Uhh.... Sorry just to quickly ask.
Regarding cloaks RP
Why not?
one of the best K'hara RP i had was with some {AFC} (Racetrack and another one) when i was talking with one of them cloaked for about 15 mins (inRP) before eventually uncloaking. They both new it would happen. I think nomads should be able to RP cloaked and then engage after uncloaking *IF* they defenders know its going to happen. (a few seconds to react after uncloak)
I would like to point out that historically. before infinite cloaks were given to the khara and wilde. that when a nomad was rping ..and not shooting people that a small fleet would eventually show up to kill us. Any rp.. and events with factions we would literally have to smuggle ourselves to that location over time or risk a major confrontation if we all went out at once.
I mean back then a nomad fleet attracted a lot of attention. and rightly so. but it did make it difficult for events with factions. To those who deny this either you weren't here.. or you have a bad memory. i know there are admins who remember these times and this is a message for them.
Not to say there anything wrong with that but our little minority had been hunted for years this way. We only reported the most heinous of rule violations in regards to being silently engaged .
AS many of the keepers were mods and admins in the past.. (who needs more paperwork)
The first week i took over i encouraged everyone to use the ID as it was written effectively unleashing the same conduct we had endured for years for a simple week. The ... anger was palpable i got many warnings. I lied to everyone. The reason? well.. ill get to that later.
This action should show that "freely engaging" should not appear on any ids now or retroactively this is an rp server the rp has only gotten better over time. there are MORE rpers then pvpers.. which...honestly is a first i think.. and frankly. to single us out is silly. because frankly this community isn't the same as it was in 2008, 2012. or even 2015.
The reason? I was butt-cloaked no more then 5 times in the previous two years (a mix of indies and officials). It was brushed off I let bygones be bygones. But my sin is wrath. the problem is clearly cloaks are balanced mechanically but not RPly. AT ALL. I dont care if your cloak is infinite or limited by batteries.. all it takes to butt-cloak is invisibility and needs to be in the rules universally for everyone.
If you disagree im sorry but khara weren't the first offenders. Cloaks are abused alot..
Aside that, Terrorism as it was envisioned in the beginning of disco has died. and the only thing to point out is how unused these provisions are because i have forced the issue that freely engaging is against the philosophy of the community, admins, and the factions therein.
If i have to take a personal nose dive and rustle everyone's jimmies about this? This needed to happen. I gave up talking to admins about stuff like this in 2012. progress was too slow. the only thing that gets things to change in this community is ticking people off.
This can be abused. and i abused it. no apologies. just as planned.
SO TLR
the current changes should apply to everyone. and i mean EVERYONE.. there shouldn't be any mismatch of privileges due to zoi or faction just to stimulate activity in certain areas. As i was told by a certain administrator.. IDs are made not just to limit power but to generate activity. and maybe activity shouldn't be the prime force anymore. more quality of play.
Cloaks arent balanced inrp.. doesn't matter what kind they are cloaks should be the same is leaving a fight (inrp death) and any rp while invisible should discount as any type of engagement notice.
And on the subject of quality = the amount of complaints its takes to change something. Perhaps more quality/expedience of judgement should be exercised before implementing new features and new abilities in the server BEFORE they are rolled out but as i understand thats mostly a problem of staffing in the dev dept. ... so god help us all there.
(01-02-2016, 02:22 AM)Freedom Phantom Wrote: I assume they can attack pretty much anyone still, yes?
If so, are other IDs allowed to engage Nomads(after some RP, of course) even if their lines don't say they can?
I'd imagine why one wouldn't be willing to attack Wilde if they didn't know about them inRP, but Nomads? Can my Freelancer IDed characters initiate an engagement on Nomads?
tl;dr can I be the one to shoot the nomad first even when I don't have Intelligence ids or Core/Order ones?
I still kinda' want to have an answer to this.
Pretty please?
(01-02-2016, 01:55 AM)Pavel Wrote: After taking various feedback suggestions and complaints from the Community, the Admin Team have decided the following:
- Nomads are required to do RP before attacking, uncloaked.
So only nomads have this restriction?
What about all the non-nomad cloak wielders that spit out a one-liner under cloak then insta-nuke people?
Why is one faction receiving this restriction for an issue consistent across all cloaks?
(01-02-2016, 01:55 AM)Pavel Wrote: - Rule 3.1 now applies to K'hara and Indie Nomad IDs.
What about terrorist and Order IDs that have similar lines?
