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Moving forward, any canonization that lore wise can considerably affect another faction should a absolutely have that faction's involvement in the process. At a player level, it's far too easy for one party to ignore the other and write whatever they want in non-canon lore. But at an NPC-level, things start to have much more weight.

Until Aux's canonization, Core| ignored the large amounts of power gaming in Auxesia's lore because at the end of the day, even though we had our issues with it, it wasn't canon and when you looked at the bigger picture it didn't really affect us in the long run. Any issues that did crop up were mostly dealt with by the admin team. But when it was made canon, this created all sorts of headaches. And still continues to. And in the aftermath when Core| did try to attain some kind of QA, it felt like whenever Core| raised it's concerns it was given the middle finger in very one-sided discussions. The end result is there are many gaping holes and many contradictory points in lore now since this, because there was no QA (in fact I'd aslo argue Auxesia conflicts with the criteria you've listed based off what I've said).

I also want to raise that I hope Freelancer factions that aim for this sort of thing will also be eyed with a good level of QA. Unlike other NPC factions, Freelancer factions have no limit on how they can measure themselves in the lore. I suppose the entire point of the ID is that you can be anything, but if you want to jump from being an official Freelancer player faction that started off as a loose organeof mercs, to having self-written lore that says you attained 100k people in several months, to a fresh NPC faction that says the same thing, you need QA to keep the lore consistent. And perhaps also fair as well, as new factions using classic IDs will have to abide by quality standards when aiming for officialdom and the right to represent their NPC faction.

It's very easy for people to plug their ears and to brush my post off as faction bashing, but the thing is if you want to respectfully and tastefully integrate player factions as canon NPC factions, my point is something you should keep in mind. Otherwise people won't react well to it. The Dev team could make endless yellow statements about things becoming canon and other factions having to deal with it, but that won't make the community like the end product any more if it's not done tastefully.

I remembered this quote from Snak3:

(05-24-2018, 01:15 PM)SnakThree Wrote: [ -> ]People who steal tech like this lose no sleep in comparison to factions that are victims of it. I know this as Ageira lead seeing a considerable number of crappy lore changes to adapt towards people metagaming/powergaming/devmining stuff into game so they would have something that belongs to others instead of going for a different route that would not alter gameplay whatsoever and would not impact lore for faction whose tech is being stolen.

The devs seem to realise that it's important for new factions not to step on the corpse of vanilla factions. I'm glad this is a thing.

Cool idea. Quite restrictive, but it can be an instrument for some factions.

(12-21-2018, 11:45 AM)Riehl Wrote: [ -> ]The devs seem to realise that it's important for new factions not to step on the corpse of vanilla factions. I'm glad this is a thing.

But for 'Disco' factions? Hohohohoho, let me tell you........

I don't know about how well Harmony has been integrated with/into LN's lore and would be interested to hear about it, and the level of involvement of all the parties involved. I've not heard of much drama about that specific point of their canonization at least (more so just about the general defection RP, but that doesn't necessarily relate to Harmony specifically).

Lyth, as much as i am generally neutral to your posts, i am afraid this post is solely faction bashing. Devs are well aware (or should be) that a canonized faction should not overshadow existing factions. Thus, both factions have a reasonable status quo. In Aux's case, they do not step on Core's toes at all, considering they are not loitering around in 156545677776442 Makos or bullheads and merely stick to smaller crafts, which are far easier to reproduce. And faaaar away from Core's operational zone.

(12-21-2018, 11:49 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-21-2018, 11:45 AM)Riehl Wrote: [ -> ]The devs seem to realise that it's important for new factions not to step on the corpse of vanilla factions. I'm glad this is a thing.

But for 'Disco' factions? Hohohohoho, let me tell you........

I don't know about how well Harmony has been integrated with/into LN's lore and would be interested to hear about it, and the level of involvement of all the parties involved. I've not heard of much drama about that specific point of their canonization at least (more so just about the general defection RP, but that doesn't necessarily relate to Harmony specifically).

Why do you keep calling it defection rp when we were deserting? I don't think Harmony defected either, they didn't join another faction.

I would also appreciate if you keep finger pointing claims out of your posts

Uh... right, moving on from all that.

