How should Zoners "behave"?

[bluntpencil2001]

They've ALWAYS been allied to the HF, and have been friendly with GoR/101st for quite some time.

That's their own fault, not the Corsairs'.

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[Raekur]

Just for RP sake as I have seen this kind of thing before...

Is it possible that AW began as a quiet little group of young zoner pilots who for some reason decided that things were a bit too quiet. So a small group of pilots decided to go a bit rogue so to speak and while the Zoners as a whole still contend that these young upstarts can be brought back to the community and thus are not hostile towards them, at the same time cant seem to quite get a leash on them. Eventually this leads to a couple of outcomes, first being that the young upstarts are "reformed" and understand that if they continue to stir up problems that the Zoner council will have to take more direct action to curb their actions or lose their political neutrality or publicly announce that these rogue members are no longer to be considered part of the Zoner collective and thus are given outcast status. (Basically forced to either have a personalized ID created, or chose another ID that is more to their RP style).

[Malaclypse 666]

@ Raekur: Interesting premise. Being declared "outcast" by the Zoner body politic would indeed seem to give them a raison d' etre to change affillliation. And who do we know that concerts and aids Lane Hackers? Who does indeed have a bone to pick with the Corsairs? Who would have reason to take potshots and the IMG/BSG....

Hell, we'd even give em Omicron 74 as a "going away" gift.

Woe be unto traders in Theta though. There's where the action will be, folks.

Dab? Korrd? Any AW want to comment on any of this? It does make weird sense, in a way.

Or do I have to pull out more Words of Discordian Wisdom??

Mal

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[Raekur]

My post was intended as a way to "explain" AW's actions or at the very least variance to what is expected of a Zoner. The end of the post was a way to remedy the issue and still present a RP way of getting there.
I am not trying to jump in to the middle of something that I have very little information about, just presenting a RP conclusion and possibly a "story" of how they got to where they are now.

[Dab]

Yes, we've always bee allied to HF, and there are many reasons.

We are friendly to 101st because of old RP things, and the identity of some previous member's RP characters. However, 101st and HF were the only Outcast or Outcast allies that we were friendly with for a LONG time. We didn't get friendly with the other Outcast/Outcast allies. Its changed now because of all the Corsair attacks. Even after they started we were neutral to the majority of the Outcasts. The Outcasts got on our friendly list by helping us when Corsairs attacked, or during our retaliation strikes. And yes, they are retaliation strikes. For the past 2-3 weeks we have done very few attacks on Gamma. We just started them up again because LDDLG and OPG have been attacking Gamma on a regular basis. Its been a daily basis recently.

And yes Blunt, we do offer our services to an extent. We no longer fight wars for money or commit assassinations. But we do still hunt bounties if and only if the bounty targets are already hostile to us (OPG/Benitez/TBH bounties a month or two back). We also do escort service if someone pays us to. If a pirate in a fighter sees two fighters or a GB/Cr escorting a trader, its likely going to stop any potential pirating attempts. And even if it doesn't, we are usually efficient enough to pre-occupy the pirate for the trader to get away. Its a very lawful action and not really out of our RP as it isn't giving us any enemies.

The Zoner ID actually allows those kind of actions. At least we aren't accepting payment to attack people from pirates. Some people HAVE been doing that.

@Raekur; We already have an RP thats MUCH more elaborate and explaining than that is. Plus, its not something I'm just going to toss away. Its been worked on for 2 years now, and is still on-going. It would work except for the fact that we are NOT Outcasts. The only reason we are hostile to Corsairs is because TBH came to help SCRA. After they started fighting, and we fought back, other Corsairs got involved as they were created (Benitez first, then OPG. Recently LDDLG attacked as well). BSG attacked us because of that.
I'm not mad and I know your trying to help, but turning AW into Outcasts wouldn't work at all. We aren't unlawful and are only hostile to Liberty, and thats not always happening. Outcasts are hostile to half of Sirius, while we are only hostile to those that provoke it or shoot first. This is because our RP. We aren't only operating in the charted areas of Sirius (started on this with Ghosts of the Past, but I haven't had the time, nor the inspiration for the 2nd part of that RP story) but uncharted areas. HF is sort of 'participating,' but mostly they are dealing with the stuff in Sirius. This means we try to stay neutral with everyone we can except for a few special cases.

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[bluntpencil2001]

You don't try to stay neutral though.

You like war.

You look for excuses for wars. An alliance with HF, which a neutral party shouldn't have, seems all-too handy here. It allows for war with SCRA and now, with Liberty. Liberty is none of the AW's business.

Maybe a background that was less tied to Zoner neutrality would be nice, since I can't find any fault for enjoying wars in-game. However, *Zoners*, or their Guards (who Guard, not attack), getting involved in wars annoys me.

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[Dab]

You don't try to stay neutral though.

You like war.

You look for excuses for wars. An alliance with HF, which a neutral party shouldn't have, seems all-too handy here. It allows for war with SCRA and now, with Liberty. Liberty is none of the AW's business.

Maybe a background that was less tied to Zoner neutrality would be nice, since I can't find any fault for enjoying wars in-game. However, *Zoners*, or their Guards (who Guard, not attack), getting involved in wars annoys me.

Blunt, you think the HF alliance is one thats an excuse because you think thats the only reason we allied the HF. If we wanted an excuse to war we would have allied someone more prone to wage war with alot of people. We'd ally a terrorist faction or a Corsair. We allied HF long before they had trouble with SCRA, Corsairs, BSG, or SA. Heck, I think that alliance came before there WAS an SA.

You only see excuses because you want to see excuses. You want a reason to dislike me, or something to justify your dislike of me.

Name anyone we are hostile to right now besides Phantoms that didn't shoot us or attack HF's Home System before hostilities began. (We tell people we will stay out unless HF asks for help, or the attacker attacks the HF home system. For example; SA shooting HF in Magellan or California, we wouldn't get involved. HF asks for it, or SA attacks inside Vespucci, we do get involved.)

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[bluntpencil2001]

Now now... reasons to dislike someone that I don't even know? I'm not that childish, thank you.

The guards of the Zoners should not be hostile to Liberty. It hurts the Zoner cause. Hence why the Zoners aren't at war with Liberty, in spite of their allies, the Order, being hostile to them.

If you are honestly neutral, you should not have alliances. Alliances throughout history have been the bane of neutrality worldwide.

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[Allocutus]

This thread has gotten so far out of hand I am amazed. So is the whole forum, for that matter. I have posted more than I ever have today; how sad. This is simply another degraded scruple that has turned into a flame war. Please, ladies and gentlemen, can we not act civilly and keep the portal free of clutter? Epyon has managed a solid twenty posts today, and that's not including threads in Flood; which would surely double the number. This is completely out of control. It seems as if I'm staring at Europe just previous to World War One: all the players are looking for blood.

Pauca Sed Matura
Allocutus

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[bluntpencil2001]

Hmm. I don't think that was necessary.

In a civilised debate, people don't often agree, Allocotus. This doesn't mean they are flaming, fighting or whatever. It's called disagreeing and discussing it.

I'm not of a mood for flames of any sort.

Mentioning WW1, though, you prove a point about Alliances. Without the mess of alliances before WW1, it would not have been a 'World' war, merely a scuffle in the Balkans.

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