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+--- Thread: Corsair Fighters Idea (/showthread.php?tid=11280)
Corsair Fighters Idea - Lucend - 08-20-2008
I agree with Carlos in that the Corsair's line (and the Outcast line) were some of the best ships in SP. However, I do not believe the developers balanced everything according to online play. (Obviously)
The Titan and the Sabre are secrets that can only be bought if you explored the dangerous "edge worlds."
In order to keep the diversity, I believe all the titan needs is an armor increase. Yes, I'm a "tank guy," but I also think that to two major Sirius pirate factions should have better fighters/bombers overall than the law, with the exception that the law can (read: should) field more resources and better caps, with the rational being that pirates tend to fixate more on the smaller, economically sound fighters and bombers. The Houses focus more on grand military hardware such as Dreadnaughts and the like.
These are just my opinions. If I were making this mod, that's what I'd try to emphasize. So, to answer Carlos' post, cool idea, though I'm not sure most of the community would take to it. I always welcome more choices over fewer.
Corsair Fighters Idea - chopper - 08-20-2008
Quote:Never said the Eagle couldn't EVER beat a Chimaera, but they are in completely different classes with the current balance system.
So, you seriously think that Chimaera vs Eagle is a bigger difference then Sabre vs Titan?
Quote:I compared it turning and overall usability. In terms of turning, the Sabre isn't that much better.
Really? This is news to me, because..
Titan - 1.122
Sabre - 1.225
And just for comparison :
Red Catamaran - 1.0875
Falcata 1.0250
Note that Falcata is closer to Titan then Titan is to Sabre.
Quote:And if you really think that its impossible to dodge 5+ people in anything bu BD HF and Sabre, take a look at the Talon, Stinger, Ravens Talon (This version even, not 4.83), Ravensclaw, Eagle, and Chimaera.
I find this pretty funny for many reasons.
Talon - can't even dodge one single person, do you know how huge that thing is?
Stinger - can dodge nicely, but mostly thanks to it's bugged hitbox. However, it can't dodge 5 good aimers.
RC - can't dodge 5 good aimers
Eagle - no way it can dodge 5 good aimers, unless they are in bricks and you can greatly outturn them and fly around them
Chimaera - can dodge, though much harder then BD, since it's less agile.
It's not about if you done it or not. I can dodge people in NY in a bloody barghest, that's not the question.
All in all, point is that Sabre can dodge much easier. Sure, if you try hard you can dodge in other ships as well.
In Sabre you don't even have to try. I'll tell you a secret why.
It's mass is 75 right? Well, do you know what that means?
Yeah, it means it accelerates faster, it's speed is changing rapidly.
Yeah, that means that if you tap your thruster (tap, tap, tap) while you'r dodging, you will change speed rapidly just in those short periods of time.
For example, you'r going 200 with thruster, you let it go just for a moment and then press again. You'r speed will drop to some 150 instantly and go back to 200 also instantly.
This produces a 'lag effect', and it looks like you are lagging, since server simply can't project those rapid changes.
With this method, you can dodge whole day long, no problems.
And it's heavily abused.
Even without that you can dodge better then in any other ship, only with help of strafe (yeah, also connected to mass, faster strafe acceleration).
Quote:Put a Titan pilot in a Sabre and see how he does. I can guarantee if its his first time using it, the Oucast will beat him.
When I made my Outcast char, I fought some 101st guys in front of Malta.
And yes, I won without loosing shield, because i'm used to strafe like mad in a titan, and in a sabre strafe is just uber.
Quote:Using slightly inferior ships
Why are you repeating this? So you can still feel good when you beat a Titan in a Sabre?
The fact is, it's not slightly inferior ship. It's 3 classes bellow.
Quote:And of course your told you're spamming Praetorians. when you take 90% Praets to every fight, you ARE spamming Praes. I've seen less cap-spamming by Liberty than I have seen Prae spamming. I disagree with it, but I don't do it to your face to piss you off, nor do I tell you that you shouldn't.
So what? Are you telling me that Sabres can't counter Praets?
Do you know what we, Corsairs, do when Outcasts are to attack?
We bring out capital ships in front of Crete, so the Outcast bring some bombers.
We actually want you to bring bombers.
Then we decide shall we switch back or not, depending on their numbers.
Why is that so? Because we can actually hit Falcata's, and we are not afraid of ending up SN-ed.
Why do you hate Praetorians? I'll tell you why.
Because it's actually easier to hit a Titan then it is to hit a Praetorian, while you don't have to be afraid from getting SN-ed from a Titan.
Falcata isn't any worse then Praetorian, in my eyes at least.
I even prefer mid torp slots Falcata has, more then wing slots Praet has.
Corsair Fighters Idea - skoko - 08-20-2008
I think birds on trees already know that Titan is seriously lacking manuverability... i cannot see how can Titan parry to 4,84 Sabre when 2 equally good pilots are fighting... Corsair ships in general needs a boost in agility... but smaller one because of big power plants they use...
