If you want to make this a nicer place for people, its the attitudes of people that need to be improved.
On computer game fourms, a number of people will have the attitude that they want to prove themselves smarter/tougher/more powerful than others. Generally not an unasual thing for boys between 13 and 25, or for some boys older than 25.
As long as people like to post stuff like:
"I R bettah, ur a noob, ur a lolwutt, I R smarter dan u, I know english bettah dan u, my powa is bigger dan urs, mah powaful fwiends will shoot u with their RL machine gunz, my join date and post number iz higha",
who ever hears that will hate them back, even if what they say is not against forum rules and even if its accepted by the general server population.
Some people manage to say these things without breaking server rules, by using irony, ridicule, friend support, and they will get off without ever getting much critisism from anyone.
But at the end of the day, even if done in a subtle manner, this is the sort of thing that creates the hatred. So maybe thats what people look out for in their own posts, or what the mods and admins might want to look out for when looking over people's shoulders.
About the intolarance in general... there is quite a missonception in most of the societies. It's not like people learned the principals of tolerance. Only learned who to hate and who to -accept- (not tolerate, mind you) in order not to be frowned as "Hate spoksman" or whatever.
Therfor we have quite a intresting and colorful "tolerance" for like: Do not dear to point out some silenced things about Islam, but to spill unreasoned filth on christianity is ok (which both I saw on these forums). Then in collective mind nazism and related stuff is hell thing, stalinism in on neutral or just a bad thing, yet not condemned. Just not to insult anyone.. oh gosh
Frederik Barbarosa, one of the greatest emperors of all times once said: The one who defends everything -defends nothing. And he was right. With all that "not to insult" thing we come to the total radical things like:
Forbiddment to celebreate christmas in some schools (oh gosh do not insult muslims)
Or it's unofficialy forbidden in Britain to rise a flag of England.
We are also not allowed to use historicly correct terms like Aryan which actually doesn't contain any 'hidden meaning'. Which later gets replaced by half correct indo-european.
Or we do not allow for some people to fallow their traditions by simply taking some symbols of theirs as "insultive".
This is plain stupidity, not tolerance
Sorry, but if you see freedom in forbiddments and such, I don't really like your conception of it.
Then you look at abyss, abyss also gazes at you. The one who fights the monsters should watch that he himself wouldn't become a monster. Nitche had in mind that if you are opposing some radical idea you become radical yourself, just from the otherside, antagonist of that idea. For example if you are opposing racism, you end up being racist yourself. Just passive one, paranoic. For example indian origin guy doesn't get job.. and starts thinking "oh I didn't got job becouse of my nationality" now here first thing in his mind is about his own race and nationality. He has same race based thinking like the racist he's opposing. Don't you think this is wrong? In such stance people will take minor coincidence as the biggest proves and even strongest arguments won't be concidered. maybe you didn't get a job becouse of bad presnatation? Qualifications are secondary, sad to say.
Tolerance is not something you need to accept as equell. It's something you put up with, living and letting others live. It still can piss you off. Else we would call it acceptence, not tolerance.
So, the idea or principal would be simple: ALWAYS START FROM LOOKING AT YOURSELF.
Also, what Exile wrote:
Quote:Bah, just ignore all the bull's crap. It's easy. Focus on what you think is fun and let the rest do whatever. Find a good faction or a couple of friends with indies and just enjoy that. As for the forums? Post where you want to post, but don't complain when you're dragged into a "heated discussion" afterwards.
: P it rly works. Just same concept. You don't take things as insultive. I saw variuos people getting pissed off here. Then going elsewhere, and spilling their pissed off attitude on ones who had nothing to do with it. Spreading the "pissed off" attitude even more.. not good at all.
Quote:About the intolarance in general... there is quite a missonception in most of the societies.
.....
not to be frowned as "Hate spoksman" or whatever.
...
intresting and colorful "tolerance"
...
silenced things about Islam, but to spill unreasoned filth on christianity is ok (which both I saw on these forums).
...
Then in collective mind nazism and related stuff is hell thing
...
Forbiddment to celebreate christmas in some schools (oh gosh do not insult muslims)
....
Or it's unofficialy forbidden in Britain to rise a flag of England.
...
We are also not allowed to use historicly correct terms like Aryan which actually doesn't contain any 'hidden meaning'. Which later gets replaced by half correct indo-european.
...
Or we do not allow for some people to fallow their traditions by simply taking some symbols of theirs as "insultive".
....
For example if you are opposing racism, you end up being racist yourself.
...
For example indian origin guy doesn't get job.. and starts thinking "oh I didn't got job becouse of my nationality" now here first thing in his mind is about his own race and nationality. He has same race based thinking like the racist he's opposing. Don't you think this is wrong? In such stance people will take minor coincidence as the biggest proves and even strongest arguments won't be concidered. maybe you didn't get a job becouse of bad presnatation?
