Independent Disco players

[Veygaar]

Again, I believe Independents either need to eventually choose a faction, play alone in that faction, stay constrained to the rules of the faction ID or just remain independent, take the Nerf or use civi equiptment.

Agreed... So... I'm still trying to figure out what makes you think there are these players doing said things?

I haven't seen any. Though I don't mind fighting people with no nerf with all my nerfed ships, so maybe I just don't keep an eye out for it...

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Veygaar for Admin Moderator 2013!!!

[Kuraine]

I encountered an incidence recently whereby a Unioner IFF/ID'ed Unioner ship was shooting up Unioner NPCs, Rogue NPCs, Zoner NPCs, Liberty NPCs and attacked a Unioner indie player. The person stated in private chat after I queried that he was in no way affiliated with the Unioners (NPC/faction/whatever, he said he was NOT a Unioner of any sort/shape/size/form) and merely used their ID so he could get their ships without penalties, as he wanted to be an indie pirate but have a Unioner ship.

Sadly I never obtained a screenshot of the incident, but I assume this is what Spire was referring to in general. Unfortunately there's a lot of incidences of abuse with people trying to find every loophole they can get their grubby little hands on.

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Kuraine (Zoner tagged Trader)
Ravenholm (Zoner tagged Zoner Destroyer)
Bill Mason[Arms.Dealer] (Zoner tagged Arms Dealer)
LR-Drax (Liberty Rogue tagged Cruiser)
LR-Dravis (Liberty Rogue tagged VHF)
[RHA]Wilhelm.Wettin (Red Hessian tagged VHF)
[GC]-Ai.Takeda (Golden Chrysanthemum tagged VHF/Bomber)

[sadtranslation]

My indie Zoner raided Gamma;
guess what;
I don't think anyone here is good enough to evaluate how valid my roleplay is.

Same logic applies to any other possible case with any other faction in Discovery mod for any player on server;
because none of you can tell anyone else how to play;
otherwise you'll just eat each other alive;
and your official factions;
please, they are not good enough to be mentioned in a reasonable discussion.

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[SA_Scavenger]

I encountered an incidence recently whereby a Unioner IFF/ID'ed Unioner ship was shooting up Unioner NPCs, Rogue NPCs, Zoner NPCs, Liberty NPCs and attacked a Unioner indie player. The person stated in private chat after I queried said he was in no way affiliated with the Unioners (NPC/faction/whatever, he said he was NOT a Unioner of any sort/shape/size/form) and merely used their ID so he could get their ships without penalties, as he wanted to be an indie pirate but have a Unioner ship.

Sadly I never obtained a screenshot of the incident, but I assume this is what Spire was referring to in general. Unfortunately there's a lot of incidences of abuse with people trying to find every loophole they can get their grubby little hands on.

I don't think I would be mistaken in thinking that what you described is 'breaking the rule' of 6.9.

I could be completely wrong though.

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[Adam_Spire]

Spire, I'm trying to understand you here. Have they got a faction ID but are acting as if they have Freelancer/Pirate ID, or are you saying that they are non-official faction members playing their Hessian character as they see fit?

Both, I was going to try to break it down but I don't know how much longer this thread has.

The Independent faction player acts like a freelancer/pirate while at the same time benefitiing from the perks of being a member of the faction, using the ID to avoid the Nerf. Yet there is no player recourse to address that faction because the Faction says they have no control of an independent player who just so happens to have their faction tech. There is no action taken to get that indy player to use indy tech, and the indy player acts how ever they see fit at any time they choose. They interact, on a whim with that faction to maintain the illusion they are part of that faction, yet go right back to their independent actions while waiving the flag of the Faction, the actual faction says they are not part of.

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Sometimes, when all you want is to gain your freedom, you must be willing to risk it all.

[Zeb Harley]

Both, I was going to try to break it down but I don't know how much longer this thread has.

The Independent faction player acts like a freelancer/pirate while at the same time benefitiing from the perks of being a member of the faction, using the ID to avoid the Nerf. Yet there is no player recourse to address that faction because the Faction says they have no control of an independent player who just so happens to have their faction tech. There is no action taken to get that indy player to use indy tech, and the indy player acts how ever they see fit at any time they choose. They interact, on a whim with that faction to maintain the illusion they are part of that faction, yet go right back to their independent actions while waiving the flag of the Faction, the actual faction says they are not part of.

Happens all the time, I guess. Today our group of officials were offered a refill of ore out of our own fields by an indie IC player flying his train in Rheinland.

While this is not really in the IC-ID and can be a little annoying, it's by far not enough to make me write reports about it.

