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+---- Thread: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) (/showthread.php?tid=95017)
Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - Mercarryn - 03-03-2013
(03-02-2013, 03:09 AM)Blodo Wrote:(03-01-2013, 10:55 PM)Lunaphase Wrote: *whatever*....
Order Osiris balance has nothing to do with the lore but more to do with the fact that the ship itself was just far too strong - now it isn't (but yes maybe it will get some kind of buff, meanwhile the rest of the Order ships are more than fine)
...
This comment made me set up the post now
As a dedicated indie order player, this comment just made my day.
I mean, seriously? Okay, I will not deny the fact that .85 Osiris was op and that it had to be nerfed. So, a slight improvement would not hurt on it. But actually this is not the reason why I am writing.
What really bugs me about this comment is that you think the rest of the order caps is okay.
Not long ago, I saw a post from Aet where he mentioned that he wanted to take of the wings from the Resheph, though to my mind I do not even see a real reason behind it. It is actually good as it its. Could PERHAPS get a bit more cargo to reasonably use the new equipment like a scanner.
Now to the Geb
I dare to say that you, Blodo, haven't flown one since .86 came out. But let's keep it seriously in here.
Right now as it is, the Geb can neither be used as a cruiser-killer nor to counter a bs.
Against the first ones it is not as fast as its counterpart the Bullhead. The Bullhead, though lower on hullpoints, is faster with its 140 thrust speed, is a bit more agile and has a lower profile, let alone its better firing arcs for the 4 lvl 7 slots.
Against battleships the Geb lacks good enough firing arcs for at least 2 of its lvl7 slots to kite properly.
In .85 you could use the Geb as a platfrom for long range fire with light mortars when placed properly. The battlecruiser core made this possible. Same goes for missiles. Back then the Geb had found a nice niche for itself, but with .86 he is not anymore in it.
Now some will say "but the Geb has a battleshield and 18 turret slots". Yep, that is true, but regarding the shield I suggest you also keep in mind that the Geb is rather big and so gets easily hit from afar. It is even bigger then the Osiris!
And about the turrets: The current firing arcs on it compensates this "advantage".
And if we compare them with the LABC and the Bullhead:
While Geb has 4 lvl7 slots and 2 lvl8 battleship slots (99% used for flaks), both the LABC and the Bullhead have 2 lvl9 battleship slots and 1 lvl8 bs slot (for flak again).
And here again the bad firing arcs for the battleship turrets speak against the Geb again. As of now, the lvl 8 flak slots can only be used in a 180° firing angle, horizontal line. You cannot even use them to shoot down novas that come from above or below.
Unlike the lvl8 flak slots on Bullhead and LABC, which in the end have a better overall cover then the geb, although they only have one Flak slot.
And the two lvl9 bs slots give the Bullhead and LABC a general range advantage, when used together with light mortars or cruiser missiles.
In most cases, not the amount of firepower and hullpoint decide, but the combination of better firing arcs and agility. Which fits both for the LABC and Bullhead.
Well, Aet's comment gave me some hope you finally acknowledged that the Geb needs some work, but with Blodo's comment...
What I suggest is, either turn the Geb into a battleship like Aet thought about and was approved by Order| leadership (check link) or at least give it better firing arcs for 2 of its lvl7 slots.
Right now, it is nothing more then a nice RP platform. But if this is really its sole reason to exist....
RE: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - Omicron - 03-03-2013
I did not approved turning it into light battleship. Order already have one. Medium battleship/carrier style stats is what we have in mind.
Meanwhile, Hathor's turret placement/arcs were nerfed in comparison to 4.85, allthrough I expect this to return back to normal with reversion.
RE: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - Flash™ - 03-03-2013
Geb can be killed, by almost everything. Cruisers, other Battlecruisers, and BS. Geb isnt a ship you buy to pew with, but a hip acting as a Light Carrier. and Osiris seems fine to me, turns faster then most Cruisers, has decent firepower to kil other BS.
RE: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - Mercarryn - 03-03-2013
Well, Flash, as I already said, this thread is actually not about the Osiris, but just a small notice from me about Blodo's comment I citated.
And as you already agreed upon, the Geb is just a flying target. Unlike the zoner cap line, which according to Blodo is meant to suck in fights, the Geb is a military ship, used for engagements, but it fails in that.
And as Blodo mentioned in the same thread I took his first citate:
(03-03-2013, 08:41 PM)Blodo Wrote: PvP is role play [...]
RE: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - TLI-Inferno - 03-03-2013
Geb is overpowered, just like the Kronos. They're better at dying than any other ships in the game.
RE: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - SummerMcLovin - 03-04-2013
(03-03-2013, 11:44 PM)TLI-Inferno Wrote: Geb is overpowered, just like the Kronos. They're better at dying than any other ships in the game.And thus, the niche is found.
Zephyr will (hopefully) at least be able to kite and mortar everything from a distance.
RE: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - Knjaz - 03-04-2013
There's absolutely no reason not to give Ossie 2 heavy slots, when both Mako and Togo have them as well. And dont you dare to tell me that Ossie is more OP than Togo....
Geb is just a battlecruiser class coffin. =/
But giving it heavy slots that can fire backwards might be a good start.
RE: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - Implosion - 03-04-2013
(03-04-2013, 11:48 AM)Knjaz Wrote: There's absolutely no reason not to give Ossie 2 heavy slots, when both Mako and Togo have them as well. And dont you dare to tell me that Ossie is more OP thanThe Osiris has more Hull,more B/Bs and it's faster than a Mako.
Much,much faster.And the shape is better.
As for the Geb,it's so bad I haven't seen one in game for months now.
People just avoid it nowdays,that is,people that use their caps for shooting things.
The geb has amazing RP capabilities.
RE: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - Omicron - 03-04-2013
Mako have only 5000 less hull, same regens and capability to unleash quite a punch with 2 cerbs.
RE: Balancing the Geb (Yes, that sort of thread again) - Knjaz - 03-04-2013
(03-04-2013, 12:09 PM)Implosion Wrote:(03-04-2013, 11:48 AM)Knjaz Wrote: There's absolutely no reason not to give Ossie 2 heavy slots, when both Mako and Togo have them as well. And dont you dare to tell me that Ossie is more OP thanThe Osiris has more Hull,more B/Bs and it's faster than a Mako.
Much,much faster.And the shape is better.
You're joking, right?
Quote:Ossie:
Hull strength 700,000
Cargo space 1,400 units
Nanobots/Batteries 1500/1500
Max. impulse speed 90 m/s
Max. turn speed 9.17 deg/s
Quote:Mako
Hull strength 695,000
Cargo space 1,500 units
Nanobots/Batteries 1500/1500
Max. impulse speed 90 m/s
Max. turn speed 8.71 deg/s
Plus, Mako got a very decent strafe in 86.
But even if it would be significantly stronger/faster than a Mako (Which he is not), there's NO point in having battleship with 1 heavy slot.
You know, there's a reason why people usually install 2 mortars, 2 missiles or 2 cerbs? You cant even drain your energy with 1 mortar, you cant match your power regen with 1 missile (not even thinking about draining it, lol), and 1 cerb is kinda meh as well.
There is a reason to fly a battleship with 2 heavy and 2-4 primary slots. There's no much reason to have battleship with 1 heavy and 5 primaries. It really feels castrated that way.