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+--- Thread: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? (/showthread.php?tid=169104)
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - Enkidu - 03-27-2019
(03-27-2019, 10:17 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: At least the illusion that our choices mattered but the bubbling undercurrent of people wanting something more concrete. Or if not that, organic rolpelay was not affected by forced story stuff and interventions. Now more than ever, there has been a massive disconnect between what the Developers want and what the community wants.
I'd say we have more of an illusion of agency, and more actual physical agency, now. Most of the old organic RP that happened never touched the mod so we never had these conversations in the first place. This isn't to say anybody is acting entitled. There are completely valid criticisms with it not being perfectly clear where the line was drawn.
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - Laura C. - 03-27-2019
Devs did some things wrong, no doubt about that, and they deserve to be criticized. Community made it clear, OFLs made it clear in respective Discord chats. And as far as I can tell, devteam realizes it and tries to learn from it, especially on level of communication, at least this is the impression I have from discussions on Discord.
But claiming something about "worst devteam ever" or "biggest disconnect between players and devteam" is overreacting. I am surprised to see how many players forget that few years back there was little to no chance how players were able to directly affect storyline and ingame assets. There were no direct communication channels, no discussions, nothing.
(03-27-2019, 03:17 AM)JonasHudson Wrote: When something of greater value is at risk, it may start out with one side being outmanned or outgunned, but that free flowing situation can also be a good motivator to draw in players with an offer of working towards the sandbox goal.I will counter this idea with different point of view. If something such important as stations or even planets will be at stake, it will bring the worst from the community. We have this experience already from POB sieges. No more fightining just for fun of it. Instead, players will be yelling and swearing at each other after every loss. Ganking fests will be the norm, because that´s the best way to win, there is no space for fair fights when something is at stake. Veterans will be blaming newer players for not having enough skills and thus causing their side losing. Lots of salt and tears on forums afterwards, lots of stress and disappointment feelings...
I am not sure if this will help the community in the long run.
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - pulha - 03-27-2019
Best idea I read to counter biased accusations was implementing a "house" system
Explanation
Pick up the current division of systems
Nomads worlds
Edge worlds
Bretonia
Liberty
Kusari
Rheinland
Galia
Or make a new one like
Omicrons
Omegas
Taus
Etc
Etc
With this each faction represented in that "house" votes for a person to be the story dev in charge of "defending" the said "house"
This person cannot be high ranked in other "houses" factions besides the one he's elected for.
Picking on bretonia as example
Baf
Bpa
Molly
Gaian
Bowex
Gateway
Bmm
Zoners
Outcasts
Etc
Every faction with a base in bretonia
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - sindroms - 03-27-2019
Half of the issue comes with the fact that over the course of 5 years, Discovery has assumed that the story is player driven, even though it is obviously never been.
The only player driven part is how you adapt your faction/group/individual character to any change that the game server owners put in front of you in terms of updates and story progression.
The stupid thing about is that over time the devs have tried to hear players (aka leaders) opinions on the progression to make sudden changes less jarring. Somehow this attempt at helping the players to implement these changes has gotten lost in translation and suddenly the leaders think they are building the story, when in practice they have no impact on it - a.i any actions can be retconned if they go against the story team.
And when this happens, or if a story push happens now people are under the misguided assumption that something went against their wishes - when they had no steering wheel to begin with.
smh
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - Ash - 03-27-2019
(03-27-2019, 11:41 AM)Laura C. Wrote: But claiming something about "worst devteam ever" or "biggest disconnect between players and devteam" is overreacting. I am surprised to see how many players forget that few years back there was little to no chance how players were able to directly affect storyline and ingame assets. There were no direct communication channels, no discussions, nothing.Couldn’t agree more.
We need to remember that the community take the back seat when it comes to development. We’re just along for the ride.
We can yell about where we want to go all we like. But that doesn’t mean that we get to drive or play navigator, or indeed would be able to given the chance.
