(10-17-2023, 07:27 AM)Saronsen Wrote: [ -> ]4. bombers are useless. i dont think i need to get into the specifics of you nerfing every gun to doing sweet dick-all damage, or mostly being EMP weapons. theyre a threat to maybe a transport and thats if theyre asleep at the wheel
It depends on where you define the usefulness of them. There are certain setups that still work effective against caps, [RHA] have made thor configurations that hose down gunships very very quickly. Granted the average player is very tunnel visioned on the traditional way of using bombers against caps.
Right now for sure bombers are extremely potent against fighters. If anything they are /better/ fighters. Fighter bombers seem like they were brewed together with the powerpuff girls formula. You have some that are obnoxiously slow and useless, but then you have some that turn faster than most HFs in the mod and can stack loadouts capable of instakilling any fighter in the mod.
You have to consider that bombers are the most difficult class to balance. If you push one way too far: they are too effective against caps, if you push the other way: they are too effective against fighters.
The ying yang sweet spot for bombers is as much a pain in the ass to get right as it is to figure out POB mechanics on the server. It's an eternal headache for whoever is trying to balance them.
Quote:7. fighters are cool and good and the only combat ship that feels enjoyable to fly : )
Again, it depends. Missiles are a hard discussion for the balance team it seems. But I personally think missiles need to be all in (starkillers (: ). Guns dominate the pvp aspect of fighter combat still. There are practical applications for missiles but in terms of reliability, your goto is always the same as it was before. Railguns are the only addon that feel like a step up. But this is my personal opinion based on what I have seen so far. Others will say otherwise.
I have not flown caps much, so I cannot say much on them.
I agree with Wesker, though I am not mainly a snub player.
For the capital ship part, while cruisers are somewhat weaker than they used to be last patch, they are still a good choice. As for battlecruisers, while it takes time to get used to, due to the need of keeping the components healthy, they can be useful in most situations where capital ships are present, due to its flexibility.
Battleships actually tore battlecruisers apart, until the hotfixes happened, which gave battlecruisers a fighting chance against the former.
It's only been two weeks since the patch, so expect further changes. Balancing ship classes takes time.
(10-17-2023, 09:29 PM)Wesker Wrote: [ -> ]Right now for sure bombers are extremely potent against fighters. If anything they are /better/ fighters. Fighter bombers seem like they were brewed together with the powerpuff girls formula. You have some that are obnoxiously slow and useless, but then you have some that turn faster than most HFs in the mod and can stack loadouts capable of instakilling any fighter in the mod.
All nice and all, but bombers arent supposed to be a counter for fighters, they are meant to be a counter for things that aren't fighters.
They are absolute trash when you want to bring one to a cap fight.
The fact that they can fight fighters is completely irrelevant. That isn't their job.
The fact that a bomber can't even deshield a bustard with incapacitors when given free reign is just bad balance.
As a battleship main in both World of Warships and Disco, I have personally adapted to the battleship changes rather quickly. (I understand that others have not.) Although the class is not perfect, overall I have to admit I enjoy flying my Overlord just as much now as I did pre-patch. The differences admittedly are night and day, in fact, my own tactics for fighting effectively on a battleship are considerably different now than pre-patch.
In my humble opinion, the direction being taken on battleships is the correct one, albeit not yet perfect. To bring them closer to perfection I would suggest two very basic things that will not only bring balance but will go a long way for people hesitant or unwilling to re-learn the class currently.
1.) Increase hull hitpoints on battleships to account for the slower movement / nerf to evasive actions one can take. As slow as they are, they should have a more tanky hull. Shields feel good currently, it's just the lack of hull capacity compared to the reworked battlecruisers that is nonsensical and feels bad for the user.
2.) Give battleship cores a buff to their overall capacity so they can deal with the drain a little better. Doesnt have to be anything insane, just enough that it's felt and meaningful.
Doesn't seem like much, but in my humble opinion will help make up for what others are seeing as "bad" changes. And from the pov of someone who is enjoying battleships right now, it will help balance the class where it needs help.
About the strafing/movement complaints, endless strafing on caps pre-patch was fun for some, but tbh is just cheesy garbage for most to deal with. That being said, strafing isn't gone, you will just have to use it thoughtfully and not in a brain-dead way. As far as the movement in general, you will need to think more about positioning when docking for example.
(10-17-2023, 09:58 PM)Xithon Wrote: [ -> ]1.) Increase hull hitpoints on battleships to account for the slower movement / nerf to evasive actions one can take. As slow as they are, they should have a more tanky hull. Shields feel good currently, it's just the lack of hull capacity compared to the reworked battlecruisers that is nonsensical and feels bad for the user.
