Discovery 4.87 Universe Map

[Oorn]

It is not terrible idea if it is made right. Sadly we get "standard" type of systems and more buffers where we need direct contact.
I see the need of more O47 type systems with the current Cassini type layout with no base mappings- large really large that require a lot of flying time and more O7 type systems where the bottlenecks and activity hubs could be created. 1 bottleneck/activity hub per house would enable steady 150-200 people in the server.

All "doubled" systems like Kepler/Galileo type could look vastly different between each other. Having long safe route and short risky route is the key for trading not having equal routes everywhere and tons of equal detours allowing to avoid encounters after we see them in the map. Just make one of the doubled systems type Cassini/O47 mix and the other no way out single line without a base at 30k type system. Flying 30 min more combined with danger of bad NPC patrol that can kill you or dealing with the possible piracy at the straight way should be the choice of the trader.

The corsair/outcast example is tragic - the O81 is idiotic, Lambada still existing is idiotic also the assumption that both factions would do anything in the Sigmas is idiotic- even now they have ways to dock there but since Sigmas are idiotic for piracy because of the short lines and the shortage of profitable runs/traders that move around combined with the detour routes( if trader sees official corsair/outcast char in S13 he would just take the detour).
Sigma was active in the niobium/diamond run- wake up and give similar run there together with massive redesign and reduction of Sigma systems. Hell if both Outcast and Corsair Player base want war give them war- it is better to be like that instead having both factions inactive because some "great" Dev like Jinx does not like war, with such "great" attitude it is normal that the players would be leaving the server.
I want to see video where Jinx or similar "prophet" moves Legate from Gamma to Alpha or Ranseur from Alpha to Gamma- it should be entertaining long slow bumpy useless /stucky ride- how you expect one to do it- there is no fun in it.
Instead you can just create ride with the same length with 3-4 good ambush points with badass npcs both corsair and Outcast and Nomad, places for bases to guard chokepoints, complicated navigation towards minefields,nebulas without visual contact, radiation fields and asteroid fields where enemy bombers can rape the cap.
If you do so the Gamma-Alpha route could be challenging and dangerous creating fun for both sides.
Remove all useless systems- leave Eta and make it narrow, flat and long labyrinth fortress system with the said features- the system wall should kill anything moving more then 20k from the main tiny single path. Make the distance between Gamma and Alpha holes 150k and let the both factions to do the hell ride between.

I really feel for the devs if they haven't noticed for 3 versions that the bottlenecks and limited mining spots create activity hubs while the many ways to trade from A to B create metagaming and encounter avoiding.

System routes variety creates just more credits for the players, without proper money sinks people get bored faster, discovery does not need more variety in trading routes it needs more depth and more details and tweaks that allow more different types of gameplay with more different usage of the ship classes. Discovery does not need more then 40-50 good trading routes while the rest could be in RP routes bringing no real profit. Only bunch of good routes per house and only 4-5 ore sale spots would do the job.

Instead of making useless buffer systems just position the stuff into the clash zones at proper distance between each other- there is definitely no need each hole/line and planet/station to be at equal 20-30k near the next one or near the system entry point. If you does not want planet Crete raids move Crete a bit away from the system entry points, put 2 badass weapon platforms near it to disable undocking campers but allow Gamma rides....
Buffer systems create only annoyance and problems- if I kill one in the buffer system he is still in the group of my enemies in the actual system making my kill worthless or other way around.

This map just wont work as intended to create more activity unless they decide to nerf the trading with brutal numbers like 50% and make only 1 mining system per house- T23, Dublin, O7, one GMG gas mining system, one Gallic mining system, One liberty mining system where the LNS/RNS pews should happen- nothing more. Also may be 2-3 distant systems with long runs but 1/4 less profitable mining, make all mining sale points to move into the said bottlenecks or to remove the chat system location tracker.

Making bad bad NPCs that can actually kill players is also needed- think the old NB- Sigma hole nomads,just flavour them a bit more with cruiser and gb support. Put the bad bad NPCs in some systems making them dangerous for detours. The said hole had brilliant concept- it was clear shortcut but it had its price the chance of any transp to get alive from there were quite minimal.
Make both badass NPCs- unlawful and lawful heavy patrols that can actually damage and kill something.
Removing the things that worked good in the past wont improve the mod.

