I'm not sure that indies will be especially thrilled about going for Azurite if there will be mines of this power.
I'd rather Iridium just like everyone does now. Not worth the nerves.
(07-27-2018, 09:56 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: The current reactor is too closed. My proposal is more open, and whilst it allows larger ships to penetrate the shield its not without risk.
Unique doesn't necessarily translate into good. It's a nice aesthetic, but it's functionally flawed and doesn't facilitate proper mining activity.
(07-27-2018, 09:12 AM)Kazinsal Wrote: IMO the drag is fantastic. I didn't even know there was a neural net AI alert for that.
I just find it odd. It covers such a small area, and doesn't really make the area more dangerous.
I can get 5k'ers in there easy,
I don't think the aesthetic actually affects its functionality here, the issue with mining is the drop mechanic, it's a high value mine so the idea is that you'd bring friends to it to help mine or defend you. It doesn't really need to support single player mining as every other mine can do that and there is nothing wrong with variation.
The drag has very little - no actual impact but it really does support the immersion of the game and it serves a subtle reminder "you are not in a safe place"
The worst enemy of a good plan, is the dream of a perfect one.
(07-27-2018, 10:06 AM)Silverlight Wrote: I can get 5k'ers in there easy,
I don't think the aesthetic actually affects its functionality here, the issue with mining is the drop mechanic, it's a high value mine so the idea is that you'd bring friends to it to help mine or defend you. It doesn't really need to support single player mining as every other mine can do that and there is nothing wrong with variation.
Generally when I refer to large vessels I'm referring to the Hegemon as its the ultimate indie miner.
As I've said in the OP, solo mining is the lifeblood of an active field. You can look at every other field, and see very noticeable differences why (even before the recent drop change) Azurite lags behind and is unappealing. Variation is bad if something is so different it's unique aspects become weaknesses. The only people I've seen bother to mine it are IRG| once or twice and Core| every other time (when we hate ourselves). Azurite is too exclusive, and this needs to change.
(07-26-2018, 11:06 PM)Silverlight Wrote: The claim is that it is balanced but this is only because it sell for 7k in rho, the long range routes aren't any better than silver ore. Increase the extraction rate 4 fold and remove its local sell points.
When I said that Azurite was balanced the way it was, I meant that Azurite Mining was intentionally set up with low drops for balance reasons, not that it actually is balanced in its current state. I agree that it is broken in its current state and it will be looked at. The reactor could also be modified to fit Hegemons without removing the hollow planetoid aspect if that turns out to be a big enough issue as well, as we already have an unused model for the interior that can do this.
(07-26-2018, 11:06 PM)Silverlight Wrote: The claim is that it is balanced but this is only because it sell for 7k in rho, the long range routes aren't any better than silver ore. Increase the extraction rate 4 fold and remove its local sell points.
When I said that Azurite was balanced the way it was, I meant that Azurite Mining was intentionally set up with low drops for balance reasons, not that it actually is balanced in its current state. I agree that it is broken in its current state and it will be looked at. The reactor could also be modified to fit Hegemons without removing the hollow planetoid aspect if that turns out to be a big enough issue as well, as we already have an unused model for the interior that can do this.
I would say that it is balanced to the local sell points, they are too high if the gas was mined easier
The worst enemy of a good plan, is the dream of a perfect one.
You are of course correct that currently, Azurite mining is a complete waste of time due to the glacially slow mining rate. The problem is that the routes are calculated with a mining time of 720 seconds, which is only 50% more than a normal field. Anyone who's gone through the agony of attempting to mine that stuff will have noticed that it takes a LOT more than 50% longer than a normal field to fill a ship.
Your suggestions are nice, but honestly all that's needed is prices that actually match the awful mining speed (maybe with a minor increase in speed).
I did some calculations the last time this topic came up.
(11-09-2017, 04:00 PM)Karst Wrote: Okay, did some quick calculations.
Kodiak Research Station, Alaska $29,500
Sunderland Research Station, Newcastle $32,000
Kansai Research Station, Honsh $27,400
Schatten Research Station, Frankfurt $25,800
would be reasonable prices. Actually a bit on the low side, if we take effective mining rates into account and don't just use the nominal 2x multiplier.
Also:
(07-26-2018, 10:35 PM)Lythrilux Wrote: Solo-mining with Hegemons is an essential building block for creating an active mining field.
Lolno. Quite the contrary, solo-mining in Hegemons is completely irrelevant for mining balance. Mining prices are calculated with an eight minute mining time, which roughly matches a miner and a transport spending four minutes each in the field. Solo Hegemon mining is therefor best for short routes and drops off rapidly as route length increases, because the shorter mining time makes up a lower percentage of the total time spent and obviously the Hegemon's smaller hold makes longer trips inefficient.
Besides, solo Hegemons really have no business mining alien gas in the far Omicrons.
You've taken my point about Hegemons creating activity and gone on a tangent about mining balance and profit, which this thread isn't about. Its about making the field more better for activity generation as well as seeing things through the eyes of newbies and independents (us veterans won't unironically touch Hegemons), so my points regarding that are still valid.
And if there's profit to be made, people will go to the lengths to extract them. I really don't see how Hegemons outside of House space is any more plausible than the Edge Worlds. The Hegemon is practically designed for deep space ops, as it also houses an internal refinery.
But lore aside, if Omicron mining wants to get off the ground, there really needs to be Hegemon mining for indies (which has access to lawful sell points). I may not know everything on mining balance itself, but I know what constitutes to consistent ambient activity, and what the Omicrons lack in those regards which need to be improved.
(07-27-2018, 10:13 AM)Xalrok Wrote:
(07-26-2018, 11:06 PM)Silverlight Wrote: The claim is that it is balanced but this is only because it sell for 7k in rho, the long range routes aren't any better than silver ore. Increase the extraction rate 4 fold and remove its local sell points.
When I said that Azurite was balanced the way it was, I meant that Azurite Mining was intentionally set up with low drops for balance reasons, not that it actually is balanced in its current state. I agree that it is broken in its current state and it will be looked at. The reactor could also be modified to fit Hegemons without removing the hollow planetoid aspect if that turns out to be a big enough issue as well, as we already have an unused model for the interior that can do this.