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+--- Thread: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 (/showthread.php?tid=98543)
RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - Sad - 05-14-2013
(05-14-2013, 05:35 PM)Catbert Wrote:Sorry, but we can't hunt them, because they are not theOrder ID Wrote:- Can hunt Wild, Nomad, Outcasts, BHG, Core, LSF, MND, Kempeitai and BIS.It would make sense if the intelligence factions could retaliate and hunt the Order everywhere, I guess.
Code:
house at war with Kusari, Liberty, etc.RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - Lonely Werewolf - 05-14-2013
I like the idea overall but a question has arisen, maybe this has been discussed in devs logs and I didn't see it. Several or the corporations now have
Quote: Can hunt pirates and terrorists within their Zone of Influence.
So what this is saying is that the corporation fighters can hunt any pirates in their zoi, rather like the navy and police can? This sure does make defending our convoys, mining groups and space easier. But was this definately intentional? Also I see prexisting lines for killing fighters is now slightly changed. For example the DSE ID has the above line, which it didn't before and still has the
Quote:Can hunt Lane Hackers outside their Zone of Influence.
I suppose this is too clarify that we can hunt these enemies anywhere as before?
Also the Rogue ID
Quote:Zone of Influence: Liberty and independent systems directly bordering Liberty, Shikoku
Shouldn't New Tokyo be in the zoi (without cruisers) and for Brigands
Quote:Zone of Influence: Gallia, Gallic Borderworlds, Taus
shouldn't they have Kyushu and New Tokyo? Due to this.
EDIT: Also the Rogue ID misses out Humbolt (and Kansas?) which it currently does anyways.
RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - LunaticOnTheGrass - 05-14-2013
On behalf of the VWA, which presently represents (to my knowledge) the largest unofficial contingent of Bundschuh players, I would like to bring up the portion of the Bundschuh ID that states:
Quote:- Cannot ally with any lawfuls except with Rheinland lawfuls against Liberty lawfuls.
And ask it to be changed, to:
Quote:- Cannot ally with any lawfuls except with Liberty lawfuls against Rheinland lawfuls.
My reasons for that request involve the pre-4.86 backstory written by Igiss; for the Bundschuh, it states:
Quote:The Bundschuh of Cloppenburg were aware of the research that took place in Munster Research Facility, and when Liberty ships advanced as far as New Hampshire, they contacted them in order to help the Liberty Navy with recon information in exchange for money, which would go to Bundschuh, and political asylum, which was intended for Rheinland scientist Wilhelm Schenker who escaped from Munster in 815 A.S., settled in Cloppenburg, and became a kind of spiritual leader for the small Bundschuh community.
As the other Bundschuh became aware of Schenker’s plans, many were against betraying Rheinland Military for the sake of getting material benefits from a hostile nation. Yet, many considered it a way to prevent the Munster operations from reaching completion, which (as Schenker believed, or convinced others he believed) could cause another wave of Nomad infestation within Rheinland.
Schenker himself explained his willingness to go to another House by Liberty government’s “healthy” attitude to Nomad research that did not involve dangerous experiments. As the war came to be much longer than he expected, the scientist grew restless and would probably run away from Cloppenburg himself and try to reach some local Liberty patrol, but his followers not only admired him, but also guarded him well from outside dangers. Leaving the station unnoticed is hard to achieve in those circumstances.
Role of Bundschuh in the Battle for Munster is not exactly known. However, once the Liberty Navy disabled Westphalia and entered Bremen with a massive capital ship fleet, they did pay the Bundschuh for their services, captured Schenker from Cloppenburg (allegedly by using military force), and cancelled all further relations with the faction.
In the meantime, the VWA has been rekindling diplomatic relations with Liberty (essentially only the Liberty Navy), in threads such as these:
http://discoverygc.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=96753
This obviously doesn't mean allying with the Liberty Navy, but as the Bundschuh's ID write-up explicitly states that they are seeking to overthrow the corrupt government, it does not make sense to some of our members that the Bundschuh would suddenly help those same forces propping up that corrupt government by fighting a group (the Navy, in this case) that could be their ticket to being better able to fight the government.
I realize that there is no Official Bundschuh faction, and it may be a little "out-of-line" for me to request a change like that, but it is my hope that making the Bundschuh more distinguished in that fashion could help the faction see some further presence.
After all, the average player who might glance at the IDs to determine which Rheinlandic unlawful faction to join would see that the Bundschuh's ID is practically a copy/paste of the Red Hessian's, except they are unable to fly anything larger than a Gunboat (and at 90% Powercore, to boot). Even the LWB and Unioners are distinguishable by their use of the RPC; the Unioner's alliance with the Corsairs is also noteworthy.