Since the dev team opened the door to input from the community, moreso than not it has been used as a portal to hurl criticism at them. Time and time again they open the stage to suggestion and feedback and get absolutely slated by players.
So i’d say don’t be surprised if they ever choose to close that door. As is their right.
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - Lythrilux - 03-27-2019
It cannot be considered a healthy way of doing things for the community to be seen as no more than puppets on strings, or robots with a directive to do the developer's bidding. This is what has, and is, contributing to people losing motivation and leaving the game. We have a falling player count.
You can argue that there was considerably less input from players in previous years, but are you seriously trying to argue that was a positive thing? Consider the Rheinland-Liberty war: it was forcefully ended by the developer's and we lost a seriously good activity generator. The Gallic war had a narrative that seemed largely artificial, and as I've said previously, it's my belief that rhe forced story of the Gallic war is exactly why its taken so long to resolve. Oh and let's not forget the Kusari Civil War, jesus christ.
Also consider that the moments when Disco activity and roleplay was at it's highest was when organic player roleplay took center stage in the community. That's what we need more of, not less, and the recent Omega stuff is the exact opposite of organic and dynamic story progression.
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - Victor Steiner - 03-27-2019
I don't quite see how bowing to the fickle whims of factions and OFLs helps disco's player count.
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - Lythrilux - 03-27-2019
(03-27-2019, 01:11 PM)Victor Steiner Wrote: I don't quite see how bowing to the fickle whims of factions and OFLs helps disco's player count.
The moments when our activity was the highest was when the players had, or at least felt like, they had control of the story. The Fp11 stuff comes to mind, and before it's potential was wasted the o-3 conflict could have been of the same calibre.
We've already had several people declare they've left the community or have had their motivation for Disco considerably reduced in wake of this.
It's not healthy, and I cannot understand why all these years later people still haven't got the memo and done something about it. We're a community. We should be coming together to achieve things together.
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - Laura C. - 03-27-2019
(03-27-2019, 12:56 PM)Lythrilux Wrote: It cannot be considered a healthy way of doing things for the community to be seen as no more than puppets on strings, or robots with a directive to do the developer's bidding.That´s true. On the other hand, in my opinion the storyline cannot be completely player driven either. In some situations it doesn´t work due to several reasons. There should be compromise of both.
(03-27-2019, 12:56 PM)Lythrilux Wrote: You can argue that there was considerably less input from players in previous years, but are you seriously trying to argue that was a positive thing?I didn´t say that. My point is that while criticizing the devteam is fine, players should not forget that current devteam, despite their flaws and mistakes they made, is still way better than what the community had in the past.
(03-27-2019, 12:56 PM)Lythrilux Wrote: Consider the Rheinland-Liberty war: it was forcefully ended by the developer's and we lost a seriously good activity generator.I remember it and while I disagreed with ending it the way it was done, in my memory is that it was not that great activity generator in the final stage when it started losing its breath. And that´s logical when the same war is going on for several real life years (and on top of that with little real ingame development). Liberty playerbase simply got more interested in fights with Gauls so sometimes Rheinland raid party went to Texas just to find nobody to fight with, sometimes even despite few LNs and LNSs were online.
(03-27-2019, 12:56 PM)Lythrilux Wrote: Also consider that the moments when Disco activity and roleplay was at it's highest was when organic player roleplay took center stage in the community.You mean drama? Dramas always bring higher activity ingame and on forums, and in most cases it´s a good thing, but they also work mostly in short-term period and in limited ingame area. They cannot be the main long-term source of activity for whole ingame universe in the long run. Not to mention that some of them cannot be taken seriously and introduced to the lore. Remember Zoner Alliance for example...
RE: Poll: Should we have a redo Player Event at Aland? - Madvillain - 03-27-2019
Funny, didn't see the same people who care a lot about the shipyard go easy on the zoners in gc. I also see an official faction leader promoting disruptive gameplay because things don't go as desired, and hate/anger as fuel for people to log. Sandwich time maybe?