(01-02-2016, 04:24 AM)HuggieSunrise Wrote: Cloaks arent balanced inrp.. doesn't matter what kind they are cloaks should be the same is leaving a fight (inrp death) and any rp while invisible should discount as any type of engagement notice.
I disagree. I feel that its pvp wise they aren't balanced. There are so many disadvantages to having one in a pvp situation that you're simply better off using it to avoid a fight entirely. IMO, especially in a 1v1, if you do cloak, and re-attack within say 30s to a minute, that's a valid use of a cloak in combat. You suffer the charge time, the loss of shield...while you're cloaked, the longer you stay that way the further the enemy can escape, so you are forced to attack or let them go.
But a fair toss up to pvp death would be if cloaks did go to being beat by a Cloak Disruptor only...Yeah I'd see that as fair. It would be worth it, most of the time a cloak would be a much more likely means of escape. As it stands, that's not really an option, and so what if you actually manage to use it offensively after pvp has already begun, because you aren't the one being pursued? Make it so not just anyone can disrupt cloaks and let it come down to surviving the charge time (maybe even lengthen the charge time on snub cloaks) and if you do get cloaked, you get away, but sure since the odds go up, pvp death.
In regards to OP, i'm actually torn. In a way it does seem more fair to make everyone RP before attacking, yet my most recent experiences with the K'hara players never left me with any impression of total surprise or being unfairly aggressive. We've all known how we have to fly... I hear a cloaked ship, I get a good idea they're around, I don't stay too still or stray far from a base (or dock if you really want to), and wait to see what happens. Most times they RP cloaked at some point in the interaction. Even the last time i was attacked on my freighter I'm pretty sure the K'hara ships RP'd before attacking and knew that I knew they were following me and I wasn't caught entirely by surprise. They got a fair shot at me. Anyway, I don't disagree with it, but I'd have also thought it reasonable to simply require RP before an attack with sufficient time, even cloaked.
As I understand it, even the rest of us can RP cloaked before an attack, as long as we give reasonable time? And 99% of the time you know you did because your opponent takes visible evasive action and denies you a still target. That's kind of the point of using the cloak to attack but its not the most important thing you can do with it. Really, as always, it comes down to who's paying attention. If the pilot is inexperienced or simply distracted, and if enough time passes...bad things can happen. Personally I basically wait until they're moving and try to let it rip asap and don't have to risk feeling bad since it was a fair 'surprise attack', as fair as it gets on this kind of server.
(01-02-2016, 01:55 AM)Pavel Wrote: After taking various feedback suggestions and complaints from the Community, the Admin Team have decided the following:
- Rule 3.1 now applies to K'hara and Indie Nomad IDs.
- Nomads are required to do RP before attacking, uncloaked.
- both respective IDs are being changed to reflect that.
Finally no more buttcloaks, I might actually use my mako now.
(01-02-2016, 04:41 AM)Miaou Wrote: Good change. Nice rule update, seeing how K'Hara and indies abused it.
Unless there's a change I missed, would the second change be applied to everyone? Uncloaking dreads are just as annoying as uncloaking marduks.
Can you abuse whats freely given? The admins are only reversing it in light to how things have changed here.
It self evident terrorist engagement has no place in the mod anymore. For if those who still have these powers use them they wont be tolerated. And if its unused why have it in the id?
The cloak provision needs to be in the rules for everyone.
Terrorist ids are a lie and only serve to tweak the imaginations of pvp whores who dream of binge killing that will never happen. Write it out as part of history.
(01-02-2016, 08:49 AM)HuggieSunrise Wrote: It self evident terrorist engagement has no place in the mod anymore. For if those who still have these powers use them they wont be tolerated. And if its unused why have it in the id?
The cloak provision needs to be in the rules for everyone.
Terrorist ids are a lie and only serve to tweak the imaginations of pvp whores who dream of binge killing that will never happen. Write it out as part of history.
You know.
You could've used the "Attack everyone" line you had without cloaks.
Know how?
Make a fleet, drag it to New York on an active day, stay cloaked.
When people see a billion K'Hara in New York, they'll log things.
When they log things, you uncloak - say, above the sun.
Instead of instakilling everything you saw, you could've /s a message across the entire system to tell everyone that the Nomads are about to kill everything.
If you'd have killed everything that way, everyone would've been fine with it.
They could've avoided you, or they could've fought you.
Sounds pretty straightforward to me.
Nobody would have ANY reason to bash on your faction because they KNEW they were about to be shot.
So...yeah.
R
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