It's obviously just a request, but one that I hope will be at least considered.
RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - kikatsu - 05-14-2013
"Can hunt pirates and terrorists within their Zone of Influence."
That allows the corporate escorts to actively defend their convoys, making it so that the escorts do not have to be reactionary anymore, and can actively defend corporate assets rather than waiting for a pirate to make the first move. So I like that.
I am curious about the BHG going after lawful and unlawful targets now, but I am guessing that is just them being able to go after Gallia or something.
RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - AshHill07 - 05-14-2013
Couldn't help but notice the cargo limitations on Naval ID's are back, is this a hint of things to come or just an oversight?
RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - Trail - 05-14-2013
how about a list of allies under ZOI or allowed ships. I realize that the allies section might change over time but for some factions (corsairs for example) it is kind of a big deal, as there are certain factions they should not pirate. obviously official factions dont really need it but the indies do and im sure it will stop a lot of headaches
edit: besides any allies list changes can always be modified through server commands right? Or is that only for minor changes?
RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - Occam Razor - 05-14-2013
(05-14-2013, 05:00 PM)AeternusDoleo Wrote: ; dsy_license_helghast
501405
NAME
Artificial Intelligence ID
501406
INFOCARD
Artifical Intelligence ID
The AI ID signifies the character an Artificial Intelligence. Most AI's descend from Planet Gammu, where environmental conditions caused human settlement to fail, leaving only sentient machines behind, who then continued to evolve. AI's are fully selfaware and autonomous, and not under the control of any other faction.
Vessels carrying this ID are controlled by an Artificial Intelligence, who :
- Can attack pirates, terrorists and lawfuls in self-defense or in defense of another AI ship.
- Can actively hunt pirates, terrorists and lawfuls in systems that do not contain a jumpgate.
- Cannot not attack transports and freighters, except in selfdefense.
- Cannot use any transports with more than 3,600 cargo.
- Cannot participate in unlawful actions except as described above.
Allowed ships: Fighters, Freighters, Transports, Gunboats, AI Cruiser
Why was the cargo limit put down? That won't make it easier for us, but also "AI's are fully selfaware and autonomous, and not under the control of any other faction.", that is not right. There are many factionless AIs, but also factions. Like the Consensus.
RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - Trail - 05-14-2013
(05-14-2013, 06:03 PM)Occam Razor Wrote:(05-14-2013, 05:00 PM)AeternusDoleo Wrote: ; dsy_license_helghast
501405
NAME
Artificial Intelligence ID
501406
INFOCARD
Artifical Intelligence ID
The AI ID signifies the character an Artificial Intelligence. Most AI's descend from Planet Gammu, where environmental conditions caused human settlement to fail, leaving only sentient machines behind, who then continued to evolve. AI's are fully selfaware and autonomous, and not under the control of any other faction.
Vessels carrying this ID are controlled by an Artificial Intelligence, who :
- Can attack pirates, terrorists and lawfuls in self-defense or in defense of another AI ship.
- Can actively hunt pirates, terrorists and lawfuls in systems that do not contain a jumpgate.
- Cannot not attack transports and freighters, except in selfdefense.
- Cannot use any transports with more than 3,600 cargo.
- Cannot participate in unlawful actions except as described above.
Allowed ships: Fighters, Freighters, Transports, Gunboats, AI Cruiser
Why was the cargo limit put down? That won't make it easier for us, but also "AI's are fully selfaware and autonomous, and not under the control of any other faction.", that is not right. There are many factionless AIs, but also factions. Like the Consensus.
Quote: "AI's are fully selfaware and autonomous, and not under the control of any other faction."
im pretty sure that is just wording but even then. You have AIs working together as autonomous ais (such as the consensus) and then you have AI's working for Any other faction you can think of. But the word Artificial Intelligence means or what I think the admins tried to mean is: Aware and autonomous AI that regardless of that autonomy is working for whichever faction that might be out of self choice or! that it could always leave by its own choice otherwise you are dealing with a limited AI / a VI virtual intelligence or to put it simpler we can coin it LI a limited intelligence meaning that it could be smart and all that still but restrained from what it can do, ie not autonomous and self aware.
RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - Duvelske - 05-14-2013
Quote:; dsy_license_gd_z_grpIn my view nothing did change with this. Only a better way to put it. I only have 1 problem with the first line.
