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+----- Thread: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback (/showthread.php?tid=126079)
Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - Echo 7-7 - 02-13-2015
It's the thread you've all been waiting for! Hold nothing back* as you post to your heart's content concerning any and all aspects of mining.
A few rules:
1) Tag your posts appropriately with a clear title.
Your post will either be about ore mining or basic mining.
Bug: you know or suspect you have encountered something that is not working as intended.
Balancing: you would like to suggest an adjustment to existing values such as drop rate or field position.
Feedback: you have something to say regarding the overall mining system that doesn't come under the other two categories.
2) Don't post in reply to someone else's post. This is not (currently) a discussion thread so clear reporting of (potential) issues is the priority.
RE: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - Karst - 02-13-2015
----(MOSTLY) SCRAP RELATED BALANCE----
Incoming wall of copy paste. This has been built up for a while.
Junkers are indeed pretty much screwed by the current prices, much like ALG was pretty much screwed all this time previously ever since Premium Scrap became a "real" ore.
Well, not quite as much, they do still have three sell points at Okinawa, Singapore, and Chalons-en-Champagne.
I imagine there's probably changes planned.
What I'm curious about though is why DSE are now as good at mining Premium Scrap (not just regular) as Junkers and ALG, and actually better at selling it than Junkers because they get the Yokohama sell point.
A minor bonus on regular scrap makes sense I guess, and that's what they had in the latest draft of the new mining bonuses that I saw. It seems DSE themselves also neither requested this nor new about it beforehand (and most probably still don't).
And before anyone says they don't get the 14k sell point, the Yokohama point is balanced equally for the distance (and connects perfectly to Nagano where they can steal/buy Samura's platinum).
It kinda sucks for ALG and Junkers who have specialized in scrapping since vanilla that another mining faction suddenly gets the same bonuses they do, and that's in addition to top tier bonuses on Copper and Platinum as well as a medium Silver bonus.
Picture this:
[some guy] "Okay, I want to mine premium scrap so I'm considering making an ALG ship."
[me] "That's great! I can show you how to-"
[some guy] "But why wouldn't I just make a DSE ship, which can do the same but also mine three other proper ores, and doesn't have legal issues in the main mining area?"
[me] "..."
Is this intentional? If so, why does DSE get four proper ores (AND regular scrap) and no other faction gets more than three?
For Junkers and ALG, this is all we have. We're not like DSE, Daumann or whatever other mining/industrial faction that doesn't fully specialize in one commodity. Scrapping is what we do, so I'd expect that at the very least, we'd be better at it than anyone else.
I don't mean to be all anti-DSE. What I do want is my faction to be excellent at what we specialize in, better than factions that do not specialize in the same things.
Let me put it this way. The current changes are basically the same as:
Kruger suddenly gets the same 4.0 bonus as BMM on Gold ore (that's the premium scrap).
BMM's other 4.0, Beryllium, is cut in half to 2.0, and Kruger also gets that (that's regular).
Giving DSE both Scrap and Premium means they get more ores than any other faction. Yes the regular scrap bonus is low, but it's the same as ALG's which is supposed to be specialized in it since the company's founding.
The initial mining draft gave us a slightly lower regular scrap bonus than Junkers in return for a slightly higher Premium Scrap bonus.
I was already skeptical since the mining time for Premium Scrap is largely irrelevant due to the length of the routes, while the mining bonus for regular scrap is extremely important for the opposite reason.
Now we not only do not get a higher bonus on Premium Scrap than Junkers, but DSE get the same and to top it off, our Regular Scrap bonus is cut down to half the Junkers', on par again with DSE, plus the Council, EFL, and even the generic miner ID.
Basically, regular scrap is nonviable for us now, since mining time is extremely important when the trip times are so short.
Don't get me wrong, it's nice that we finally have proper premium scrap routes, but that isn't really a "bonus". That's just a way overdue normalization of sell prices.
And at the same time, our regular scrap got ruined and Junkers and us are no longer uniquely capable of either. It doesn't make sense in roleplay and it doesn't make sense for balance' sake.
(02-03-2015, 06:38 AM)Karst Wrote: MUNICH SCRAP FIELD INACTIVE
Seems to have happened at some point yesterday, as it was fairly normal earlier in the day while being completely unmineable later in the evening.
Counted barrels just now and got 239 out of 50 on a quad mining turret Golem....little more than a field that's been completely turned off. This is not a viable mining location with those drops.
Edit: Whatever it was, it's fixed. Thanks a bunch!
I was extremely relieved to have found this fixed, with drops back to their regular 30-50 early today.
However, as the day wore on, a feeling of dread rose within me.
A nightmare from days long past was stirring, though I tried to ignore it at first.
But now, in the early morning hours, long after I should have gone to bed, I had to face the terrifying reality: the field wasn't fixed at all - FIELD DRAIN IS BACK!
Cannot find any other explanation for why the drops were so good to begin with and so godawful at the end.
From around 30-50 to around 6 within one day.
Please tell me I'm imagining this. Please tell me this is a mistake. Please tell me that godawful feature is never coming back.
I'd also like to bring back something from a long, long time ago: At some point years ago, when Aet was still mining lead, I asked why the prices for certain ores were so comparatively low in Gallia despite longer journeys.
I was told this was because jump trading abuse ruined the economy (which it does) with sell prices that are too high - but since the original adjustment of Pscrap to 14k, that's obviously been out the window.
This concerns ores like Silver, Copper, Cobalt, Gold, and Uncut diamonds, which based on distance should have much higher prices in Gallia.
tl;dr: DSE cannot legitimately have the bonuses they have, they make them far superior to any other mining faction.
