OKay hold on guys, we already gave up on "Dont call this a Frigate" thing. That has been discussed TOO OFTEN, pls stop this "Oh but it's not a real frigate".
The whole purpose of this is to give our current existing Ships the role and thus a Frigate inside Freelancer Discovery would be a Blockade Runner with Cargo. We've requested a new ship class for too long now, this thread is not about that.
Good that is no longer a frigate like even the title say, so what about start to call it another thing, like armored transports? i believe is more suitable for is now clear what you want.
if you go to the wiki page, mainly here you will notice that exist several ships with more armor than many gunboats, and with cargo hold big enough for even one cau 8 an still have plenty of room to take those "urgent suplies" to the sieged locations. like the gallic Taureau that is even called Gallic Assault Transport, or even the corsair Armicustos . those are also good ships for the job, and they only miss the powercore and gunboat turrets of the salvager and raba. other proposal is a non luxury democritus that could be a civilian, sirius wide, armored transport. just make it more clean and better turrets and a gunboat shield. the gheisha is to ... it is a traditional kusar luxury ship, so let's keep that way.
see? no real new ships need it. just modify some, and if necessary new ones, just take the model of some and make it cleaner or something like that and bang, new ship with more armor and less cargo hold, for the armor.
(05-09-2019, 09:14 PM)Lusitano Wrote: Good that is no longer a frigate like even the title say, so what about start to call it another thing, like armored transports? i believe is more suitable for is now clear what you want.
if you go to the wiki page, mainly here you will notice that exist several ships with more armor than many gunboats, and with cargo hold big enough for even one cau 8 an still have plenty of room to take those "urgent suplies" to the sieged locations. like the gallic Taureau that is even called Gallic Assault Transport, or even the corsair Armicustos . those are also good ships for the job, and they only miss the powercore and gunboat turrets of the salvager and raba. other proposal is a non luxury democritus that could be a civilian, sirius wide, armored transport. just make it more clean and better turrets and a gunboat shield. the gheisha is to ... it is a traditional kusar luxury ship, so let's keep that way.
see? no real new ships need it. just modify some, and if necessary new ones, just take the model of some and make it cleaner or something like that and bang, new ship with more armor and less cargo hold, for the armor.
As I've said many times, we're not just looking for a transport with a lot of armor and guns. We're looking for a transport with a lot of armor and firepower, that is also fast enough to serve as an escort, with weapons that are fast enough to hit enemies that are not flying towards you because they are shooting someone else. In order to not be overpowered, such ships would have reduced cargo.
We're looking for more ships like the salvage frigate, which has high armor, but is faster than most high armor transports, and has gunboat turrets, while also being faster than most transports with similar armor. This allows it to serve as a protector. A transport that simply has a lot of armor and transport turrets, still can't serve to protect other ships very well. It needs fast speed and gunboat turrets.
Me and others have already stated that pre-existing ships could be turned into this "frigate" type, such as various 3k transports. However, a couple of new ships would also be suitable, to better establish the class.
so modify the ones that exist!! i gave some examples of some that could be easly modified! and even gave one that just some minor aesthetic modifications could be a NEW ship for civilian use, or in other terms, all around sirius! Nepotu said that just need it one for testing, so why not a non luxury democritus? just make a simple modificantion on the rendering of the ship, make it "less luxury", more guns and power core and bang, easy new ship to use. see? easy for a modeler, and i bet it would be easier for the dev and others that make decisions about the game, to accept it.
do you know why i'm so mad with things i see here? and when ii say here, it is not just this post, but more things .... "i want i want i want" then i talk to a dev about few things and ask for a thing or two, and he says that he agree with my request but the team as no time and bla bla, and then when i see the updates ... nothing!! i saw players offering ships and NO! they were not accepted. then i see devs saying that they waste many of their free time, and i really do believe that!
so again about this topic, no longer a frigate, great! one armored transport that can take survive one attack and even fight back. fine for me like i said before. the salavager as example? good because i know how good it is. make new ships? for whom? all sirius? that will be a lot of ships. so why not take some that already exist? not suitable? buff the guns and power core and armor, and reduce the cargo hold! simple done.
not going to waste more time with this. i gave a simple solution, if you guys don't want to accept it so good luck with yours.
(05-09-2019, 10:02 PM)Lusitano Wrote: so modify the ones that exist!! i gave some examples of some that could be easly modified! and even gave one that just some minor aesthetic modifications could be a NEW ship for civilian use, or in other terms, all around sirius! Nepotu said that just need it one for testing, so why not a non luxury democritus? just make a simple modificantion on the rendering of the ship, make it "less luxury", more guns and power core and bang, easy new ship to use. see? easy for a modeler, and i bet it would be easier for the dev and others that make decisions about the game, to accept it.
do you know why i'm so mad with things i see here? and when ii say here, it is not just this post, but more things .... "i want i want i want" then i talk to a dev about few things and ask for a thing or two, and he says that he agree with my request but the team as no time and bla bla, and then when i see the updates ... nothing!! i saw players offering ships and NO! they were not accepted. then i see devs saying that they waste many of their free time, and i really do believe that!
so again about this topic, no longer a frigate, great! one armored transport that can take survive one attack and even fight back. fine for me like i said before. the salavager as example? good because i know how good it is. make new ships? for whom? all sirius? that will be a lot of ships. so why not take some that already exist? not suitable? buff the guns and power core and armor, and reduce the cargo hold! simple done.
not going to waste more time with this. i gave a simple solution, if you guys don't want to accept it so good luck with yours.
take care all and have fun
We've already stated multiple times that certain ships could be turned into frigates, and even provided a few examples. You should know that, since you've been arguing since the beginning of the thread.