2.) Give battleship cores a buff to their overall capacity so they can deal with the drain a little better. Doesnt have to be anything insane, just enough that it's felt and meaningful.
This will absolutely break everything that isn't broken atm.
(10-17-2023, 09:58 PM)Xithon Wrote: [ -> ]As a battleship main in both World of Warships and Disco, I have personally adapted to the battleship changes rather quickly.
And this is why we can't have nice things.
(10-17-2023, 10:19 PM)Greylock Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2023, 09:58 PM)Xithon Wrote: [ -> ]As a battleship main in both World of Warships and Disco, I have personally adapted to the battleship changes rather quickly.
And this is why we can't have nice things.
Because I personally play other games? I'm not a dev or playtester, just making an observation. Trash take do better ^
And
giving minor buffs to things that are lacking slightly won't break anything. Buff battlecruiser cores a little also... notice I'm saying
a little. like minorly; recharge, or overall capacity. Nothing game-breaking lmao...seriously Implo. Most of you are complaining about cores being too weak, but I say buff them and you STILL CRY.
This type of interaction is why I typically do not give feedback. ^
(10-17-2023, 11:07 PM)Xithon Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2023, 10:19 PM)Greylock Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2023, 09:58 PM)Xithon Wrote: [ -> ]As a battleship main in both World of Warships and Disco, I have personally adapted to the battleship changes rather quickly.
And this is why we can't have nice things.
Because I personally play other games? I'm not a dev or playtester, just making an observation. Trash take do better ^
And giving minor buffs to things that are lacking slightly won't break anything. Buff battlecruiser cores a little also... notice I'm saying a little. like minorly; recharge, or overall capacity. Nothing game-breaking lmao...seriously Implo. Most of you are complaining about cores being too weak, but I say buff them and you STILL CRY.
This type of interaction is why I typically do not give feedback. ^
I haven't complained or "CRIED" one bit about power cores. I understand why they are the way they are. It forces the player to use the resources they have in a meaningful manner, as opposed to just spraying and praying. Hence, why I implied changing the powercores would break something that's not broken. And by all means, feedback is a good way to express your opinion, just because mine is different from yours doesn't mean you shouldn't share it and provide feedback. Without that, there can be no progress.
PS: Sorry if I have offended you. Wasn't on purpose.
(10-17-2023, 11:26 PM)Implosion Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2023, 11:07 PM)Xithon Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2023, 10:19 PM)Greylock Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2023, 09:58 PM)Xithon Wrote: [ -> ]As a battleship main in both World of Warships and Disco, I have personally adapted to the battleship changes rather quickly.
And this is why we can't have nice things.
Because I personally play other games? I'm not a dev or playtester, just making an observation. Trash take do better ^
And giving minor buffs to things that are lacking slightly won't break anything. Buff battlecruiser cores a little also... notice I'm saying a little. like minorly; recharge, or overall capacity. Nothing game-breaking lmao...seriously Implo. Most of you are complaining about cores being too weak, but I say buff them and you STILL CRY.
This type of interaction is why I typically do not give feedback. ^
I haven't complained or "CRIED" one bit about power cores. I understand why they are the way they are. It forces the player to use the resources they have in a meaningful manner, as opposed to just spraying and praying. Hence, why I implied changing the powercores would break something that's not broken. And by all means, feedback is a good way to express your opinion, just because mine is different from yours doesn't mean you shouldn't share it and provide feedback. Without that, there can be no progress.
My mistake, I could have sworn you agreed to what others were saying in regards to cores/ most of everything else. And yes I agree with you completely about why they are the way they are, and I'm not saying they should be changed drastically, maybe just a tad bump... or not, I mean I can personally live with cores the way they are now. Was just thinking of something that people who hate it can be happy with.
P.S. It's all good, just a misunderstanding on my part.
(10-17-2023, 09:57 PM)Megaera Wrote: [ -> ] (10-17-2023, 09:29 PM)Wesker Wrote: [ -> ]Right now for sure bombers are extremely potent against fighters. If anything they are /better/ fighters. Fighter bombers seem like they were brewed together with the powerpuff girls formula. You have some that are obnoxiously slow and useless, but then you have some that turn faster than most HFs in the mod and can stack loadouts capable of instakilling any fighter in the mod.
All nice and all, but bombers arent supposed to be a counter for fighters, they are meant to be a counter for things that aren't fighters.
They are absolute trash when you want to bring one to a cap fight.
The fact that they can fight fighters is completely irrelevant. That isn't their job.
The fact that a bomber can't even deshield a bustard with incapacitors when given free reign is just bad balance.
You're not necessarily wrong. I'm just pointing out that bombers have gone from being effective against caps to effective against snubs. This was probably unintentional.