POB Refinery and or Ship Modules

[Karst]

The possibility of some type of factory mechanic has come up a number of times, of course. I think there are a few problems with the practical balance of it though.

The most obvious being: How do you avoid the mechanic acting as 'passive' money-making that doesn't add any actual gameplay?
If a factory module using ore and producing a more valuable version existed, it would simply result in players flying the ore route as normal, except that at the end they put the ore on a POB outside Manhattan instead of Manhattan itself (and later take off the finished product for a 30s no-risk trip).
That doesn't really enhance gameplay in any meaningful way.

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[LuckyOne]

^ it does if there is now more reasons to siege POBs.

It also makes for "prime" targets / pirating routes. If you know somebody has a POB that produces expensive commodities you are more interested to target it as a pirate.

Multiple factions might have the same idea of pirating the rich POB trader and thus you get inter-faction conflict.

Unlawful activity brings lawful activity.

And then you get gameplay.

Better than the current one of traders flying around aimlessly and pirates being almost non-existent (or just pirating miners in the same mining spots again and again).

EDIT:

I realize making the POB factory just turn one type of commodity into another might not be very balanced. It could be made harder to exploit by requiring other commonly produced commodities (fuel, polymers, neon, whatever) for the recipes.The end result would be more diversified hauling instead of everyone just trading ores or smuggling Cardamine and Artifacts. I think people would actually fight for prime locations for their POBs much more than they do now (because now it doesn't matter much, the only way to earn credits through POB manufacturing is making expensive equipment, and there's not that big of a market for that, seeing as it's often recycled by people).

[darkwind]

Just idea for formula to make it working.
Ore price remains the same
Refined price (Any level) = Ore Price + (Time miner spent to mine and deliver it to refinery * 6 + 500)

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[Karst]

I don't think you've really thought this through.

Let's say we have a 'processed Gold Ore' commodity that New Tokyo buys for a high price. So, players add a factory to a POB outside New Tokyo.
Haulers fly Gold Ore to Kusari and drop it on the POB.

Gameplay is exactly the same as if they're simply selling Gold Ore on the planet directly. The knowledge that the ore is going to a POB instead of the planet doesn't really change the motivation of a pirate in the Taus. They don't have any particular incentive to pirate a hauler beyond the basic incentive of pirating an ore hauler.

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[LuckyOne]

I don't think you've really thought this through.

You're right, I'm kind of shooting for the hip here. But if you make it so your processing factory requires stuff that's most easily found in Liberty or Rheinland you might think about putting your POB somewhere else but the final destination, to increase the chances of your ore being processed by random people doing trading.

It's simple player motivation really. Nobody really wants to fly half the map to sell something as mundane as Neon to a POB. But people will happily freight cargo on short routes if they need some quick cash.

Of course if this were implemented the whole economy would need to be overhauled significantly. The main source of income would then be refining or selling ore / commodities to POBs, not planets. Both factions and traders would log in higher numbers during POB sieges if they perceived POBs as important sources of their income.

POB builders could compete on prices and margin, just like how real economy works.

[Karst]

You could balance an ore factory to require multiple ores from different regions, or an ore and a regular commodity from elsewhere. But I think it would be easier to balance factories that are completely unrelated to ores, due to the relatively uneven distribution of ores and accessibility.

I have played around with this concept: A POB fabrication system based around a circular route between the houses, in which each house produces a manufactured commodity out of ingredients from two other houses, like this:



This would be a relatively fair and balanced system, which creates high-risk routes of factory commodities between houses (the base price should be high enough to strongly discourage losing the cargo). And since every house has either an outgoing or an incoming route to or from every other, diplomatic faction balance is "symmetrical" to a degree.

I'm still not entirely convinced we actually want a system in which POBs add value to a process though.

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[SwiftWing]

The possibility of some type of factory mechanic has come up a number of times, of course. I think there are a few problems with the practical balance of it though.

The most obvious being: How do you avoid the mechanic acting as 'passive' money-making that doesn't add any actual gameplay?
If a factory module using ore and producing a more valuable version existed, it would simply result in players flying the ore route as normal, except that at the end they put the ore on a POB outside Manhattan instead of Manhattan itself (and later take off the finished product for a 30s no-risk trip).
That doesn't really enhance gameplay in any meaningful way.

The possibility of some type of factory mechanic has come up a number of times, of course. I think there are a few problems with the practical balance of it though. I don't see it when it is done right.

"passive' money-making that doesn't add any actual gameplay?"
it would not be Passive, it is a extra step in the mining Process. and a way that a base itself can make money. make them not so Useless

"except that at the end they put the ore on a POB outside Manhattan instead of Manhattan itself"
this would not work cause the Ore has to be refined before it can be hauled cause it is a 2 to 1 refined smelting Process, 2 ore to 1 Refined Item. and only the refined product is what would be worth something, Also the refined Products like Gold etc. could only be bought from POBs or any Processing plant. if could also be bought maybe at local Stations and Planets like it is now. so the Refined Items would be bumped up in Price and the Refined Items could also be sold Locally but for a much lower profit price. in the most part it would all work as it is now. but you could buy the Refined product at a much lower price at a POB.

In Real life the ores are processed into its refined state and taken locally. also the main point here is to have POB's near the mining areas, cause hauling Ore a long way would be pretty much worthless, cause it would not be worth much at any distance only locally. the Primary Refined Products would be worth a bit more than the Ores are worth now, So in no way it would throw off the balance of the game. Not a really large amount increase but enough in adding the 2nd stage to mining to be worth it. but mining rates might have to increase x2 at least in all areas that can be refined since now you're doing double the work. for example you could also have a Item that you have to bring into a POB that is apart of the Smelting Process.

Here are the steps.
1. A POB is set up with a Smelter, Lets say that you have to bring in Some fuel that uses up 5k to smelt 5k of refined
Goods
2. now you have to mine twice the ores as before
3. the smelter Refines the Ores at a 2 to 1 ratio
4. now over x amount of time the ores is smelted down to produce the Finished Refined metals.
5. Now you can pick it up and make maybe 3-4k or so Profit locally, or haul it to the end of the line and make 60 Mil or so at least. the point is using the Profit by distance numbers the farther you take it the more you will make.

[Busy Miner]

If the ore isn't worth anything, less 5k transports will come to the mining field itself. I would keep the ore price, just enhance the price for the refined items. The refined stuff already exists in game, one would "just" have to rework the prices, so they make a much bigger profit.
The idea that unrefined stuff is worth more than shiny ingots or cut diamonds because of "taxation" as it is atm is stupid imo.
Makes a difference if one could buy gold ingots from Graves for 10000cr to sell for 15000cr than to buy at a POB for 6000...

[Banned player t202085]

If the ore isn't worth anything, less 5k transports will come to the mining field itself. I would keep the ore price, just enhance the price for the refined items. The refined stuff already exists in game, one would "just" have to rework the prices, so they make a much bigger profit.
The idea that unrefined stuff is worth more than shiny ingots or cut diamonds because of "taxation" as it is atm is stupid imo.
Makes a difference if one could buy gold ingots from Graves for 10000cr to sell for 15000cr than to buy at a POB for 6000...

This would create a massive credit inflation (as in too easy) and would also make the problem Karst outlined happen.

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[Busy Miner]

...
This would create a massive credit inflation (as in too easy) and would also make the problem Karst outlined happen.

This is all hypothetical anyway, because no one will try to change the POB scripts that much and no one will make the effort to completely rebalance the ore-economy.