SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request

SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - Printable Version

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+------ Thread: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request (/showthread.php?tid=199499)

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SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - SEO - 10-21-2023

Information - Recruitment - Feedback - Report Center - Discord

Official Faction Creation Request

ID details
ID: Sirius Entsorgung
IFF: Sirius Entsorgung
TAG: SEO|

Code:
Sirius Entsorgung ID:

Sirius Entsorgung (SEO) is a de-merger from the industrial giant ALG Waste Disposal, specializing in the clean-up of industrial contamination and the processing of industrial waste. Unlike its parent company, it operates fully within the confines of House Law, and cooperates with Sirius industrial experts such as DHC, Samura, and BMF.

This Rheinland corporate id is used by the members of SEO who:

- Can attack any ship to protect allies.

- Cannot use Cruisers or Battleships.

RP Links

Members
1ic: @Barrier (in-game point of contact and finances: SEO|B-Brassburg)
2ics: @Wolverine518

Current active members at the time of this application:

@[MHS] - Mahdi Chamran: operation resupply, general transportation
@BobMacaroni - Lukas Hartmann: general transportation, mining and salvaging
@Earl Campbell - James W Foxe: general transportation
@Rickard Steiner - Vanessa Kauffmann: R&D; Kurt Weiss: operation resupply, general transportation
@SirJohnKnight - TBD: security ops
@Valhir66 - TBD: mining and salvaging
@Wolverine518 - Lukas Beket: transportation operations, miscellaneous ops

Please respond with your feedback about this OF request or any links from the above. If you meet us in-game, feel free to leave a comment about your experience in the Feedback thread.

RE: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - ViciousJeff - 10-21-2023

Good luck! Great faction that's a lot of fun to RP and convoy with!

RE: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - Kherty - 10-21-2023

I haven't interacted with you yet, but I look forward to; good luck with the request!

RE: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - Groshyr - 10-21-2023

Happy to see the new ALG faction that is aiming toward officialdom. Hope reaching it won't kill you as that happened with previous incarnation, and hope that you won't end having an IMG battlecruiser for trash cleaning purposes. Big Grin

RE: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - Earl Campbell - 10-21-2023

I know everyone loves diversity.

In one loading session, we had a single Toxic Waste drum trade hands between a Gallian, a Libertonian, a Molly, a Nomad Human*, and a Toxic Waste mutant held over from Wuppertal.

*The Nomad flew out of that dude's body and we haven't seen it since, guess he couldn't stand the blistering heat of progress!

RE: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - Antonio - 10-22-2023

It's always lovely to see an active corporate faction heading for officialdom, and I wish you the best of luck in the endeavor. Having read the thread, my main question is: why ALG ID/IFF instead of Daumann or Kruger?

The entire premise of the faction's diplomacy goes directly against ALG's established lore. Not just Discovery lore, but also the vanilla lore. Strengthening relations with Daumann, your greatest rival through the corporation's entire history, including vanilla? Listing Kruger as friendly? Trying to become friends with Rheinland lawfuls after the civil war, where ALG actively fought against the current regime? What about IMG and Gateway, ALG's two greatest historical allies? I've seen no mention of either IMG or Gateway, neither in the diplomacy sheet nor the roleplay comms you linked, and ignoring them is lackluster at best.

So many eyebrow-rising questions and sadly I'm not seeing sensible answers. Sure, you can say "the previous leaders were wrong, we want to be the good guys again", but it sounds like a cheap excuse rather than a realistic scenario of roleplaying the faction you're planning to represent. ALG already had not-so-friendly relations with Rheinland in vanilla, which got further emphasized in Discovery and brought to an extreme in the Rheinland civil war. Even disregarding or ignoring the shady RP aspect of the faction (like with the Bundschuh) the Daumann part, and doing the 180 on the Rheinland civil war aftermath diplomacy, are the main criticism points here.

To give a Daumann analogy, imagine Samura suddenly starting to work with GMG out of the blue. Or IMG with BMM, despite the two being fierce rivals since IMG's foundation. Giving out ALG Golems to Daumann doesn't help the case either.