Also agreed with people who say that usually piloting skills depend from fighter to fighter... But is some casses, true, managing to pilot ships who are harder to fly helps you a lot with "uberish" ones
Also i saw in rare casses that one person can fly Eagle better than Sabre and vice versa
Further more i would like all ships can be equally balanced so true skill prevails in fight... but we would loose on diversity in that way.. and i won't happen... but in any way, corsairs ships need a boost.. and piloting skills... well it will be always debatable which pilot has better skills...
Skoko
Corsair Fighters Idea - chopper - 08-20-2008
Quote:well it will be always debatable which pilot has better skills...
Which isn't the point really.
Outcasts boosted their skill rapidly in the last time (RoS especially) so it did become a problem for Corsairs.
But the fact is, before Corsairs did have much more aces then the Outcasts.
Now Outcast pilots are much better then before (new joined, old ones practiced a lot) and Corsairs are still stuck with their ships, so it kinda is unfair.
In 1vs1 Titan can actually parry Sabre pretty good, though Sabre still wins if pilots are equal.
In mass fights, Titan is simply doomed to die, while Sabres can survive for a very long time.
Corsair Fighters Idea - mjolnir - 08-20-2008
Well the fights I have been in the Fighter/Praetorian ratio on Corsair side was mostly around 50/50. In that attack on Alpha that eppy screams so about we had
1LF, 3-4? VHFs, 4 Bombers, 2 GBs.
' Wrote:So what? Are you telling me that Sabres can't counter Praets?
Do you know what we, Corsairs, do when Outcasts are to attack?
We bring out capital ships in front of Crete, so the Outcast bring some bombers.
We actually want you to bring bombers.
Then we decide shall we switch back or not, depending on their numbers.
Why is that so? Because we can actually hit Falcata's, and we are not afraid of ending up SN-ed.
Why do you hate Praetorians? I'll tell you why.
Because it's actually easier to hit a Titan then it is to hit a Praetorian, while you don't have to be afraid from getting SN-ed from a Titan.
Falcata isn't any worse then Praetorian, in my eyes at least.
I even prefer mid torp slots Falcata has, more then wing slots Praet has.
*psst* You weren't supposed to tell them that...
anyway if they come with only Sabres Corsairs stay in Caps.....and the other way around... that's the advantage of the defender. Attacker has the advantage of massing a lot of pilot who knew when the attack will be, so most of the time attackers have numbers.
And yes call "capwhoring" if you want... and we might call you "Sabre-whoring".
Coming with 14 Sabres and asking Corsairs to fly only fighters is about the same as if Lane Hackers attacked liberty with 12 Slipstreams and asked them to only fly fighters.
Though there IS a big difference there... Liberty can take out LFs only as well... Corsairs can't now.
Another example would be taking 10 Bombers against an enemy in caps only and flaming them if they switch to LFs.
Anyway point is that one of the ship is extremely good at one task - Sabre at fighting other fighters in mass fights. So if the attacking force is "specialized" for this only one role.. it's actually bad RP from their side.. and they deserve to get some caps against them. That's why I hate if Lane Hackers attack liberty in only fighters.. and start screaming when caps arrive... it's their fault that they didn't take bombers support.
So fights with different ship types (at least VHFs + bombers) included = good
1 ship swarms = bad
Corsair Fighters Idea - skoko - 08-20-2008
Quote:But the fact is, before Corsairs did have much more aces then the Outcasts.
Now Outcast pilots are much better then before (new joined, old ones practiced a lot) and Corsairs are still stuck with their ships, so it kinda is unfair.
In 1vs1 Titan can actually parry Sabre pretty good, though Sabre still wins if pilots are equal.
In mass fights, Titan is simply doomed to die, while Sabres can survive for a very long time.
I couldn't agree more!!!
... and thats for my wish is that Corsairs ships receive boost within ballance, so interesting VHF fights can occur and be fair.... although i don't have anything against Praetorians.. I like design and I like to fight against them... really...
Also... totally out of context... I can understand Corsair vs Outcast fights in game and RPing.... but i can't understand animosity between 2 groups on forums... I think all OCs should be aware ttat Corsairs need better ships and that Sabre needs nerfing... and vice versa .. Corsairs should be aware about some things connected to OCS ... BUT MY point is that we should talk without sarcasm and irony... and try to solve problems together and in that way help each other to enjoy the game....
Skoko
Corsair Fighters Idea - chopper - 08-20-2008
Words of wisdom! For those words you won't get eaten if we ever capture you alive!
Corsair Fighters Idea - mjolnir - 08-20-2008
Sure we can take a few limbs... he won't need those.
Corsair Fighters Idea - Jihadjoe - 08-22-2008
Thats fine, outcasts pilot their ships through telepathy anyway.
tee heee
Corsair Fighters Idea - El Nino - 08-22-2008
here's an Idea for a corsair HF... try the Murader in Theta, civilian that feel in to pirate hands...;)
Well i have flown the eagle a bit, I think it is to agile, hell i'd nerf the agility of fighters, across the board, all vanila that will now become vanila should fall in line with non vanila ships agility, That would work very well in my oppinion.
Titan is the envy of the universe, much like NY, if you can make it there you can make it anywhere and when then Corsairs take their refuge in a Pretorian they kill untill their heart's content...