Too much trading

[Catbert]

Shiuploss on death would encourage people to trade to replace their ships.

Or it would encourage people to leave. Quite a few people just wouldn't bother replacing their ships, I guess. Not to mention the whole new world of griefing that'll be created, should such idea be implemented.

If you do not enjoy flying your trade ship character, don't do it.

Yet it's the most convenient and the least time-consuming way. I no longer trade, simply because I have no reason to: I don't need capital ships or CAUs, and I have pretty much all the snubs I need for now.

As for other ways of making money... Well, mission grinding tends to get boring at some point, I guess (not to mention that you need a cap in order to do the missions which are actually worthwhile). Hunting is an option if you're prepared to take tons of screens and upload them regularly (the whole thing is kind of inconvenient, at least for my taste).

That leaves mining (again, some people like it, some don't), visual design (it's mostly about talent here), codename dealing (if the server restart time is convenient for you) and escorting (now this is actually a good and easy way of earning cash; I haven't been doing it for a while, so I can't say how many traders actually need escorts now.

Overall, I'd say that leaving it as is might be a good decision. At least making the grind more time-consuming is definitely not an option (that'd scare some people off); making it easier might also be not the best idea either... (although both of the points above are questionable). Though I am still not sure about whether transports should be buffed or not (because it would make sense, give pirates more challenge and actually allow the lawfuls to do something before the trader gets blown up).

P.S: Haven't been trading for a while, so my opinions may be several months old.

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You're welcome to leave feedback here | My inbox is always open

[lIceColon]

It's less about RP now, and more about balance as a videogame.

Sad really. I should be able to earn 3x the money transporting VIPs than regular passengers

Smuggling liberty made military vehicles to Rheinland should be risky and very profitable, seeing as there is a freaking war going on.

Smuggling in general should also be a bit more profitable

corporate routes on the other hand should be less profitable, however as you're most likely playing the entire crew of a ship your "boss" should give you a good salary.

I say that the whole /givecash thing be made into an RP thing, if you wanna transfer cash from your sally to your hog starflier you better have a valid RP reason.

At any rate, I think that we shouldn't sacrifice RP for balance.

Shiuploss on death would encourage people to trade to replace their ships.

actually is it possible to implement permadeth, but have have shipception escape craft things? eg. my whale explodes so I eject into my dromedary which takes up 2000 cargo hold. then my dromedary explodes and I eject into my arrow which takes up 300 cargo hold.

On second thought, small ships should also become commodities. just think about it.

Also we should have ships that fill the gap between 5k'ers and the barge.

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No atmosphere? GTFO.
The propeller is the greatest invention of all time.

[Hannibal]

wouldn't this become more like EVE with ship death? fly only the ships you can afford to lose!!
so..in the end will be more like 'work' to 'play'

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People want to believe that God has a plan for them.
They don't wanna believe that anyone else does..

[AshHill07]

I will state right now that if ship loss on death is implemented a lot of people will quit the server, I would be one of them. It took me 2 years to get to a possition I was happy with and I haven't really traded for proffit since, but if someone told me I had to repeat those 2 years to get my stuff back I would sooner tell them to stick it up thier backside than do it again.

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\\ CDR David Roberts \\ CAPT Steven Eversman \\ VADM Ash Hill // RDML Chris Murray // CDR Mick Connors //
\\ SFC| Patrol-7 \\ SFC| LNS-California \\ SFC| LNT-Century // SFC| LNS-San.Francisco // SFC| Patrol-5 //

[Govedo13]

Sorry to say, but:
rly
Everybody should have to trade/mine.
It would be good for the game.
Therefore the money/hour rate should not be increased.
There is too much money in the economy already and hardly any way of using it reasonably.

Well this is 100% true.
Clean new start with full char wipe- this fix the system reduction problem.
Cut the income rates by 50%.
Snub price increase by 300%
Introduce maintenance costs-
all ship ammos price increase by 300%
10% variable chance to repay 10% of your ship value by death
1% chance to loose your ship by death
10% chance to loose your base made items by death
Capital ships and 5k transps cannot be bought by credits but need to be build in shipyards and POBs.
Caps should cost a lot more and be really powerful. Make the loss of cap ship economic disaster. Caps and 5ks should not be able to be fixed without additional repairs on death.
Cut the barge in 3 pieces- one huge cargo contrainer without engine, one jump coordinatior and one jump drive ship- capable to mount the CM like based jumpdrive that uses the CM fliers as fuel- add huge maintenance costs but allow to make good profit- make it not possible to be used by less then 5 people- permanent death for barge.
Cut the system numbers drastically.
Make PvP more noob friendly by increasing the gun speeds and DPE, fix GBs, remove TS/Zoom from bombers/freighters/SHFs, add proper anti-fighter defences on caps.
Simple to do things that are entirely possible and it is possible to make them on small steps and updates after the wipe and system changes. That would fix the game and would keep the server full all the time.

