Just saw this thread >.>
Anyway, it was always nice meeting RM on my Garret merc, always something different, interesting happened. Ow, and I was never ganked by you guys, so kudos for that all.
Agmen of Eladesor Wrote:But you either follow our rules here and work with us - or STFU and GTFO.
I talked to Cannon about my FR 5 and he has clarified his viewpoint on the situation for me a bit. Instead of debating about the legitimacy of the action, since it is legitimate if the admins say it is, instead I'll give you feedback on the way this was done.
The way this was done felt entirely dirty. Everything is hidden. There is no way for me to interact. There is no way for me to even try and defend myself. You even put the report in the criminal database in quotes, which precludes it from the search function, so if I search my name, I don't see the criminal database. A little thing which could go a long way would be taking the reports in there out of quotes so they show up in search functions.
Could you guys, maybe, do things in public with "trusted Freelancers"? The way it stands now, it looks like those trusted Freelancers are just you, only too lazy to actually try and patrol on your RM, so you take the challenge out of it and patrol on an alternate character without a tag. I don't know if that is true or not, but since all business is conducted in PMs and the posts are all made by The Major, it really just looks like those [FL] folks are just RM alternates who don't want the challenge of actually patrolling on their RMs. I don't know if it's true, but really, that's the impression I get. Taking it out of the shadows would be another really small step to not seem like really big jerks.
The hidden way you did it kind of precludes me from RPing with you. There's no reasonable way for my character to ever say "Wait, I did what!?" or "Oh, well I guess I did that and pissed you off." and RP with you. What do I do? Send a communication which says "I did what!?" and you point to a screenshot and say "Pay me or face the consequences!" It's not very inviting. I might complain about the [LN] not responding to distress calls, but they used to send out messages to people they were FR5ing informing them that they were going to be FR5ed. This was a lot more inviting to respond. Hell, at least the people had the opportunity to learn that they were going to get FR5ed. That's another really small step you could take to not look like giant jerks. And then no one could complain that they were never interacted with, either.
But then again, you might not want it to be inviting. In that case, my god is that a selfish way to RP. At no time does a system like this offer any consideration to the player you're "Interacting" with. It just exudes an air of self-entitlement, that you are an official faction and everyone else should just move aside and stop bothering you so you can fight [LN] or whatever it is you are training to fight in Braunsweig. It reeks of self-entitlement and is really selfish.
And on a side note, the last time I have ever seen an RM outside of Braunsweig was when 3 of them were fighting 3 Phantoms. It was a fun fight which occurred about four months ago. Can you come out and play sometime? Maybe you can stop relying on Freelancers to find smugglers for you.
[8:32:45 PM] Dusty Lens: Oh no, let me get that. Hello? Oh it's my grandma. She says to be roleplay.
[12:49:19 AM] Elgatodiablo: You know its nice that you have all that proof and all, Bacon... but I just don't believe you.
' Wrote:And on a side note, the last time I have ever seen an RM outside of Braunsweig was when 3 of them were fighting 3 Phantoms. It was a fun fight which occurred about four months ago. Can you come out and play sometime? Maybe you can stop relying on Freelancers to find smugglers for you.
I cannot answer in the rest, because I am not involved in this issue. Stating that we are in Braunschweig all the time, is a truly poor comment.
Facts?
1) The last 2 weeks I am the most active [RM] member and I haven't been to Braunschweig for a month or something.
2) [RM] in early January recruited many people who were totally inexperienced in fighting. RHA and LN killed those pilots very easily. So we had to make some training events in order to improve that and be able to hold in a fight a little longer. But after this period, we only held weekly training events there. Not more often.
3) If you think we are all day in Braunschweig, maybe take a look in our Message Dump.
4) Also, check the criminal database and see how many of the listed names are by RM/RFP reports.
If you are angry, don't let yourself express things which are blatantly false. Keep that in mind;)
While delivered with slightly less vitriol I have to concur with Baconsoda. Not only was this conducted in an entirely closed off manner by use of proxies (which would and should be ignored. FL IFF vessel chasing a ship demanding he stop for a cargo scan? That gets you marked a criminal in Rheinland? What moron would stop under those conditions?) the ability for these persons to address their grievances were non existent.
Hell, the way you handled all this was even in violation of Rheinland law. Even if you had any documentation about these proceedings there was no way anyone could come forward to pay their fine.
Quote:§2.1.3. Other regulations regarding the shipping of certain goods may be implemented after official publication on the Communication channel.
§2.1.4. The following regulations are implemented in case of contraband possession:
§2.1.4.1. For the vessels of Fighter, Bomber or Freighter class ' cargo confiscation and 1.000.000 SC fine.
§2.1.4.2. For the vessels of Gunboat class or Transport class with 3500 units of contraband in the cargo hold or less - cargo confiscation and 2.500.000 SC fine.
§2.1.4.3. For the vessels of Transport class with more than 3500 units of contraband in the cargo hold ' cargo confiscation and
Just some random Freelancer who sends screens over forum pm which is then, at best, locked away in a thread no one can access before they're FR5'd.
