lance to finally get to the discussion and care for the nation-wide Outcast-RP, which they to now failed to do terribly, so we could have all this troubles caused within Liberty resolved within RP, by the players, as it used to be.
And it used to work. Used to work really well tbh.
Quote:Faction Right 2. Official player factions have authority over players of the same NPC affiliation, as long as RP justification is provided. This authority applies in forums and in-game, and applies to player faction diplomacy, and strategic and tactical direction, however, exercise of that authority, on the forums and in game, is restricted to official faction members with the rank of the official faction leader and second in command(s) of the faction. The authority may be exercised through the use of in-game in-RP orders, which, if not obeyed, can result in in-game in-RP consequences (arrest, court martial, and even "lethal" force in extreme circumstances). Official player factions cannot, under any cicrumstances, require another player to follow non-canon RP if that player doesn't want to. In case of IDs with multiple official factions, this right is nullified and cannot be used by any of the factions.

(03-22-2014, 12:23 AM)Thexare Wrote: Are you actually allowed to enforce that now? I haven't been directly involved in a long time, but last time I was, I was told I wasn't allowed to do anything about people doing what their IDs allowed, regardless of the RP reason.
If that is the case, the admin-team should rewrite the rules to reflect that.


RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Ryummel - 03-22-2014

You developed a sickening obsession toward CL.


RE: Remove Liberty from the Outcast Zone of Influence. - Divine - 03-22-2014

Which would stop would they start to actually get to the desk and do the things an official faction should do, as we cannot push anything through without having both factions agree.