The big cloak swindle

[AceofSpades]

If you trade on lanes, you can choose any ID you like and haul RP fitting cargo. For example Ageira can haul Trade Lanes and then transfer cash to LNS ship to get cloak in ooRP fashion.

If you supply the station, you use X trade ship, and then you mount cloak on LNS ship. Still ooRP fashion.

If you build a cloak for someone, they still have to spend that time on the lanes trading, not to mention you are assuming the POB is built in a corner-to-nowhere interaction-less zone, [surprisingly?] most of the manufacturing stations in business are not.

Now let's see how goes with PoB manufacturing if you bring stuff yourself. If PoB is hidde/far from lanes, you get to AFK cruise that way without interaction. You need to communicate with people on forums and via Skype. You have to get Nomad remains in ooRP fashion, or it was already obtained in ooRP fashion

Same argument with you implying that said PoBs are purposefully hidden away and avoiding interaction -- and therefore are negative. The issue isn't solved by assuming this method, people can trade while avoiding interaction just as easily.
The nomad remains ooRP issue is a problem of non-sensical commodity requirements, and should be solved by making necessary goods relevant--not by teh chop block.

Now imagine if that 500 million for Large Cloak is earned by using the lanes in between houses without deviating to hidden/far PoBs. Pirates can interact with these traders. Lawfuls can interact with these traders. Other traders can interact with these players. ALL IN GAME.

This is already the case, unless ye are specifically building yourself a cloak.. so which is the issue here for you, the sales of cloaks or people having the power to build them easily?

I seen Congress supply Puerto Rico stations by AFK trading through whole Texas and NY system without responding to my roleplay. How much good does that do to server atmosphere?

TY. I couldnt be sure this reply was truly one of yours until you threw in the bonus Congress insult.
I realize a habit of logging chars to force interaction doesn't always work out too well.. but if you spend some time on an actual Houston patrol you'll firstly notice that Congressmen in Texas always have their head on a swivel.
Again as well, i can say alone my Junkyard does more positive roleplay and opportunity for the 'server atmosphere' in regards to Device Sales than anything you've presented here.. and I certainly haven't avoided interaction with anyone.

That concept of "NPC sales" reeks of bias in that it offers nothing concretely beneficial but to take away gameplay from POB owners.

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[5:57:11 PM] InfernalTater (Lewis) [Formerly TLI-Inferno]:meanwhile, Aces 'I don't always miss my destinations, but when I do, I'm on the other side of house space.'

Seriously nerf Junkers.

Shoot to Thrill

[SnakThree]

Again as well, i can say alone my Junkyard does more positive roleplay and interaction for the 'server atmosphere' in regards to Device Sales than anything you've presented here.. and I certainly haven't avoided interaction with anyone.

The concept of "NPC sales" reeks of bias in that it offers nothing concretely beneficial but to take away gameplay from POB owners.

Your PoB that you so love is located in desolated AFK-trader-heaven system named Iverness where noone but PoB suppliers and VERY RARE guests flies through.

Build it in capital or bordering system where everyone passes through and is actually busy system and then praise your efforts.

My positive influence on server atmosphere consists on heavy emphasis on player-player interaction in game and being active in places where I can find other players to interact or others can find me to interact. I hail almost every ship I meet and decent amount of them hail me back. If I was to trade with your PR or Iverness stations, half of my travel would consist of me watching new series or playing with my pets without attending to my ship, because that space would be EMPTY. Miner-PoB, Trader-PoB, Codehunter-PoB interactions most often consist of no roleplay done in game, therefore I do not see poorly placed and redudant PoBs as benefiting game atmosphere.

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[St.Denis]

Why pick on the Cloaks as the big thing that is done ooRP?

Buying and selling Ships - done mostly ooRP also no Player interaction.
Buying and selling Codenames - done mostly ooRP also no Player interaction.
Buying and selling Armour and other items - done mostly ooRP also no Player interaction.
A few people seem to make a lot of their money with even less Player Interaction than Base Owners.

So what is the big problem with Buying and Selling Cloaks?

A Base Owner has to supply to his Base (for a MkII Advanced Cloak)

Reinforced Alloy - 120k
Industrial Hardware - 30k
Plasmonic Metamaterials - 18k

Lets forget about the Nomad Remains.

That is 168k of Commodities required for the Base which equates to 34 x 5kers - Seems like plenty of opportunity for Player Interaction.

Add to this that somebody wants to buy this item for 500 million. If he makes 50 million profit on a round trip then this appears to plenty of opportunity for Player Interaction.

Now we do the same scenario that the Item is sold on NPC Bases. It appears to me that suddenly we have gone down from 44 possibly chances of Player Interaction to just 10.

The up side of the NPC Base, for some, would be that every man and his dog will have lots of cloaks five minutes after it is implemented. You will see all and sundry just disappearing every two seconds - maybe this will lead to less Player Interaction????? Especially if this new idea is implemented where it is ammo based and readily available.

I also do believe that most Bases are actually within 10-15k of Trade Lanes. Those that are not are mostly in systems without TLs.

.

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'I would like to be half as clever as some people like to believe they are'
Life is full of disappointments, it is how we handle them that helps to define us, as a person

[SnakThree]

[color=#FFDAB9]Why pick on the Cloaks as the big thing that is done ooRP?

Because I took it as example. What item would be more to your liking? Docking Module? Jumpdrive? Scanner?

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[St.Denis]

[color=#FFDAB9]Why pick on the Cloaks as the big thing that is done ooRP?

Because I took it as example. What item would be more to your liking? Docking Module? Jumpdrive? Scanner?