An analogy for befriending the current monarchist Rheinland regime: ideologically and politically, it would be be like the GMS, a staunchly Council-supporting faction (even in times of the Royalists being in charge, and even more so now when Council is the main lawful representative) suddenly having a change of heart and wanting to befriend and support the Royalists.

It just doesn't fit, no matter how hard you try to justify it, which is why I am wondering why ALG is the ID choice if that's the direction you want to roleplay your faction.

As for other minor things, I like the general style of the posts, I like the activity. The officialdom write-up is a bit short, though hardly an offense. Take the feedback from someone who hasn't been directly involved with ALG or Rheinland for many years, though I caught up on the story events of recent times. I don't know the members on a personal basis and I only interacted once with SEO so far.

RE: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - SEO - 10-22-2023

These are all good points, so I'll try to respond as best as I can.

Think of SEO as a new corporation which got formed as a knee-jerk reaction to the outcome of the civil war. Dortmund station was scuttled, and its ruins are still a sad reminder of past glory. Wuppertal had to be abandoned, and was only recently reinstated as a working refinery, and it's not in the best of shape (consider the price of waste there vs wichter). Wichter itself was supposed to be an edge world outpost with some shipbuilding capability, but instead got turned into a headquarters at the ass end of nowhere.
Because of how much damage the Corp took after losing, anyone who argued against associating with criminals says "I told you so", and get told to f-off by the leadership. Because there are enough people with influence who believe this, instead of toeing the line quietly, they instead form their own ALG, without blackjack or hookers. Honestly, I am still waiting for someone from the vanilla ALG to comm us and say "wtf". I know you're active @ALG
Now you might be asking, why ALG then? Well, they are still waste disposal experts. Wichter is the place to sell your toxic waste, and they're the ones doing R&D on it. SEO is basically a counter-culture to ALG, which wants to do the same thing, but differently. What's curious is that since our formation, I've never seen vanilla ALG actually doing clean-up. Now that might have oorp reasons, but if we consider it irp, this is another insult to up-and-comers who went to SEO: their mother faction isn't even doing the thing they say they're good at! The civil war is over, but these experts are just sitting on their laurels instead of cleaning up Rheinland.
Regarding IMG and Gateway - since SEO operates in House space at the moment, it probably won't have many dealings with them for now. If we ever reach the state of SIrius-wide clean-up as our name implies, I'm definitely going to reach out to IMG at the very least. I did use them in some RP about scouting out contracts before, but there are other corps with more knowledge about in-House dealings.
So with this all in mind, I hope it makes more sense why say we're ok with DHC/Kruger again. We're a new corp that need allies, so we're willing to make concessions like selling them ships at a markup, or buying refined goods from their bases. Again, I'm still looking forward to people irp telling us to go F-off because we're ALG, or go F-off because we're not ALG trying to muscle in on their turf. But thus far it seems like everyone is fine with this, so I just have to take it as the de-merger working as intended.

RE: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - Antonio - 10-23-2023

(10-22-2023, 11:42 AM)SEO Wrote: These are all good points, so I'll try to respond as best as I can.

Think of SEO as a new corporation which got formed as a knee-jerk reaction to the outcome of the civil war. Dortmund station was scuttled, and its ruins are still a sad reminder of past glory. Wuppertal had to be abandoned, and was only recently reinstated as a working refinery, and it's not in the best of shape (consider the price of waste there vs wichter). Wichter itself was supposed to be an edge world outpost with some shipbuilding capability, but instead got turned into a headquarters at the ass end of nowhere.

Because of how much damage the Corp took after losing, anyone who argued against associating with criminals says "I told you so", and get told to f-off by the leadership. Because there are enough people with influence who believe this, instead of toeing the line quietly, they instead form their own ALG, without blackjack or hookers. Honestly, I am still waiting for someone from the vanilla ALG to comm us and say "wtf". I know you're active @ALG

Now you might be asking, why ALG then? Well, they are still waste disposal experts. Wichter is the place to sell your toxic waste, and they're the ones doing R&D on it. SEO is basically a counter-culture to ALG, which wants to do the same thing, but differently. What's curious is that since our formation, I've never seen vanilla ALG actually doing clean-up. Now that might have oorp reasons, but if we consider it irp, this is another insult to up-and-comers who went to SEO: their mother faction isn't even doing the thing they say they're good at! The civil war is over, but these experts are just sitting on their laurels instead of cleaning up Rheinland.