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€œ

Official faction players that are often accused of elitism, never deploy them and have those weird, immersion killing "fair fight/dueling" suicidal hobbies. (yes, i've seen enough of those lolduels, where house military with overwhelming force on the field willingly loses a pilot in a duel. ffs.)

[Omicron]

Clean new start with full char wipe- this fix the system reduction problem.

You can delete your characters at any momenth on your own wish. Please do so and do not bother bringing such ideas here ever again.

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[Zen_Mechanics]

Heres the trick, you first get to disco, you do some neon runs, somehow get a few hundred mills, buy a good bs, do some money, get 14bill, buy all the ships you want, trade to keep your base healthy and develop your character.
Worked for me. Edit : Keep the trading as it is, but encourage the real reason why people are here ( which means lowering some costs here and there and adding an extra mill or two for every good route ).

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Were fools to make war on our brothers in arms.

[SMGSterlin]

Inclined to agree. Then theres the "no traders means no interaction".... well, letting everything and its mother huck whatever at tradeships and yet reducing their profits/raising prices constantly, is leading to not many people WANTING to trade.

More people would be willing to do it if it just dident flat out suck. This is a roleplay server, people, in theory, come here to roleplay, not go A,B,C and back with the occasional pay or die moment.

I would personally suggest: Increasing cargo hold OR cost/profit of goods, meaning each load above 3600 cargo is worth a pretty hefty chunk. This would give traders incentive for risk/reward runs (such as nuke devices or smuggling), and give potentially more role for escorts since the trader could afford to pay them more than pocket change, making it a viable way to earn cash.

Primary reason there are no escorts or very few: it sucks. Pirate usually has better kit than you anyway, if not outright a ship you cant scratch, for very little reward. Trader makes only about 10m profit meaning 2 mil is 20% of his, still paltry sum for both.

Trading also sucks because of tradeships being balanced as straight up suck machines, while they now have to deal with even cruisers firing at them. 12 type 3 tradeship guns is one cruiser cerb. cruisers do 4x the output of any transport, with 4x the hull and sheilds.

Another way to make trading fun: Larger heavyer ships, very well armed but slow, almost cruiser strength, bristling with turrets. (think about 22 turrets on somthing the size of a heavy cruiser, a true trade galleon) This makes pirating an interesting and fun encounter, as well as lets the trader actually be able to defend their asses, somthing which is sorely lacking against anything not a LF or HF. (Roleplay wise theres just no way to justifiy corporations not upgunning and up armoring their stuff with piracy this rampant, its just common sense to make ships able to actually survive whats become standard)

Mining mobile refinerys: Must remain stationary, latches on to a large asteroid. larger cargohold but no thruster, making mining ops viable again.

Research ships: Ships with lower cargo but higher speed or firepower for defence, making them poor tradeships but good at roleplaying roles. (similar to yacht, but non-suckified.) Think junker salvager here, able to defend itself decently but not as good as a straight up warship.

Well said.

Sorry to say, but:

If you do not enjoy flying your trade ship character, don't do it.
There are other means to get money.
And: sustaining existing ships is really cheap enough so that not much "grinding" is necessary.

In my opinion, we need...

... more trading
... more (centralised) traffic in the lanes
... more centralisation (to main systems, via bottleneck systems) in general
... more players that experience what trading on a transport is like
... more players that find themselves on the receiving end of the gun regularly

Everybody should have to trade/mine.
It would be good for the game.

Therefore the money/hour rate should not be increased.
There is too much money in the economy already and hardly any way of using it reasonably.

Jack, I like you, but did you seriously just do a "X is true because I say it is" type of post? If you're going to say that "everyone should do X" and "X would be good for the game", give some reasons how it would improve things.

Shiuploss on death would encourage people to trade to replace their ships.

No, it would encourage people to leave Disco, when their 1 billion credit ships all of a sudden don't exist anymore.

Sorry to say, but:
rly
Everybody should have to trade/mine.
It would be good for the game.
Therefore the money/hour rate should not be increased.
There is too much money in the economy already and hardly any way of using it reasonably.

