Thrusting & fleeing

[Baltar]

Sorry ... I also seem to recall a discussion about shield running ... ahem ... like it doesn't exist.

[Spear]

Sorry ... I also seem to recall a discussion about shield running ... ahem ... like it doesn't exist.

That was me! Curse u Baltar and your Rain man memory! *Shakes fist! lol!
I still maintain sheild running is a Capital ship engaging cruise (Cruise combat violation) and re-charging his sheilds and returning(Illegal as cruise in combat not sheild running), Fighters may sheild "hug" Commonly known as "dodging"! Nothing wrong with that, happens against me all the time and fair play to my opponent for not being suicidal idiot. Thats not sheild running, there is no sheild running rule either.

This is one of those "grey area" topics that has excisted for ages, you should not use cruise in combat is a given, but abusing your ability to thrust out of gun range and then re-attack is also a problem against Capital class ships. I dont play much these days but to be honest I rarely see this. Perhaps because I am usually in a fighter.

If you had to, absolutley had to, force me into a when is thrusting turning into fleeing rule I would say 6K, 10 seems too much, but 3K too little, hell a player can drift 3K away while typing to group mates unintentionally.

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=LSF=

[tazuras]

but abusing your ability to thrust out of gun range and then re-attack is also a problem against Capital class ships. I dont play much these days but to be honest I rarely see this. Perhaps because I am usually in a fighter.

Whoa whoa whoa, "abusing the ability to thrust out of range"? It's not abuse, it's game mechanics. If the Dev's didnt want this happen they would have given caps thrusters that could keep up with fighters/bombers. They didn't. I've seen it posted a million times on these forums, dessies and bigger are not designed to engage figters/bombers, they are made for attacking other capital class vessels. If you fly one you should be escorted by a GB or fighter(s) which are meant to engage fighters/bombers if you think you may encounter them. Capital ships should not be the "I win against everything" ships and the rules should not disallow smaller ships from taking advantage of their intended strengths.

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[Spear]

Whoa whoa whoa, "abusing the ability to thrust out of range"? It's not abuse, it's game mechanics. If the Dev's didnt want this happen they would have given caps thrusters that could keep up with fighters/bombers. They didn't. I've seen it posted a million times on these forums, dessies and bigger are not designed to engage figters/bombers, they are made for attacking other capital class vessels. If you fly one you should be escorted by a GB or fighter(s) which are meant to engage fighters/bombers if you think you may encounter them. Capital ships should not be the "I win against everything" ships and the rules should not disallow smaller ships from taking advantage of their intended strengths.

I am not implying that Capitals should be "pwn" machines! My post was aimed at players that thrust beyond resoanable range then re-engage, I have 13 fighters and 1 Cap, and as I said in my post I rarely see this happen. I still think people that do this are abusing the system. I am not saying using thrust to "pull" a fight away from heavy support, quite the opposite, I do this all the time. If a Cap has has fighter support I will engage the fighters and pull the fighters away as a matter of common sense.

Oh just 1 "whoa" would do, I'm not a horse. :P

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=LSF=

[tazuras]

He he, sorry about the woah's, it's my speech pattern when i say it. I suppose my question then is out of weapons range of the cap's weapons beyond a reasonable range?

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[Spear]

He he, sorry about the woah's, it's my speech pattern when i say it. I suppose my question then is out of weapons range of the cap's weapons beyond a reasonable range?

No problem.

The six million dollar question, I think someone thrusting to 10k away (from there nearest opponent) and hovering around to re-engage is too far, but then anyone thrusting 3k away (from there nearest opponent) is more than fair.

It's all subjective and is forcing yet another goddamn rule upon us if the communitty decides to regulate it! I understand the frustration of a Cap pilot that is re-engaged someone who has clearly run away as much as I understand the fighter/bomber pilots ability to maintain a resonable range (from there nearest opponent) until they receive support.

All of this has happened before and will happen again lol!

Edit: As a further point in general, please please stop broadcasting "sheild runner" in system, not only is it an immersion breaker, it's a phantom offense made by people that are frustrated by bad aiming. We play on a RP server, sheild runner is not an RP term and never will be.

"I'm sorry Lord Vader the rebels seem to be weaving about as if they dont want to die!"
Lord Vader breathes heavily and replies "The force is strong in these sheild runners"

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=LSF=

[tazuras]

No problem.

The six million dollar question, I think someone thrusting to 10k away (from there nearest opponent) and hovering around to re-engage is too far, but then anyone thrusting 3k away (from there nearest opponent) is more than fair.