I don't have any problems with people who keep within their set rules.

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for those who missed it: the moral of it all is ----> traders with teeth are fun for pirates. - within reason.

[ryoken]

Wait whaaaaaaaaaaat. Well i guess then 6.9 could be applied in severe cases, and, uh, well. Not sure, this needs to be clarified in rules section by admin. I mean, how about, say, some group of hessian lolwuts/trolls start to, say, pirate the hell out of img? It's allowed by id but not allowed inrp. What the factions are going to do? Nothing?

But i'm too tired to make a thread there now.

Indie Hessiens can Pirate IMG if they want to. Not against the ID, not against the rules. He will how ever be hunted down by Hessien faction for doing so. RP hunted as a traitor.

Again, I believe Independents either need to eventually choose a faction, play alone in that faction, stay constrained to the rules of the faction ID or just remain independent, take the Nerf or use civi equiptment.

No Indies do not have to choose a faction. That is why this game is called "FREELANCER" and not "FACTION LANCER". Factions are fine for those who want to play in a faction. Indies are fine for those who do not. Each player makes thier choice, and ability to choose what/how/where you want to play, and what ship/group you fly with is the main reason Discovery has been around so long.
I tried another server a year or so ago. Graffix/ships/systems/balance were all a crap load better then Discovery, but it failed big time. Why? Becasue at level 20 you "HAD" to pick a faction to join, or be KOS by everyone. Basically a mod with a crap load of work in it failed because it tried to make people play the way creater wanted to play.
People need to understand that mankind by nature just does not like being told what to do,how to do things, what to eat,what to wear and basically anything else. People want to make thier own choices in life, and that transfers over to this game. People want to play thier way. Try to change that/ and you lose them.

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[Adam_Spire]

Indie Hessiens can Pirate IMG if they want to. Not against the ID, not against the rules. He will how ever be hunted down by Hessien faction for doing so. RP hunted as a traitor.
No Indies do not have to choose a faction. That is why this game is called "FREELANCER" and not "FACTION LANCER". Factions are fine for those who want to play in a faction. Indies are fine for those who do not. Each player makes thier choice, and ability to choose what/how/where you want to play, and what ship/group you fly with is the main reason Discovery has been around so long.
I tried another server a year or so ago. Graffix/ships/systems/balance were all a crap load better then Discovery, but it failed big time. Why? Becasue at level 20 you "HAD" to pick a faction to join, or be KOS by everyone. Basically a mod with a crap load of work in it failed because it tried to make people play the way creater wanted to play.
People need to understand that mankind by nature just does not like being told what to do,how to do things, what to eat,what to wear and basically anything else. People want to make thier own choices in life, and that transfers over to this game. People want to play thier way. Try to change that/ and you lose them.

Ok, either comments like this end or you start reading everything Im saying.

Again:

Again, I believe Independents either need to eventually choose a faction, play alone in that faction, stay constrained to the rules of the faction ID or just remain independent, take the Nerf or use civi equiptment

Is anyone grasping that I have nothing against Independents? Did I ever say you must choose a faction and stop there? No. Did you even notice that I said I am still a freelancer, taking the nerf, but acting like a freelancer? I'm not going to repeat myself again and again. People can have it their way, but not at the cost of finding any loophole they can just to have an awesome ship with no tech nerf and not even be a working member of that faction. It's just not right. Be a pirate, be a freelancer, be an independent, work with a faction or be in that faction but man, stop thinking I'm some kind of monster wanting to re-write the DNA code of Disco.

I'm hoping, asking, looking for players to be responsible. You want to have faction tech, fine, have faction tech. If the Faction does not acknoledge you as a member of their faction, then change your ID, take the nerf or join the faction.

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Sometimes, when all you want is to gain your freedom, you must be willing to risk it all.

[Azan27]

Trying to wrap ones head around the matters raised in this thread will cause severe brain damage. For the sake of your sanity, Mr. Spire, I advise that you simply take note of these people, resist the urge to shout at the man using the BMM ID who says "I am not an employee of BMM, I just use the ID for the bonuses" and move on to more fruitful roleplay pasteurs.

Essentially, this is how it was, how it is and how it shall be, and so the unintended consiquences of such policies which allow any person to assume almost any role at any time should be, put simply, 'dealt with' on a personal level.

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Let it burn.

[Ursus]

Can't help but think a lot of these issues just wouldn't even arise if we were using IFF for everything that ID is currently used for. At least in the provided example, if a Unioner ship starts shooting other Unioners then IFF will change and they would get a nerf, without requiring intervention from anybody.

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