+- Discovery Gaming Community (https://discoverygc.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Discovery Development (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=7)
+--- Forum: Discovery Mod General Discussion (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=37)
+---- Forum: Discovery Mod Balance (https://discoverygc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=31)
+---- Thread: Developers. Please! (/showthread.php?tid=35453)
Developers. Please! - Birdtalon - 02-24-2010
Agreed, I hate 8.0s
Developers. Please! - Zeltak - 02-24-2010
If 2.00 or 4.00 Civilian guns get implemented they should be weaker in every aspect (Damage, Range, Energy) compared to Factionalized weaponry of the same refire rates. Only then will I personally agree upon this being added.
Two main reasons:
1. They are civilian guns. We look at this from a Role-Playing perspective then they shouldn't be more advanced than Military or Pirate technology.
2. If reason #1 is disregarded it will lead to Players choosing Civilian line technology over their own Faction guns since its available to anyone. This isn't such a good thing as it leads to less diversity.
There are probably more reasonable arguments as to why they should stay at a slight dis-advantage but I think these two reasons covers the important parts.
Developers. Please! - Zeltak - 02-24-2010
I read that mate, I still wanted to mention it in my post so I could emphasize the importance of it.
Developers. Please! - teschy - 02-24-2010
' Wrote:Ah, fair enough. On a simmilar note. A 1.00 refire gun. What about those?
Well, one may find 1.00 guns as overpowered, because they'll have to so somewhere around 2000 damage. Now, imagine having six of those on your ship. 2000 x 6. That's 12000. Add a razor on top of that and you get this insta killing sniping machine. Most fighters have around 25k armor, you'll do 30k damage with that beast. And if your powerplant is good enough, you can fire more often.
Developers. Please! - Qubit - 02-24-2010
Have to say I agree with zeltak - Even though Im in a corporate faction myself I have to say that I think civilian weapons SHOULD be less powerful than faction ones, simply because they are civilian. Even in the case of independent pirates.
IMHO people should play independent characters for a REASON other than they cant be bothered with factions. There is already a massive imbalance of indep to faction players on the server and making it so any civilian can easily go toe to toe with the pride of a house military is silly.
Its RP, civilians rely on police and military to look after them and independent criminals do what they can to AVOID the law enforcement, only the power of a large organized group of criminals would dare go against the authorities directly and even then theyd have to be pretty powerful.
Developers. Please! - Oldum - 02-24-2010
' Wrote:Have to say I agree with zeltak - Even though Im in a corporate faction myself I have to say that I think civilian weapons SHOULD be less powerful than faction ones, simply because they are civilian. Even in the case of independent pirates.
IMHO people should play independent characters for a REASON other than they cant be bothered with factions. There is already a massive imbalance of indep to faction players on the server and making it so any civilian can easily go toe to toe with the pride of a house military is silly.
Its RP, civilians rely on police and military to look after them and independent criminals do what they can to AVOID the law enforcement, only the power of a large organized group of criminals would dare go against the authorities directly and even then theyd have to be pretty powerful.
First, Learn to read properly .... Spazzy wrote the same thing you did in your first line ever since he started the topic.
Second: Not every indie can be pushed into a factions , such as freelancers or generic mercenaries. Or if you want to make an Official Freelancer faction, you still have to use civvy guns ...
Third: 8.00 civy lazers are a pain in the ass! Would be nice to have some different possibilities, as spazzy mentioned. I don't say give us photon, plasma and whatever, but at least 1 or 2 which is not laser and doesn't have 8.33 refire rate.
Developers. Please! - Qubit - 02-24-2010
' Wrote:First, Learn to read properly .... Spazzy wrote the same thing you did in your first line ever since he started the topic.
Second: Not every indie can be pushed into a factions , such as freelancers or generic mercenaries. Or if you want to make an Official Freelancer faction, you still have to use civvy guns ...