Regarding IMG and Gateway - since SEO operates in House space at the moment, it probably won't have many dealings with them for now. If we ever reach the state of SIrius-wide clean-up as our name implies, I'm definitely going to reach out to IMG at the very least. I did use them in some RP about scouting out contracts before, but there are other corps with more knowledge about in-House dealings.

So with this all in mind, I hope it makes more sense why say we're ok with DHC/Kruger again. We're a new corp that need allies, so we're willing to make concessions like selling them ships at a markup, or buying refined goods from their bases. Again, I'm still looking forward to people irp telling us to go F-off because we're ALG, or go F-off because we're not ALG trying to muscle in on their turf. But thus far it seems like everyone is fine with this, so I just have to take it as the de-merger working as intended.

Thanks for the swift response.

I understand your reasoning regarding the diplomacy change, my main concern is that taking a faction and essentially doing a 180 with it usually tends to run into issues with the story team, as well as generally being frowned upon by the community. It's a shame because whenever someone does a 180, there tends to be an alternative ID/IFF that would suit the faction better. It's not a 100% translation because neither Daumann nor Kruger are waste disposal companies, though the diplomacy, ideology and long term goals regarding both are pretty much there.

Another thing to note, is a distinction between player RP and canon RP. Even if you decide to do a 180 and buddy up with Daumann and Kruger, doesn't mean they will too. If SRD said "nah screw this, we've been doing the Samura diplomacy wrong. Let's team up with the GMG", there's still the other side of the coin - GMG can just tell them to go away. I am a bit surprised how easy the other player factions leaned into the notion of welcoming ALG, especially considering both Daumann and Kruger are the winners of the civil war and in a much more dominant position than ALG. If they'd ever want supremacy over ALG to establish who are the main Rheinland corps, now's the time.

That being said, the canon part is what you're directly conflicting against as well. Even if a Daumann player faction welcomes ALG, the story can recognize it as invalid and continue story progression regardless of both factions' player roleplay. This can lead to frustrations down the line, for all parties involved, and we've had cases of factions quite literally disbanding because of disagreements with the story team. I know some people would want this not to be a thing and this is a can of worms I don't want to open now, but I hope you get the point I'm trying to convey.

RE: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - SEO - 10-24-2023

No I hear you. I think when Arne was creating the faction, he and I decided that it makes more sense to start with the knowledge and play towards a counter-culture, than from say a bunch of waste disposal experts leaving and getting hired by Daumann or Kruger. But that's a viable alternative. This is also why I'm not requesting ALG id or iff, and why I'm always playing as us leasing office and warehouse space, and trying to secure our own stations. ALG themselves can't be too unhappy because they're still getting contracts and waste to refine. As for the other factions, that's up to those players - it's not like we cherry-picked who to approach, we just contact people who have jurisdiction over a potential clean-up site, and the rest are just minor trading contracts.

I am also pretty good at taking what's given to me by story and playing within those bounds while still doing my thing. What I actually expect if we were to be granted some unique assets is that we'd lose access to most of our ALG holdings, and then we'd be vulnerable as a smaller corp in the shadow of giants. But that's not a reason why Daumann and Kruger can't deal with us, it's just probably going to be more likely that we'll get exploited if that's how people wanna play it. I am pretty optimistic that whatever happens as a result of this app, it will be interesting to play through, which is why I submitted it. That, and feedback like yours can sharpen my understanding of how I believe the faction should be played and what its precise aims are.

RE: SEO| Sirius Entsorgung - Official Faction Creation Request - Wildkins - 02-16-2024

Unfortunately, the staff team has declined your application for officialdom. We feel that SEO as it exists now isn't a very good representative of an ALG faction, either in terms of vanilla lore or Discovery developments. Without that entanglement with ALG, there's not much left in the current writeup to work from, and canonizing an entirely new faction in the vein of Bristol isn't something the team is willing to entertain at the moment.

My personal recommendation would perhaps be to re-tool the faction as a Daumann or Kruger subsidiary, one looking to fill in the gaps in the market that ALG has left behind, or perhaps as a Freelancer ID'd independent company.

Best of luck in the future.