You're arguing against something without even understanding what you're arguing against. What you think you're saying in oppose to what I'm saying, is actually the same thing as what I'm saying, without seeming to realize that what you're asking for is the same thing. To the casual eye, you will make it appear as though this idea has very much opposition, even though all of the opposition is coming from one person who actually wants the same thing and just doesn't understand what they're reading and saying. If you want to see this implemented, then stop steering the thread towards an argument. Instead of trying to tear down the building to build your room, just add your bricks to it.
You are wasting pages in this thread, and lessening the chances of developers taking this idea seriously. People have a tendency to lazily disregard both sides of an argument as nonsense, because they don't feel like taking the time to read it, but still want to have an opinion about it.
or for F sake! i'm wasting? you people first want a warship that could transport, then ok no warship but want new ships to be made i the image of one. i gave several examples of ships in game that could make that role, but if you people say that is not enough, so take those ships and buff it, that would take less time and have more chances to be accepet than new one, that would take time to make, to aprove it and balance it and bla bla bla, even more when there are devs saying that are wasting real life time. i gave a simple example of a ship that could be easly turned to a ship that YOU guys want, and it is i that i'm wasting time? wasting time for making things so simple for one idea that few had, and maybe will not be that accept in the entire community, and you want to waste precious time to make it, while dev are overburden with real life work plus the ones here? for the what i can see, i was the ONLY one the gave a reasonable idea for a test ship, and i'm the one that i'm wasting time?! it will be my fault that devs will not take this serious?
(05-10-2019, 12:06 AM)Lusitano Wrote: or for F sake! i'm wasting? you people first want a warship that could transport, then ok no warship but want new ships to be made i the image of one. i gave several examples of ships in game that could make that role, but if you people say that is not enough, so take those ships and buff it, that would take less time and have more chances to be accepet than new one, that would take time to make, to aprove it and balance it and bla bla bla, even more when there are devs saying that are wasting real life time. i gave a simple example of a ship that could be easly turned to a ship that YOU guys want, and it is i that i'm wasting time? wasting time for making things so simple for one idea that few had, and maybe will not be that accept in the entire community, and you want to waste precious time to make it, while dev are overburden with real life work plus the ones here? for the what i can see, i was the ONLY one the gave a reasonable idea for a test ship, and i'm the one that i'm wasting time?! it will be my fault that devs will not take this serious?
f this! goodbye
You're wasting time, because you're arguing against things we haven't said. I never said that I didn't want in-game transports to be turned into frigates. One of my first posts listed a few ships that could be turned into frigates.
I've only suggested TWO ideas for new frigates that could be made. TWO. Not a whole bunch. And I never once stated that such a suggestion was mandatory. It was merely a suggestion.
You've spent two pages arguing nonsense.
These are your main arguments:
"Don't call them frigates, they're not frigates", an argument that you repeated despite my response being that it was not my decision to title the Salvager as a "Frigate", I was merely continuing the developer's tradition, as that ship established what frigates are seen as in the Discovery universe. You've repeated this pointless argument multiple times.
Another of your arguments is, "You should just change ingame ships to frigates", another argument you've wasted multiple posts stating, despite the fact that my first post in the thread, before you began your argument, already suggested turning in-game transports into frigates, and gave specific examples.
Yet another argument you've repeated, is "Devs shouldn't have to waste their time on this", to which I already adequately responded the first time: The developers wouldn't have to make the models. When the community likes an idea, they often make it themselves. All they need is the go-ahead from the developers that said ships could be added if they are of sufficient quality.
You have repeated the same argument, over and over again, even though each argument has already been addressed, and won't be an issue.
Nobody here is trying to make a new ship class. Nobody here is trying to force the devs to spend time making new ship models. Nobody here was responsible for naming the "Salvage Frigate". Nobody here is against your idea of turning previous transports into frigates. You're wasting your time arguing without understanding what you're reading, and I'm done wasting my time trying to explain things to you. You think you're arguing with me, but you're asking for the same thing we're all asking for.
Problem here, that gameplay-wise its nohow not blockade runner. In disco, combat capacities of cruiser-size(or even above) gunboat not much higher than battletransports in convoy. Real blockade runner in disco is whale and liners with CM slot, cos mk3 cloak.
Raba-class ship rather ultimate evolution of pirate transport. There like nothing to add more to not make it absolutelly OP version of it. Disco i guess do needs more ships like it, but another question, is military (not pirates) factions feel need in it?Maybe police ones?I want to say, that sorts of ships needed rather as raid-loot box having combat capacity on level of other raiders, rather than escort ship.
Also seems more main thing here is "Should we limit house military/police factions to 3600?"
Imo topic question setted incorrect and need redefine, to born constructive discussion.
*Note: I went from point that there is no way to make proper escort-trade ship while stay balanced**, otherwise than already existing ones. Because it should fly on same thruster speed as transports or faster to be valuable in convoy, so cruiser-based variants would be useless. All lesser combinations already exist.
Edit: **while staying in current weapons balance
Give frigates a repair tool slot and then it fits an armored support minivan with tons of gb/transport guns.
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