When Sina had the data bounty up every transaction was carried out clear as day and the offending parties had every chance to correct their errors. Because he was carrying out Kusari law. If Rheinland law is to kick out anyone seen smuggling without a word I'd suggest you take a moment to make that well clear.
Also, Bacon, the RM are well active and trying their best to bring in people in a very, very hostile part of Disco.
Well, this is just my experience, and I may have simply been unlucky when it comes to time and time zones, but I have seen very few RM outside of Braunsweig. But then again, it's very hard to meet and please everyone, so it was in poor taste. Indeed the RM should train quite a bit because of the seemingly insurmountable odds the RHA, SCRA, and [LN]-Gold present them with. My apologies. It was a poor claim.
The other stuff was really lame, though.
[8:32:45 PM] Dusty Lens: Oh no, let me get that. Hello? Oh it's my grandma. She says to be roleplay.
[12:49:19 AM] Elgatodiablo: You know its nice that you have all that proof and all, Bacon... but I just don't believe you.
I feel that the situation that has happened here is rather indicative of the negative aspects of FR5ing. Instead of becoming a tool for factions to get rid of genuinely annoying players who are harassing them by abusing game mechanics (for instance, a Junker that pirates Republican transports, only to flee and dock on a lawful planet) FR5 has turned into something used to make people's lives easier.
"Oh, well, we caught this smuggler smuggling. Let's FR5 him instead of keeping his name on a list and logging in and spacing him when we see him."
Ultimately, I see this as a poor use of FR5. In the end, it does nothing, as the person targeted hasn't really done anything wrong, and can simply fix his reputation via bribes and/or missions.
What it does do is that it brings the admins unnecessarily between roleplay, stops the roleplay altogether, so that the filer of the FR5 can simply wash his hands clean and go watch a film or sit still in space for 5 hours.
Quote:[7:42:05 PM][6:51:36 PM] Igor (Smokey): btw terry
[6:51:48 PM] Terrance Cooper: Ye?
[6:52:00 PM] Igor (Smokey): nothin
[6:52:03 PM] Igor (Smokey): just sayin btw
[6:52:05 PM] Terrance Cooper: <_<
Quote:Johnny_Haas: you shot anti criuse speed rockets!!!
Johnny_Haas: but why????
Johnny_Haas: ??
Johnny_Haas: why you shoot criuse speed rockets?
Baconsoda, your assumption of those Freelancers (which is in fact one guy) being RM personnel is entirely incorrect and I don't even see why you would think we're patrolling on hidden characters instead of using our own.
I believe I already linked you sufficient evidence that we're in long standing interaction with the Freelancer catching you here (post 17), which is all visible and available in public.
Here is the private message indicating your catch from the same person interacting with us previously. He sent me it in PM because Freelancers don't have access to the criminal database. Here is the RM roster. Adam Spire is not on it, that negates your assumption that he is in an RM member on an alternate character.
The criminal database was open to all traders iRP and even if it wasn't, you easily could have checked it and seen yourself in it in an OORP manner.
Allow me to cite one of the most relevant articles in the laws of Rheinland.
' Wrote:[font=Lucida Console]
§4. Ignorance of Rheinland laws does not exempt of liability.
The same way how ignorance of being caught doesn't negate the fact that you were caught.
I also trust you understand that Rheinland is littered by smugglers, a few days ago I spent 3 hours running around the lanes and catching about 15 guys with illegal stuff in his hold.
We cannot title a comms message to every single smuggler or criminal that evades prosecution, we have a lot of ground to cover considering how we're the only active lawful faction in Rheinland and we cannot deal with the problems of everyone individually. Instead, there is a central collection of all criminals, where criminals can see that they are criminals. Just because they don't know of it, that doesn't mean they are innocent.
In addition, you landed on New Berlin, our best guarded and most prized establishment in Rheinland, we can debate whether a full cargo hold of artifacts carried by a gigantic ship would not be spotted by planetside security anyway. Perhaps if you were to bother with actually trying to avoid being caught and not using the lanes / players list when smuggling, things would have turned out to be different. That too, is quite a "lame" act as far as I'm concerned.
At any rate, incidents like this will not be occurring again, since I have given the Freelancer in question permit to confiscate cargo that violates the laws of Rheinland a few days ago here.
If you are so disappointed about being caught, you can always rename / re-rep, but I'm not taking you off the list, simply because of the fact that you were caught violating Rheinland laws in Rheinland.
As a final note, the Rheinland Military, nor the Federal Police are not meant to be carebear nice guys you can see in other Houses. We have a revolution going on exactly because the government and its arms treat situations like this with utter hostility and brutality. Getting shot because you committed one act is a perfectly role play measure, especially considering how the Riot Police is using live firearms to deal with protests or how we don't give a quarter to any civilians who decide to willingly oppose the Rheinland government by violating its laws.
![[Image: Skritt.gif]](http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj139/Kadinski/Skritt.gif)