Apart from that, people might want to stop pushing their worldview and political views onto a computergame forum thinking "oooh look lots of stupid kids here what a great crowd to spread poorly hidden propaganda".
' Wrote:Apart from that, people might want to stop pushing their worldview and political views onto a computergame forum thinking "oooh look lots of stupid kids here what a great crowd to spread poorly hidden propaganda".
You just prove what I was saying above by stating this.
' Wrote:I do find the points you brought forward to be a bit one sided towards poor oprressed nazi agreeing and swastika loving "aryans", yes.
Strange that you complained about prejudice and then say "karlotta" to discredit someone.
yet again. Coincidences are taken as proves. And even strong arguments won't be taken into coincideration. This coincidence fall becouse I'm the guy who lives in country which suffered greatly from stalinism and is angry about stalinsim not beign condemned as nazism how it should be. About taking one sided position. Anyhow, just becouse I oppose stalinism doesn't mean I'm against communist as persons. Now why I mentioned cencorship of nazi symbols (gonna drag or bold this as propaganda too?) becouse by putting cencorship on it, people put cencorship on enitre cultural heritige which is not related with nazism in anyway. yet people take it as insultive. Which again drives from low education, becoming radical antagonist of idea or whatever reasons.
Now I expect you in our future discusion to avoid direct questions, to take samples of my sentences out of context and using it as the positive sentences which claims even diffrent meaning than they claimed in the context it should have been. While at the same trying to flame me as a >Person<.
So I don't see a reason to discuss anything. Unless you will be able to promise not to to things mentioned above and we will have civil discussion. Which forums were created back in acient greece.
If you throw a dice and a 1 come up, its most probably a coincidence.
When you throw a dice 6 times and a 1 comes up 6 times, its very unlikey that its a "coincidence".
What I find rather striking in your posts is that you keep complaining more about "discirmination" of nazi ideology and symbolism or anti-racism laws more than you complain about stalinism.
' Wrote:What I find rather striking in your posts is that you keep complaining more about "discirmination" of nazi ideology and symbolism or anti-racism laws more than you complain about stalisnism.
I did it a lot of times. Few times with scra. Few times in general discussion. Later I found it to be pointless. You see one side of the coin, becouse you want to see it.
Besides, becouse of stalinism there is nothing cencored. Nor I would want to cencor anything even if it would be condemned. But mass murder is mass murder. Discrimination is discrimination whatever on nationality, or religion and social status. War crimes are war crimes.
That is correct. You complained about SCRA, and said you would beat a player here to death for putting your country in the coalition in RP.
Whether that is a very nice thing of you to say or not, it still doesnt explain about you putting nazi symbolism in your avatars, portraying the ban of swastikas in some european countries as oppression, pretending islam is put over christianity in europe by anti discrimination laws and hypocritical tolerance, or building a mind-trip about an imaginary indian who has imaginary racist thoughts and imaginary poor qualifications which were made up by your own imagination.
None of that has to do with stalinism not being hated enough by people in you opinion. Thats a picture about something else, which you are trying to draw here.
Apart from the fact that I never saw anyone here defending stalinism.
' Wrote:That is correct. You complained about SCRA, and said you would beat someone to death for putting your country in the coalition in RP.
I heard a lot of threats to beat something to death then people doesn't mean it. Sometimes in joke form, sometimes becouse they are overreacting and on the heat. It's quite common. But of course you assume that I'm the one who is seriuos. This is a case of discrimination. Don't you think?
' Wrote:Whether that is a very nice thing of you to say or not, it still doesnt exaplin you putting nazi symbolism in your avatars, portraying the ban of swastikas in some european countries as oppression
Nope, they are not banned here. Only nazi swastikas. Even UNESCO defends some it's heritageit but oh well... who cares right?
' Wrote:pretending islam is put over christianity in europe
Not in europe. But in some countries and schools - yes.
' Wrote:by anti discrimination laws and hypocritical tolerance
I don't think that learining to hate someone else or using same discimination / hate methods somehow makes it to be tolerance. That is all what I tried to point out.
' Wrote:None of that has to do with stalinism not being hated enough by people in you opinion. Thats a picture about something else, which you are trying to draw here.
Now I didn't mentioned hated. I said officialy condemned. That's two diffrent things. If it would be officialy condemned maybe some families which suffered from repressions would get their compensations atleast in some form. And would be respected by some parties who still carries the guilt of it.
' Wrote:Apart from the fact that I never saw anyone here defending stalinism.
Then you sit in RHA main chats, you see quite a people using it as a jumping placdram to SCRA. In skype people don't really mind their "image". And believe me, I saw pretty much enough there.
Now sorry. It's 4 am here. I live in GMT +2 hours from London time. ANd I have to be at the uni at 8 AM