I am a Zoner and try like hell to be neutral to all. If i wasn't i would be considered ooRP.
This said i do not think AW are Zoner's in any way. They push peep's around,and are on outcast side.(not neutral). If any Tag they should be outcast. Also they left,and now have no claim anywhere until they re-purchase a system.(not zoner guard) A system that fit's what ever RP they choose. I think an outcast system, but since they are all Cap whores i am sure they want a nice open system with no rock's.
(sorry but this really made me upset to see a zoner Tagged fleet fighting corsair's along side outcast's)
Pick neutral or not neutral. :angry::angry::angry:
The last thing that we need right now is another ally for the Outcasts. The AW should remain tagged Zoner. This is the same philosophy that I have with the Coaltion(SCRA). We're tagged Xenos, but have our own ID. Frankly, the reason we do this is because Xenos fits us best, but check this out:
We're neutral to the Xeno Player faction.
Why?
We're outsiders, even if we do use their bases, and they don't like it.
The AW can do a similar thing with the Zoner ID, but not the Outcast ID. Unlike the Xenos or Zoners, the Outcasts are extremely specific about what their RP entails. For instance, anyone with the ID should be cardamine dependant, etc...
The AW RP differs too much from this.
Quote:[7:42:05 PM][6:51:36 PM] Igor (Smokey): btw terry
[6:51:48 PM] Terrance Cooper: Ye?
[6:52:00 PM] Igor (Smokey): nothin
[6:52:03 PM] Igor (Smokey): just sayin btw
[6:52:05 PM] Terrance Cooper: <_<
Quote:Johnny_Haas: you shot anti criuse speed rockets!!!
Johnny_Haas: but why????
Johnny_Haas: ??
Johnny_Haas: why you shoot criuse speed rockets?
yea - well, but its only their tag, - they have a custom ID anyway. if it was possible, they should have an asgard warriors tag. - but since the tag should match the ID as closely as possible, and the past has shown that they were somewhat closer to the outcasts than to the zoners - with all the drama about it - outcast or no tag at all or freelander fits fine.
but there are just too many things that do not fit into the zoner affiliation, - and warfaring is only one of them.
' Wrote:elgatodiablo. AW are allies to outcast. so why not make official think from that?
Or Red Hessians? They would be Outcast friendly, enemy with corsairs... they could be hired by... let's say a Rogue faction, so that'll keep their Mercenary RP up... It's all there:)
Hm, I think you are missing one important fact in there, Elgato..
SCRA can be allied to Xenos and do as they like.. Because Xenos are pretty much hostile to everyone.
If you try to do this with Zoner tag, you fail, because Zoners are neutral to pretty much everyone.
AW fought more wars then most other factions, and they are Zoners? How is that?
They even fought against SF (Ex brettonian military).. Zoners would be extinguished by now, if the AW represented their goals.
If they are to stay 'Zoners', they need to change a lot. They need to ditch their 'friendship' with Outcasts, their 'war' with Corsairs, and use only neutral ships.
Also, they should threat both sides the same way.
I remember when TBH signed a seize fire with AW.. I went to Theta with my (ex) Gunboat.. And I was attacked by Valgrind I think.
After he died, I asked him why did he attack me.. He told me that I once invaded Alpha.. How surprising, for a Corsair.
So, I got that feeling that AW are actually defenders of Alpha.. Alpha warriors, that's how I used to call them.
And that's why I said they should be Outcasts.
They can stay 'Zoners', but only with major changes.
Lucendez Wrote:
It is every Corsair's responsibility to die a beautiful death in defense of Crete, regardless of how OORP or how capwhoring the opposition is. Launch your fighter, joust the battlecruisers and die a beautiful death. Then, drink it down in the bar.
The AW are not Outcasts, Just the other day they were flying into alpha in Caedo to re-fit it a little, we were in the middle of a fight with the CR, they didn't help.
We have our role, and my understanding of the AW RP is that its definately not Outcast.
Zoner isn't right for them either, they are a WAY too militant for that.
Perhaps they aught to have no tag at all? That would be a bit wafty in RP terms and would probably cause confusion but it would allow them the freedom to wage their war against the TBH and provided the RP was good enough for this, then I can't see it as a problem. I don't know how they would then get a guard system (what NPC's and bases do you put in???), but thats not too important now, as they're not an official faction.
If however the RP is gunna be re-written, then maybe this discussion could be put on hold until the new look AW comes into existance. If Korrd has plans, then let him formulate and present them.