500642
NAME
Zoner ID
500643
INFOCARD
Zoner
Zoners are civilians who have rejected house rule. They are generally isolationists, and prefer to live outside of house borders, unburdened by house laws. They generally welcome both lawful and unlawful factions. Zoners avoid conflict when possible, however this does not exempt Zoners from piracy by many unlawful factions.
Pilot carrying this ID is a Zoner who:
- Can attack pirates, terrorists and lawfuls in self-defense, to protect an allied or neutral ship, or in defense of Zoner bases.
- Cannot dock Cruisers and Battleships on any base within House Space.
- Cannot dock transports with more than 3,600 cargo within House Space, except on GMG, IMG or Zoner bases.
- Cannot ally with any lawfuls or unlawfuls except GMG and The Order.
- Cannot participate in unlawful actions except as described above.
Allowed ships: Fighters, Freighters, Transports, Gunboats, Cruisers, Battleships
Quote:- Can attack pirates, terrorists and lawfuls in self-defense, to protect an allied or neutral ship, or in defense of Zoner bases.
I wonder myself what allies? (only Order and GMG if i am not mistaken.) also the neutral ships. Like? all other non rephacked? I would change it back that like you could do in the past only defend your own. As i see how it goes already in the omicrons this only provokes 1 order and a huge zoner cap fleet. the order attacks BHG or nomad and a whole group shoots. If thats the case then well. Zoners are indeed a militairy force from the next version.
RE: Proposal: ID changes for 4.87 - Eduard - 05-14-2013
Quote:Bounty Hunters Guild Core
The BHG Core is a paramilitary faction which developed from and is funded by the Bounty Hunters Guild. The Core focuses around acquiring and developing new (Nomad) technologies to strengthen the Bounty Hunters Guild. Their enemies are the Nomads, Wild and The Order. Core members are not mercenaries and may not hunt bounties.
Pilot carrying this ID is a member of the BHG Core who:
- Can attack lawfuls, pirates and terrorists in self-defense, to protect an allied or neutral lawful ship, or in defense of bases of the same affiliation within and outside their Zone of Influence.
- Can hunt pirates and terrorists within their Zone of Influence.
- Can hunt ships belonging to houses or organisations at war with the BHG Core within their Zone of Influence.
- Can demand contraband and nomad remains, levy fines, and destroy ships if they refuse to comply with contraband demands, refuse to cooperate or are affiliated with a house at war with the BHG Core in the Omicrons.
- Cannot enter any system containing a jumpgate with Cruisers or Battleships.
- Cannot use any transports with more than 4,300 cargo.
- Cannot participate in unlawful actions except as described above.
Zone of Influence: Omegas, Omicrons
Allowed ships: Fighters, Freighters, Transports, Gunboats, Cruisers, Battleships
Sorry to bother, but may I ask why the Core cannot hunt Nomads, Wilde and Order everywhere in Sirius like Order does? Core also fight the Nomad threat, even if their goals are not so noble.
Order is understandable, but Wilde and Nomads? Though, now that I think, Order is free to hunt Core, why are we not allowed to do the same?
Edit:
Quote:Zoner
Zoners are civilians who have rejected house rule. They are generally isolationists, and prefer to live outside of house borders, unburdened by house laws. They generally welcome both lawful and unlawful factions. Zoners avoid conflict when possible, however this does not exempt Zoners from piracy by many unlawful factions.
Pilot carrying this ID is a Zoner who:
- Can attack pirates, terrorists and lawfuls in self-defense, to protect an allied or neutral ship, or in defense of Zoner bases.
- Cannot dock Cruisers and Battleships on any base within House Space.
- Cannot dock transports with more than 3,600 cargo within House Space, except on GMG, IMG or Zoner bases.
- Cannot ally with any lawfuls or unlawfuls except GMG and The Order.
- Cannot participate in unlawful actions except as described above.
Allowed ships: Fighters, Freighters, Transports, Gunboats, Cruisers, Battleships
I do hope no one would mind if I would ask clarifications regarding the underlined part. That part involves only military alliance, I mean, siding with a third party in other to help it in combat, no? We are still free to do whatever diplomatical ties, negotiations, business, deals, commerce and stuff we want, no?
also...
(05-14-2013, 06:18 PM)Duvelske Wrote: I wonder myself what allies? (only Order and GMG if i am not mistaken.) also the neutral ships. Like? all other non rephacked? I would change it back that like you could do in the past only defend your own. As i see how it goes already in the omicrons this only provokes 1 order and a huge zoner cap fleet. the order attacks BHG or nomad and a whole group shoots. If thats the case then well. Zoners are indeed a militairy force from the next version.
I dare second this