Well this is 100% true.
Clean new start with full char wipe- this fix the system reduction problem.
Cut the income rates by 50%.
Snub price increase by 300%
Introduce maintenance costs-
all ship ammos price increase by 300%
10% variable chance to repay 10% of your ship value by death
1% chance to loose your ship by death
10% chance to loose your base made items by death
Capital ships and 5k transps cannot be bought by credits but need to be build in shipyards and POBs.
Caps should cost a lot more and be really powerful. Make the loss of cap ship economic disaster. Caps and 5ks should not be able to be fixed without additional repairs on death.
Cut the barge in 3 pieces- one huge cargo contrainer without engine, one jump coordinatior and one jump drive ship- capable to mount the CM like based jumpdrive that uses the CM fliers as fuel- add huge maintenance costs but allow to make good profit- make it not possible to be used by less then 5 people- permanent death for barge.
Cut the system numbers drastically.
Make PvP more noob friendly by increasing the gun speeds and DPE, fix GBs, remove TS/Zoom from bombers/freighters/SHFs, add proper anti-fighter defences on caps.
Simple to do things that are entirely possible and it is possible to make them on small steps and updates after the wipe and system changes. That would fix the game and would keep the server full all the time.

I -COMPLETELY- disagree with you on this post, other than the two parts about making caps cost more and cutting down on the number of systems.

Everything else, well, I don't think the final nail factory would be able to keep up with demand.

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[lIceColon]

Clean new start with full char wipe- this fix the system reduction problem.

You can delete your characters at any momenth on your own wish. Please do so and do not bother bringing such ideas here ever again.

Sorry to say, but:
rly
Everybody should have to trade/mine.
It would be good for the game.
Therefore the money/hour rate should not be increased.
There is too much money in the economy already and hardly any way of using it reasonably.

Well this is 100% true.
Clean new start with full char wipe- this fix the system reduction problem.
Cut the income rates by 50%.
Snub price increase by 300%
Introduce maintenance costs-
all ship ammos price increase by 300%
10% variable chance to repay 10% of your ship value by death
1% chance to loose your ship by death
10% chance to loose your base made items by death
Capital ships and 5k transps cannot be bought by credits but need to be build in shipyards and POBs.
Caps should cost a lot more and be really powerful. Make the loss of cap ship economic disaster. Caps and 5ks should not be able to be fixed without additional repairs on death.
Cut the barge in 3 pieces- one huge cargo contrainer without engine, one jump coordinatior and one jump drive ship- capable to mount the CM like based jumpdrive that uses the CM fliers as fuel- add huge maintenance costs but allow to make good profit- make it not possible to be used by less then 5 people- permanent death for barge.
Cut the system numbers drastically.
Make PvP more noob friendly by increasing the gun speeds and DPE, fix GBs, remove TS/Zoom from bombers/freighters/SHFs, add proper anti-fighter defences on caps.
Simple to do things that are entirely possible and it is possible to make them on small steps and updates after the wipe and system changes. That would fix the game and would keep the server full all the time.

I -COMPLETELY- disagree with you on this post, other than the two parts about making caps cost more and cutting down on the number of systems.

Everything else, well, I don't think the final nail factory would be able to keep up with demand.

lol I almost thought govedo was being sarcastic.

at any rate trading is too unprofitable. I would like to see a short ultraprofitable traderoute exist, so that at least that part of the server woould get high activity of traders pirates and lawmen.

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No atmosphere? GTFO.
The propeller is the greatest invention of all time.

[Bootsiuv]

I never 100% understood the line of thought behind reducing overall profits across the board.

Is the idea to keep every nublet from acquiring a BS? If so, it won't work. He'll just fly a week longer and then he'll get his lolcap.

I know it's annoying to have to spend so much time to create characters which aren't based around making a profit.

Granted, there WAS too much money on the server in the ol' Dublin days, but there was also A LOT more activity, not to mention the fact that pirating the gold corridor from magellan to california was some of my most enjoyable times as a pirate. Not because every transport stopped was carrying 50 mills in ore, but because there was a lot more going on....the entire server felt a lot more lively. I understand that players moved into centralized systems, but why is this bad again?

Half of the systems on disco could be cut and I wouldn't even notice, because the only char I've ever had there was simply exploring.

Lowering overall profits lowered server activity, as did forcing people to "spread out".

Unfortunately, many of those who have left in the past year wouldn't come back even if it was changed back, as I'm sure most can't be bothered.

TL;DR. Up the money some, cut A LOT of useless systems (pretty as they may be), if it doesn't liven things up, just change it back.