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+--- Thread: PVP Trial feedback thread (/showthread.php?tid=127816)
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - Mephistoles - 03-30-2015
(03-29-2015, 01:38 PM)Mephistoles Wrote: Does this mean repair ships are going to be given repair turrets?
http://discoverygc.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=127421&pid=1653411#pid1653411
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - Jack_Henderson - 03-30-2015
It is a generally positive change.
It has, however, one pretty large problem: It discourages teamplay, by keeping transports (especially small numbers) from flying together.
Let me explain:
Before the change, when 2 non-noob transports came under attack, one fed the other and it was a near 100 % success. Near 100 % success if of course a massive motivation to do it. I of course know as well that it was much too effective and overpowered, so I am not too sad that it is gone.
Problem: Now there is no advantage for small numbers (1-3) of transports (especially > 3,6k, who have no CD and CM) to fly together. If they get hit, one dies. Defending each other successfully is not possible on transports. Short turret ranges, clumsy movement, lack of means to "cover someone else" make it hard or impossible to really cooperate.
Before: you always win by flying together
Now: you always lose one transport, even if you cooperate
Of course the "PASSIVE DEFENSE" of passing bots around was too effective and also too easy. There is really nothing challenging about it. So that's fine to lose this way... IF...
... IF we can get some sort of "ACTIVE DEFENSE" that allows transports to help each other. Just a fast brainstorming came up with this:
> Transport Flak: like the cap one, ofc with less damage, but especially meant to flak away missiles and torps. Would take away quite some cargo space (so that powertraders will not use it, but groups that organise to fly together would sacrifice the space)
> Anti-Missile Missile: working like a CD, but only bumping missiles away (Haste mentioned that when we talked about new escorting, so I mentioned it here. Ammo based, it could be balanced with number of torps, etc).
> Turret range: at the moment, covering each other is next to impossible. The range of turrets (especially the Dulzian anti snub) is really low. While they all pack a punch and allow armored Transports with skill to give a fight to a solo bomber, covering each other is near impossible. Only large numbers of transports can go offensive and chase. Our small group here cannot effectively support each other.
Summing it up: I'd like transport teamplay to give an advantage in survivability, pvp participation and playing fun for small groups of transports by giving them sometimes they "can do". They lost the (too powerful) passive defense botsharing. They should get an active defense toy that encourages flying together more than just "perhaps they select the other guy and not me".
Jack
P.S: By the way, the new escorting way is awesome. That part is already a really good change.
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - Alley - 03-30-2015
(03-30-2015, 01:11 PM)Jack_Henderson Wrote: > Transport Flak: like the cap one, ofc with less damage, but especially meant to flak away missiles and torps. Would take away quite some cargo space (so that powertraders will not use it, but groups that organise to fly together would sacrifice the space)
> Anti-Missile Missile: working like a CD, but only bumping missiles away (Haste mentioned that when we talked about new escorting, so I mentioned it here. Ammo based, it could be balanced with number of torps, etc).
> Turret range: at the moment, covering each other is next to impossible. The range of turrets (especially the Dulzian anti snub) is really low. While they all pack a punch and allow armored Transports with skill to give a fight to a solo bomber, covering each other is near impossible. Only large numbers of transports can go offensive and chase. Our small group here cannot effectively support each other.
Transport Flak: sounds good, can look into it.
Missile: missiles are not very reliable
Turret range: I believe Haste is currently looking into transport turrets.
Either way, you should expect balance changes from this change. So far it has proven to be pretty positive.
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - The Liberty Rogues - 03-30-2015
Transports need a turret split in any case.
Giving dulzies more range means that you make ships such as the Annapurna and Armored Trans and even the Gull just insane.
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - Jack_Henderson - 03-30-2015
Alley Wrote:Transport Flak: sounds good, can look into it.
Missile: missiles are not very reliable
Turret range: I believe Haste is currently looking into transport turrets.
Either way, you should expect balance changes from this change. So far it has proven to be pretty positive.
Yep. Positive indeed.
And thank you for looking into it.
Awesome changes are pouring into Disco these days!!!
(03-30-2015, 01:23 PM)The Liberty Rogues Wrote: Transports need a turret split in any case.
Giving dulzies more range means that you make ships such as the Annapurna and Armored Trans and even the Gull just insane.
The Annapurna is a freighter now. So that one has been defused.
And ye, small pvp transports have always been a problem. I agree.
The solution there could be:
> make the guns energy hungry
> make the cores of the small pvp transports really small
> only keep large enough cores on "real transports".
The only fix I can come up with fast.
Jack
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - nOmnomnOm - 03-30-2015
Flak turrets for transports? You might as well then give it to cruisers too. But that will render novas less useful. You can already dodge novas if you are smart about it . I killed a rogue bomber with 2 novas before on my ptrain.
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - Alley - 03-30-2015
sounds good =/= it's getting implemented
when will you learn
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - Highland Laddie - 03-30-2015
Quote:Turret range: I believe Haste is currently looking into transport turrets.
Would definitely help. As it is...900k or less for the anti-snub turret is just silly when a bomber can torp you from over 2k away.
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - Scotia - 03-31-2015
Positive change. I know I for one do not enjoy being in a snub furball and seeing a heavy cap ship come in and just bot and ammo feed away. Always tempts me to cut the engines and call it done to the unnecessary fight duration increase without the "fun" element.
RE: PVP Trial feedback thread - MÃmir - 03-31-2015
Another good call!
(03-30-2015, 03:42 PM)Highland Laddie Wrote: Would definitely help. As it is...900k or less for the anti-snub turret is just silly when a bomber can torp you from over 2k away.
Sorry, but you must be the worst transport pilot in the history of Discovery if you get torped from 2K range. Just sayin'. If you do buff transport turret range, please make sure that Very Heavy Fighter and Heavy Fighter piracy is still viable.