While I think Joe may have forgotten about the other Outcasts on the server (ahem:P) he is essentially correct. As long as the Corsairs and the AW are at war we are essentially friendly, but in no way are we allied and in no way will the AW ever wear our tag or ID. The AW, as it were, are essentially a freelance military with a long-term contract with the Zoners. For this reason I believe a Freelancer tag might be in order. If we really become desperate, even an AW NPC faction. They've got a Guard system (even though, due to what are political machinations and anybody with half an ear open knows it, they are now unofficial and have lost ownership), so why not? They did it for the Phantoms, if they felt like being politically correct they'd do it for the SCRA, too, so why not the AW?
Quote:Quick comment - we thought that Panzer was the Leader, Swift. -Agmen
' Wrote:While I think Joe may have forgotten about the other Outcasts on the server (ahem:P) he is essentially correct. As long as the Corsairs and the AW are at war we are essentially friendly, but in no way are we allied and in no way will the AW ever wear our tag or ID. The AW, as it were, are essentially a freelance military with a long-term contract with the Zoners. For this reason I believe a Freelancer tag might be in order. If we really become desperate, even an AW NPC faction. They've got a Guard system (even though, due to what are political machinations and anybody with half an ear open knows it, they are now unofficial and have lost ownership), so why not? They did it for the Phantoms, if they felt like being politically correct they'd do it for the SCRA, too, so why not the AW?
I dont think you're right, seeing as Outcasts in general have been on the "friendly" list of the AW for quite some time. Also, the AW tend to put matters involving the Corsairs lower on their list than those involving the Outcasts, before either war in fact.
Why would the Zoners hire a Freelance military to wage war against the SF, the CR/BSG (as it has done in the past), Corsairs or whatnot? Whoever started it, the Zoners don't want to be involved with it, because they know that they will lose a large chunk of business and perhaps some of their bases too.
And here's the reasoning behind making the SCRA have a tag and not AW. The SCRA are part of the history of humankind in that they represent those who fought an endless war with the Alliance in sol. They have deep roots and history backs them up. They are in fact a complete political movement away from the status quo in Sirius.
The same is applicable with the Phantoms. In almost every game to do with space, you find aliens who vastly overpower humankind. Hence, such a possibility is taken as almost guaranteed if humans colonize outer space.
AW on the other hand are just a Freelance military. Of course, the idea is feasible in terms of Sirius but its chances of actually forming are not as high as a remnant of the Coalition forming, or genocidal aliens-type things initiating first contact with us.
And isn't the Caedo an Outcast Dreadnought (which it is, have the screen shot in my files)? Do you think Corsairs are gonna not fire on that?
this reminds me on what Del asked as a spring cleaning. - from what i remember, the AW adopted the zoner tag, cause - at the time they needed a tag - this choice was the best one available, - and their RP was spun around that, too.
now, the time has past since these days - the zoners have changed, the corsairs have changed, the outcasts, too - and all in all, there are four times the people playing if not more. - new factions cannot be created like back in the days anymore - and so, new people do not really understand some of the necessities of some old factions anymore. -
the AW have their own tag, they are their own masters - not derived from anything ( well, but a strange halfgod/alien thingy - which would cause many nasty comments nowadays if presented in a faction creation ) so they have no tag available.
while it is true that the best way to keep the faction is to give them their NPCs, make omicron 84 and theta their ZoI, possibly reassign the freeport to AW ownership ( like IMG owns some ) and do the same with corfu. as a consequence, add the zoner ships to baffin or gran canaria instead, cause it makes little sense to sell them on an AW station. - leave the civi ships at the AW, and give them the civi bombers, too.
now, all that should be done - - - if we want to keep the AW alive as they are now.
another easy way is to ditch the whole faciton, take the ID away - and create a faction that is dedicated to defend theta as a zoner faction .... from the scratch. such a faciton would have to do everything a new faction has to do, - starting with 500.000.000 faction request money, a lot of critizism from the community ( and some gloating, unfortunately, i predict ) - many modified faction creation sheets - and finally become official. - again.
version 1 requires a lot of work from igiss and the admins - and other facitons might wonder, why the AW gets the special treatment, - but it would be for the good of the faction and the server.
version 2 would change the face of the whole sector around theta. - the AW is a power not to be ignored - and if they vanished, ... new and most probably unofficial structures may appear there, starting with zoners policing there to BHGs and mercs.
while that can provide the sector with an increase of brilliant RP, it can aswell cause pointless pvp battles, cause there are some of the most misunderstood factions involved. - zoners, BHG and the archetype pirates.
and - there d be less control over the situation, - at this time, ... we have a contact person for things to steer the political issues into a RP direction. - without the AW, this place could become a free-for-all and a hard to control place.
the question is - what do we want the future of this sector to look like. - do we want the AW to remain the way they are? - then we must work to get them fit into this part of freelancer again. - or do we want to get rid of them? - are we ready to take the consequences for that?