If you are going to pick on things that are done ooRP - pick on them all.

We just can't pick and chose what we 'see' and what we don't want to 'see'.

And out of my whole post this is the only thing you could respond to?

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'I would like to be half as clever as some people like to believe they are'
Life is full of disappointments, it is how we handle them that helps to define us, as a person

[SnakThree]

Ach shucks, my apologies if I incorrectly assumed your post is directed specifically to me and responded in less than polite matter.

Problem with PoB item manufacturing is, that they deviate traders from designed trade routes where interactons have the highest chance to occur. This is a bad turn of events in a multi-player game which is driver by player-player interaction.

For example, as unlawful, lawful or trader, I will not go out of my way to get one of those base suppliers. If that base supplier would be on the lanes, trading as per usual, I could easilly interact with them with all types of characters thus enjoying it and thus having a meaningful playtime.

Now let's see how Junkyard in Iverness is supplied. It consists of many click of cruising through empty space untill you reach JG/TL network in bordering systems ( Newcastle or Cortez or Mancherter?() ). If that time was spend doing Pittsburgh-Thames route, Liberty and Bretonian cops, criminals and traders could actually meet that player and interact with.

If that supplier would prefer smuggling contraband, lawfuls could be more active to catch him If that supplier would prefer mining, criminals might interact wth them. If that supplier would prefer mercing, everyone could interact with him.

What I am trying to say, is that having more PoBs than average number of players on server causes concerns whether this games remains multiplayer or co-op only. I'd prefer to interact with people rather than NPCs, thus I trade through systems that have people in it. I would expect that other people would do the same, unless they want to avoid interaction.

But that is me, trying to reason for a more multiplayer server rather than co-op.

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[Derkylos]

No one needs cloaks, jumpdrives or docking modules, tho. I played my first month back without any of the above. If you want to meet interesting pirates...oh, wait...there aren't any >.> just trade through the systems they're in.

TBH, I have trouble getting people to interact with my Zoner liner...so much so that I end up collecting every illegal commodity under the sun and it's only NPC attention that ever bothers me...

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[AceofSpades]

Now let's see how Junkyard in Iverness is supplied. It consists of many click of cruising through empty space untill you reach JG/TL network in bordering systems ( Newcastle or Cortez or Mancherter?
Your PoB that you so love is located in desolated AFK-trader-heaven system named Iverness where noone but PoB suppliers and VERY RARE guests flies through.

Yet Inverness now has a frequent population that it never did before.. because the station is purposefully stocked with a variety of goods so that incoming/outgoing vessels can make it a part of standard trading runs.
"If that supplier would prefer smuggling contraband, lawfuls could be more active to catch him If that supplier would prefer mining, criminals might interact wth them. If that supplier would prefer mercing, everyone could interact with him."
The enticing aspect of the station is that people can do all sorts of those things here as well as bringing supplies, creating more trade runs and more activity for you to pick on. On top of that, commodities are priced aggressively to purposefully create markets for previously underutilized local goods, letting Roleplay for cargo pirates benefit as well.

If there's a complaint you have there it's your expectations of Player Base interaction, of which there are few standards for in-game interaction set by rule.. but not the process of manufacturing specifically.
If the issue you have is with the "many klicks of cruising through empty space before you reach a TL/JG network", then you have an issue regarding the concept of a "Borderworld", and I cant help with that.

Problem with PoB item manufacturing is, that they deviate traders from designed trade routes where interactons have the highest chance to occur. This is a bad turn of events in a multi-player game which is driver by player-player interaction.

Even manufacturing requires goods we need that force us to fly all over Sirius.. all but the most standard of supply commodities are scattered throughout it. "on the lanes, trading as per usual, <where> I could easilly interact with them with all types of characters thus enjoying it and thus having a meaningful playtime." is exactly what transpires, limited only by "I will not go out of my way to get one of those base suppliers" and likewise attitudes.

Cloaking Devices have been adjusted multiple times already as a gameplay item, certainly the method in which they are manufactured is not the determining issue, or a marked improvement.

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Ach shucks, my apologies if I incorrectly assumed your post is directed specifically to me and responded in less than polite matter.

St.Denis Wrote: Why pick on the Cloaks as the big thing that is done ooRP?
Because I took it as example.

Miner-PoB, Trader-PoB, Codehunter-PoB interactions most often consist of no roleplay done in game, therefore I do not see poorly placed and redudant PoBs as benefiting game atmosphere.

But that is me, trying to reason for a more multiplayer server rather than co-op.

--a cordial, impartial, and open-minded crusader of multiplayer activity

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[5:57:11 PM] InfernalTater (Lewis) [Formerly TLI-Inferno]:meanwhile, Aces 'I don't always miss my destinations, but when I do, I'm on the other side of house space.'

Seriously nerf Junkers.

Shoot to Thrill

[Badperson]

Let's just move on from direct insults. This has nothing to do with Congress. If this thread happened because of one of their actions, then PM Aces about it.


Anyway:

I'm fine with the current cloak factory / buying method as it is now. Not because I like it. It's because the current game changes have already caused some to leave, and right now the best way to prevent more problems is to just keep things as is or revert things back to the way they were in 4.86.

I know that a lot of people will already be concerned about the cloak changes, especially their effect on larger ships which imo is already balanced enough, maybe OP.

So, I vote for keeping the current changes. There have been enough technical changes this mod version.

[Zen_Mechanics]

I was not suggesting any mod change in that regard, but rather asking people who make their living out of it to do it in proper manners.

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Were fools to make war on our brothers in arms.