Third: 8.00 civy lazers are a pain in the ass! Would be nice to have some different possibilities, as spazzy mentioned. I don't say give us photon, plasma and whatever, but at least 1 or 2 which is not laser and doesn't have 8.33 refire rate.
Im terribly sorry for any offense I may have caused, I admit my reply was based more of of the reply's than the OP. I certainly didnt mean to intend that indi's should be pushed into anything, I was just of the opinion that all playable types were meant to have distinct pros and cons and that for indis, less powerful weps was an important con.
I will be sure to carefully read and consider the meaning of the OP before posting in the future.
Developers. Please! - Friday - 02-24-2010
ACtually - they dont have to be worse in EVERY aspect - but there should be a tradeoff, treating civilians as a faction in their own right.
The closest comparison is looking at IRL jet engines. Commercial and military grade engines are in fact exactly the same - just calibrated differently.
Military components are calibrated for performance, at the expense of durability (they wear out faster) - whilst Commercial grade equipment is calibrated for maximum durability (cheaper maintenance costs) at the expense of performance.
You could transfer this concept to Civilian guns - make them less damaging, but more energy efficient.
Developers. Please! - Thexare - 02-24-2010
' Wrote:ACtually - they dont have to be worse in EVERY aspect - but there should be a tradeoff, treating civilians as a faction in their own right.I'm constantly complaining about Civilian guns, and I approve this message.
The closest comparison is looking at IRL jet engines. Commercial and military grade engines are in fact exactly the same - just calibrated differently.
Military components are calibrated for performance, at the expense of durability (they wear out faster) - whilst Commercial grade equipment is calibrated for maximum durability (cheaper maintenance costs) at the expense of performance.
You could transfer this concept to Civilian guns - make them less damaging, but more energy efficient.
As long as the two are roughly proportional. Sure, Flashpoints may be more efficient than the 8.33 competition (or may not be, haven't checked lately), but not nearly enough to be worth the loss of 250+ DPS compared to even the Bundschuh Class 9s (which are still a joke, last I checked)
Also, let's get some other projectile speeds available - at least 650 to sync with the SlowDebs and not throw off codes too much.
Developers. Please! - Prysin - 02-24-2010
I agree to this proposal because;
#1: not all pilots can use the Godess or Flashpoint at its fullest, its very hard
#2: Civillian factions like Zoners, IND, and the other house corporations are not allways allowed to use house military tech. And their faction rules may deny them the privilege of CODENAMES. Thus, we should give them some diversity.
#3: They do not need to be ?b3r h4x0r guns, just decent damage. say a lvl 9 version has around 2000 dps hull and 1000 dps shield.
#4: Mix'n'Match; In some cases, like i wanted, people want to have "one of each". Meaning, they want a gun that has 20% bonus to each type of shield. Thus making them ?ber-h4x in battle due to consant having "full" damage to the shields. (+20%, -20%, +0% = Constant dps to shields). This is a VERY good advantage, but just the most gifted players may ever get the priviledge to get such a setup. Because it simply requires ALOT of forum RP, and ingame RP to get those factions to say; yeah well, sure you can have 2 sunrails/maghammers/krakens.
#5: Vigilante !!!!!!!!.... I would bet, theres no more then 20 of those in the server. why? they gotta make SRP to use anything but civvy tech. Their practically doomed to ether be godlike in a eagle with godess/flashpoint or their just worthless. Fact is, Vigilant has a unique RP potential as being the "everyday hero". Then again, their extremly limited choice of weapons make them worthless to play as. Just not "easy" enough to survive a gankfest with flashpoints/godess. (i talked with a vigilante, he said; If you ever wanna try play as vigilante, make sure you enjoy being outgunned, outnumbered, outclassed and out of support. The navy/police just dont care for you)
Thats my agruments; id say... give us neutron, plasma and tachyon (1.0 plasma, 2.0 tachyon, 4.0 neutron)