It's all subjective and is forcing yet another goddamn rule upon us if the communitty decides to regulate it! I understand the frustration of a Cap pilot that is re-engaged someone who has clearly run away as much as I understand the fighter/bomber pilots ability to maintain a resonable range (from there nearest opponent) until they receive support.

All of this has happened before and will happen again lol!

Edit: As a further point in general, please please stop broadcasting "sheild runner" in system, not only is it an immersion breaker, it's a phantom offense made by people that are frustrated by bad aiming. We play on a RP server, sheild runner is not an RP term and never will be.

"I'm sorry Lord Vader the rebels seem to be weaving about as if they dont want to die!"
Lord Vader breathes heavily and replies "The force is strong in these sheild runners"

First of all, LOL, ROFL even.

Secondly yes about not having another rule, how about we just dont have another rule about it, I like that idea. There are enough rules, I think this is a fairly minor point of contention. If someone is doing this to you and you dont like it, just leave, dont give them the satisfaction of fighting their way if you dont like how they fight, of course asking them to stop first via PM might be nice. Now I realize this will force you to leave the system and that sucks, but you will have the satisfaction of knowing you are the bigger person, that's gotta be worth something, right?

If enough people do this to them maybe they will stop, or maybe I'm an optimist, but it is a nice thought.

Now someone go add an in RP term for sheildrunner to the OORP to RP thread, I cant think of one offhand.

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[Kambei]

it is fleeig imo only if he leave your/his sensor range (15k?... Im not sure)

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[Grin]

Last night I was fighting Mon'Star in his monster ship, in New London. I was in my BAF Challenger bomber.

The reason I fought him alone was to keep an active contact with him, while calling up support on our emergency comms system. I had no chance to defeat him, but I could not let him move out of scanner range because he is a master of disappearing and then leading hapless military pilots on long chases through the system.

What I did, though was make some attack runs on him and then dodge like crazy and CM spam away, keeping contact. This gave him the opportunity to beat the heck out of me as I attacked (which he did, of course!) but also gave me the chance to get in some MR strikes on him. I frequently moved over 3k from him - in fact he also started moving away from me! We got about 6-7k apart at most. He started calling me a coward, of course, which was all good RP. I was doing my job, keeping in contact with a dangerous cap vessel.

Another BAF pilot did come in to support me, but he didn't last very long under the missile spam. My ship was pretty damaged by now and Batts 'n' Bots were gone, so I decided to disengage. More ships were on the way (Mandalorian and BAF) but just then an ion storm blew in and everything was over.

I was not Shield-running or disengaging, I was doing the only thing I could in order to survive but still do my job dealing with a dangerous criminal whose ship could blow mine apart in seconds. I used the only advantage I had, the thruster to keep the contact for as long as possible. As a bonus, for combat practice and RP, I made sure I attacked him as often as I could.

I would describe what I did as aggressive tracking of a dangerous opponent. If I had stayed in scanner range but made no attack runs, I would call it passive tracking. Both are acceptable in RP as far as I am concerned. (Although the aggressive form is more exciting:P) As a military unit, a suicidal attack on a superior vessel/fleet is patently stupid. We are a team. Support is called for and supplied - it takes time but enables a much better chance to take out the enemy.

I think that says it all :cool:

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BAF|Lt.Jay.Smith - Templar, BAF|Lt.Jay.Smith. - Challenger, HMS-Hardy - Indy Gunboat

[Jinx]

last time we had the discussion - many people were game with 8-12k range ( averaging out at 10k ... clickable range )

less is silly - more is silly, too - sort of.

if its only 3k-5k - jousting ships can easily sometimes reach such a distance ... all you need is thrusting with E-kill into one direction - your opponent into the other... and then typing something RP like ... after finishing typing, you re easily 3k+ away. - being sanctioned for trying to type something in a dogfight would be stupid.

so - 10k it is i think - usually you can very easily see if someone is just dodging afar ... or fleeing. so - yes.. two bombers can legally shield run, as they have done ever since. - one bomber dodged and keeps a long distance ( and no capship is allowed to cruise up ) - the other one firing, when the capship changes targets, - they switch roles.

anyway - i d say that ... as long as an engaged opponent is still in clickably range ( 10k ) - no ship ought to cruise to catch up. - that is one of the neat little advantages of strike craft vs. defending ships... and look at the bright side.

the ship that just exited by thrusting 10k must leave the system as soon as possible ( on the direct way ) for up to 4 hours, no discussion there.

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