Natio Octavarium appreciates this.

I came away from your post feeling like you didn't even really read the FCR criteria, Lyth. Simple mercenary factions are not up for canonization. Factions forced to use the Freelancer ID due to lack of an ID which actually fits their agenda, are. We take our jobs very seriously here, and people will not be able to have their factions canonized into the lore of the mod on a whim. Unless they add something of value and make sense, they aren't getting anywhere near the official storyline.

I hate the fact that I have to type this next part out, but alarmist rhetoric using the very small number of currently canon non-vanilla factions which existed before any standardization of procedure is neither useful nor desired in moving forward. Legitimate concerns are welcome, grudges are not.

(12-21-2018, 11:52 AM)Auzari Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-21-2018, 11:49 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: [ -> ]

(12-21-2018, 11:45 AM)Riehl Wrote: [ -> ]The devs seem to realise that it's important for new factions not to step on the corpse of vanilla factions. I'm glad this is a thing.

But for 'Disco' factions? Hohohohoho, let me tell you........

I don't know about how well Harmony has been integrated with/into LN's lore and would be interested to hear about it, and the level of involvement of all the parties involved. I've not heard of much drama about that specific point of their canonization at least (more so just about the general defection RP, but that doesn't necessarily relate to Harmony specifically).

Why do you keep calling it defection rp when we were deserting? I don't think Harmony defected either, they didn't join another faction.

I would also appreciate if you keep finger pointing claims out of your posts

You left one cause and joined/started another one. That's defection. Also when I said defection doesn't relate to Harmony specifically, I meant as in they're not the only ones who are critisied for such RP. It's not only a single group or individuals who catch that flak.

(12-21-2018, 11:52 AM)Durandal Wrote: [ -> ]I came away from your post feeling like you didn't even really read the FCR criteria, Lyth. Simple mercenary factions are not up for canonization. Factions forced to use the Freelancer ID due to lack of an ID which actually fits their agenda, are. We take our jobs very seriously here, and people will not be able to have their factions canonized into the lore of the mod on a whim. Unless they add something of value and make sense, they aren't getting anywhere near the official storyline.

I hate the fact that I have to type this next part out, but alarmist rhetoric using the very small number of currently canon non-vanilla factions which existed before any standardization of procedure is neither useful nor desired in moving forward. Legitimate concerns are welcome, grudges are not.

Maybe I wasn't clear. I got that merc factions wouldn't get it, I was trying to explain that Freelancer factions are much more free form and can change their lore and purpose at the push of a button. And whilst that purpose could meet a criteria on the FCR, it's very important that the Staff pay attention to their changes in lore leading up to that. All I'm saying. But after what you've just said I trust that will be the case.

I'm using those cases because they're the only cases we have for this sort of thing. And whilst I don't know about Harmony, Auxesia's implementation was not done well. And lol, throwing away myself and others concerns as grudges is exactly what lead to the impasse and the feeling of having concerns being ignored that I touched upon previously. I don't really care about Auxesia as a faction overall and have no ill will towards the people in it, so we can drop the accusation of grudges and stop trying to dissolve my point with such emotional rhetoric. Lore was canonized that conflicts with other previously written lore and it was the job of the story team to ensure this doesn't happen. It's obvious that unfortunately that's not going to be rectified. So hopefully in future cases it will. This is just a cautionary tale of how not to do an FCR.

(12-21-2018, 11:51 AM)TheShooter36 Wrote: [ -> ]Lyth, as much as i am generally neutral to your posts, i am afraid this post is solely faction bashing. Devs are well aware (or should be) that a canonized faction should not overshadow existing factions. Thus, both factions have a reasonable status quo. In Aux's case, they do not step on Core's toes at all, considering they are not loitering around in 156545677776442 Makos or bullheads and merely stick to smaller crafts, which are far easier to reproduce. And faaaar away from Core's operational zone.

You've missed my point. Auxesia doesn't overshadow or overlap with Core. My point is that in the past canonization was done with no QA or input from other factions involved, and doing it in that way creates problems and leaves a bad taste. I don't want to go into lengthy discussion as my point isn't about Auxesia specifically but this overall process moving forward. If you want to know my gripes on that Shooter we can discuss it on Discord.