Since they wont rework the map lets hope to reduce mining systems and nerf trading otherwise 100 people on-line would be like miracle in 4.87.
I am really stunned since it requires so little cosmetic changes to motivate the players to flock in groups and be more active and all this things get neglected and replaced with things that proved themselves as not working during the years.

+1, really dont like changes made.
Creating chokepoints, either by removing systems or doing it Govedo13 way IS the way to go. I quite like the idea of differenting systems by npc strength, though during activity downtimes things can get brutal with npcs, as well as other way around. Having "quick but dangerous" and "normal but not so dangerous" routes is nice, same for trading/mining: "dangerous but profitable". Still I believe 60% size cut will be welcome in addition to speed/safety thing.
Oh and Sigma-13 thing? It's just stupid. Where in the vanilla was it said its OC/Sairs battleground?

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When "roleplay" around you seems to be diminishing... all you can do is be a new beacon of roleplay to light up everyone else's interactions.

[Strobel]

Frankly I'm not a fan of the Oita placement at all. It's been an independent system (for a reason I believe) and in the future it'll be Kusari space? Does IND lose control over the system as well or do we keep our guard system?

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[Govedo13]

Guard systems are OORP anyway in Lore they does not exist so why you care?

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Official faction players that are often accused of elitism, never deploy them and have those weird, immersion killing "fair fight/dueling" suicidal hobbies. (yes, i've seen enough of those lolduels, where house military with overwhelming force on the field willingly loses a pilot in a duel. ffs.)

[Strobel]

Guard systems are OORP anyway in Lore they does not exist so why you care?

Nothing but a question.
And for ooRP matter they get mentioned and protected by the affiliated factions quite well, don't they?

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[stewcool]

Great work guys, glad to see more new stuff. Probably wont be playing it though haha.

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[Echelon]

Good but there are still So Many Systems I really hope it would be cut down because it gets boring drifting in all the dead systems

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[Echo 7-7]

...
Where in the vanilla was it said its OC/Sairs battleground?

We're not playing vanilla any more.

Frankly I'm not a fan of the Oita placement at all. It's been an independent system (for a reason I believe) and in the future it'll be Kusari space? Does IND lose control over the system as well or do we keep our guard system?

If anything, I believe it makes more sense now - it is no longer only accessible through House guard systems, which should suit the headquarters of the Renzu Corporation, a Kusari-based civilian manufacturer. Oita may not be a system that is part of sovereign Kusari territory, but it does not quite classify as an Independent World.

While IND, the player faction, owns the system, it is not mechanically a guard system. However:

4.5 Official player factions are free to restrict or not restrict access to their owned systems and tax players who enter owned system. However, properly Tagged and ID'd independent players may enter Guard/Owned systems, and cannot be taxed. Access to systems that surround owned system must not be restricted unless there's a war with another faction.

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There was a sig here, once.

[NixOlympica]

Still too big and Gallia still not dead. All I can say. With player base shrinking, Disco needs radical changes, more choke points.

[Oorn]

...
Where in the vanilla was it said its OC/Sairs battleground?

We're not playing vanilla any more.

ORLY?

about outcasts, corsairs

Both factions are getting a base in Sigma-13, so the region can once again be turned into the battleground of the two as it was originally intended in vanilla.

I still want to hear what was the reason to TRY to move OC/Sairs war into inrp interhouse trade route, not that it would work anyway.

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When "roleplay" around you seems to be diminishing... all you can do is be a new beacon of roleplay to light up everyone else's interactions.

[Benjamin]

oorn: one vanilla reason I came across for oc/sair fighting is when dear sweet Cryer pharma founded atka in the sigmas (which were/are 'corsair space'), outcasts got wind of what atka was about, wanted to shut it down, forced to go and meet corsairs. from iirc planet Malta infocard:

A new development has been Cryer’s continued efforts to create a synthetic version of Cardamine that would be approved as a legal medication within Liberty. This poses a direct threat to the Outcasts' source of income. The Atka Research Station, with nearby access to Edge Nebula clouds, is the most immediate threat to the Outcasts. The location of the base within Corsair territory has brought the Outcasts into conflict with their ancient brethren.

admittedly seems more like a sigma 19/17 thing than a 13 thing, but it's there. and not like it matters because you can't make people fight somewhere just by telling them they should. (and making it harder to get to at the same time, ofc).

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