Regular scrap for ALG is unfairly low, considering we only have one other mining commodity and specialize in scrap.
Sellpoints for Pscrap for Junkers are too low. We all know how Congress ruined it for them by jumptrading ridiculous amounts of Pscrap to Alpha, but this should have been fixed by removing jump trading much, much earlier, not ruining Pscrap for all Junkers.
Sell points in Gallia for many ores are much too low, considering the price cap is clearly no longer in place.
Oh and one more thing, why are Uncut Diamonds permabuffed in New London? Their buff was just never turned off, I'm not sure how many people even realize this.
Thank you for your time.
RE: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - Ponge - 02-13-2015
Silver ore balancing
I found that the silver ore drop rate is quite low in Humboldt, 50-60 ore per 10 rocks, this is third/half of maximum rate. As the high price sellpoints for silver ore has been moved further (New Tokyo), and the Cali Minor price has been significantly lowered, would it be possible to normalize the drop rate of the Humboldt silver field?
Also, based on the same, the Pennsylvania silver ore field could also be turned on, but maybe not to full drop rate (to provide another cash earning opportunity to beginners besides Helium mining).
RE: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - Karst - 02-15-2015
====Golem Mining Ability====
The Golem is the largest mining-capable vessel by a giant margin.
I'm surprised I don't hear more qq about this to be honest, I guess that's because most people own indie Golems themselves.
Either way, it isn't fair for it to be capable of solomining the most valuable commodity in the game with a cargo hold of that size, and I'm saying that as ALG leader.
For the sake of balance it shouldn't be able to mine premium scrap, regular scrap and toxic waste (lel) could stay I guess.
RE: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - KamiKatze - 02-15-2015
=====Overall Mining Possibillities=======
Feedback:
This is just my two cents, nothing more. I am fairly new to the GC server, so I am used to other servers. Testing out all the different mining possibilities, I found the opportunities rather dissapointing. My proposal would be to just offer more places to mine at all. There are literally dozens of unused fields all over Sirius and I would suggest enabling more of them. I am aware that fair balancing is a big chunk of work, but more mining spots would also enable more activity in certain zones, wich are currently underdeveloped. For a fair ammount of ores there is only one and one place only to get it. This is rather unlogical if you read all the infocards about the planets and clouds and wich minerals are supposedly available there. All I'm saying is - spice it up a little. Give certain regions activity boosts by enabling mining spots.
=====Mining Alien Organisms in Buffin=======
Bug:
At least now the mining of Alien Organisms in Baffin does not work at all. I tested it with GMG (Garanchou, GMG IFF/ID, Mining Array) and a Zoner (Osprey, Zoner ID/IIF, Mining Array) and both yield absolutely Zero result. You always only get 100% water in your hold. This should be repaired at least to make it doable again. Of course with lower droprates than O. Theta.
=====Mining Irridium in Omicron Delta=======
Balancing:
I tried minign there and besides the political turmoil recently in this system the only mining spot for Irriidum is certainly lacking with droprate/yield. I personally like the idea having dangerous far out mining spots, where even yellies stop by to harass you, if those would be options worth the risk and time to get there, safely get the ore wich often would require an escort, and getting good prices for it. Irridium, at least now, is no that valuable but that is not my point. I would still do it for the exotic place if it would at least work sufficiently. Pump up the droprate and it still might be a fun place to do some mining convoy rp. Just a suggestion.
RE: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - Danny-boy - 02-17-2015
=====Offical BMM- ID does not have any mining bonuses=======
Yeah, a pretty big bug. BMM- currently gets no bonus when mining, the unofficial ID works but the official ID does not.
Edit: Also no mention of it in the minecontrol file.
RE: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - realekki - 03-07-2015
Big Problem with my Hegemon
My Miner (Hegemon / ID: Miner / Charakter: MeinerGnaden) has the following bug:
I mine eg. Helium in Pennsylvania and drop it (by trade or jettison) after that the voice of of the friendly woman says that my empty! cargohold is full - a cannot mine any more. Thats a little annoing.
Btw. is there a Mining Bonus with the Miner ID. I mine some premiumscrap in Bering and the result with an AI ID (AI Cruiser) seems to be equal with the Hegemon and the MinderID?
regards Ekki
RE: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - Alexander - 03-07-2015
As far I know the miner ID can mine basically everything but they don't get a bonus.
e.g With IMG id/iff and hegge you will mine faster silver, niobium etc. and with ALG/Junker/DSE id'd/iff'd ships you will mine faster premium scrap
Quote:I mine eg. Helium in Pennsylvania and drop it (by trade or jettison) after that the voice of of the friendly woman says that my empty! cargohold is full - a cannot mine any more. Thats a little annoing.About this i dont get your point , can you elaborate?
RE: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - realekki - 03-07-2015
(03-07-2015, 12:45 PM)mordor Wrote:Quote:I mine eg. Helium in Pennsylvania and drop it (by trade or jettison) after that the voice of of the friendly woman says that my empty! cargohold is full - a cannot mine any more. Thats a little annoing.About this i dont get your point , can you elaborate?
well i mine helim in pennsilvania - when i reach 2700 of them and sell them to a transport i cant mine any longer - i have to dock at erie, start and can mine again. if i sell 2700 or jettison 50 the problem is the same: no more helium for my cargohold :-(
RE: Discover v4.88: Mining - Bugs, Balancing, and Feedback - Alexander - 03-07-2015
Oh seems like a glitch or something , I'll take a look onto it later .