When does a core 1 base die ? After 192456 years ?

[Anaximander]

True, there'd be guarantees in terms of sufficient English skills and a commitment to answer comms threads; and those are both crucial when it comes to this sort of base.

But there's also the danger that factions become to complacent with one another, that if the opposing faction isn't consulted first or just in general let things slide; these bases will continue to be a major nuisance - even more so because faction players aren't forced to recognize it and can steam-roll their way forward.

Just out of curiosity - and this is not an accusation - did you give 101st rights to pass on your own accord, or did they never actually have clearance? http://discoverygc.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=94509

[Thyrzul]

1.) Giving access to the base is not my job, I personally did not give anybody access to the station.
2.) I've seen once the names of 101st ships on the access list, added one by one as they had their tags as a suffix.
3.) I recall comms happening about them between TAZ and 101st, TAZ claiming they added 101st by default as well as other Outcast factions too. I recall such comms with other factions as well, not just with outcasts.

Also, by my knowledge there has been communications between outcasts and TAZ about the "corvo-casts", but as usual, the official faction can't really do much with indies if those don't want to listen. This has been an issue for quite a while already.

These bases never were and are not a major nuisance. Only you portrayed them as such. That was all of our previous debate about. You claiming this, me denying. And official factions are not obliged to recognize something as something else it isn't. (Extreme example: If I say you are stupid and that you just don't recognize it because you are not forced to, that won't make you stupid.)

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[Anaximander]

YOU could do stuff about those Outcasts, you could bounty their asses, get permission from 101st and hunt them yourselves and so on; rather than take everyone hostage and force them to play Forumlacer because that brand of RP is particularly appealing to YOU.

That's where I believe factions have a greater responsibility towards the community, a commitment to be excellent and take into account other points of views and other ways of playing this game than the one YOU prefer. You failed to show that, and that is why I say factions are not necessarily any guarantee of better bases.

That base was a major nuisance to me (as a player and my character), and to the new player (as a player and as character) I brought along to get his first Sabre fitted with an AU8 at Barrier Gate. It probably was a nuisance to other people (as players and characters) who can't be arsed debating this, or don't go on the forum. Nothing you write here can tell me otherwise, that's not at all for you to decide.

[Thyrzul]

You can pretty much speak in your own name too, maybe in the name of your companion, but that's all. So don't try to mask this whole as a major nuisance for a whole community. As I don't have the right to speak on behalf of all who passed that base, neither you do.

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[Anaximander]

Be reasonable.

Did the base shoot and kill Outcasts in-game or did it not?

Is it annoying getting insta-killed with no warning just when you pop through a hole to a system that should lore-wise be full of "sacred neutrality" or is it not?

[Thyrzul]

Be reasonable.

Did the base shoot and kill Outcasts in-game or did it not?

Yes.

Did the base shoot them and only them?

No. So stop acting like your problem would be over anybody else's.

Is it annoying getting insta-killed with no warning just when you pop through a hole to a system that should lore-wise be full of "sacred neutrality" or is it not?

Yes. It is annoying in any circumstance.

Was there really no warning?

Hell, there indeed was.

Be reasonable, you say, but even you are not reasonable, trying to argue with half of the truth and ignoring the other half. Trying to pose as the innocent victim of an incident you could as much prevent as the ones you blame for it. Is that your definition of being reasonable?

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[Anaximander]

I never said my problem would be over everyone else's, I more or less said the opposite.

You said that the base never was a nuisance, but at the same time you acknowledge that getting insta-whacked in such a fashion is annoying - what's it gonna be? One or the other. Being annoying is pretty much the definition of a nuisance. The base is also a nuisance because it's actions (killing Outcasts - "stupid ones" or not - as well as everyone else) conflicts with the TAZ ID and the lore-written regional power balance (whether or not Outcast leadership react on it or not) - I'm dreaming back to a time when TAZ was like Rainth described, before the arrival of player epeens bases.

To you, would a forum notice that X is now hunting faction 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 unless they beg on the forum not to be hunted be sufficient for you if you got insta-blued with no prior in-game rp by another player that was supposedly neutral to you and you to him?

It's not reasonable that you try to force people to play on the forum, when you are killing them in-game.

[Thyrzul]

I never said my problem would be over everyone else's, I more or less said the opposite.

Your words did not communicate this.

You said that the base never was a nuisance, but at the same time you acknowledge that getting insta-whacked in such a fashion is annoying - what's it gonna be? One or the other. Being annoying is pretty much the definition of a nuisance. It is also a nuisance because it's actions (killing Outcasts - "stupid ones" or not) conflicts with the TAZ ID and the lore-written regional power balance (whether or not Outcast leadership react on it or not) - I'm dreaming back to a time when TAZ was like Rainth described, before the arrival of player epeens bases.

These bases never were and are not a major nuisance.

Note, the key word is 'major', and the context says that it was regarding being an issue to the overall community. You said you were paying attention, yet your replies doesn't really show that.

That for bases acting against IDs, I don't know if you have noticed or not, bases tend to do that. Even despite Zoners should maintain neutrality, their bases, PoB or not, will shoot you if you are red to them. And you know, you can't just tell them that "red=dead" isn't a valid arguement. What you can do, in the case of PoBs only, is that you can set the list of individuals and groups it shouldn't shoot. In this regard, they are even better than NPC bases.

To you, would a forum notice that X is now hunting faction 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 unless they beg on the forum not to be hunted be sufficient for you if you got insta-blued by another player that was supposedly neutral to you and you to him?

Where was this the case? Where the hell did you pull that out? Who hunted who, and who had to beg for that? Seriously, are we talking about the same?

It's not reasonable that you try to force people to play on the forum, when you are killing them in-game.

Nobody is forced to communicate, and nobody is forced to fly into certain death. What everybody is forced to do is to bear the consequences of their own actions and inactions, again something applying in RL too.

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[Anaximander]

Your words did not communicate this.

They did.

Note, the key word is 'major', and the context says that it was regarding being an issue to the overall community.

It's an issue when new Outcast players and burgeoning Cardamine smugglers get whacked like this, they ditch either the server or ditch the Outcasts. I love the Outcasts more than any faction, so it saddens me to see fresh blood getting chased off. Can't comment on other groups because I haven't been in a group experiencing that. Your base, while boosting your forum activity, kills in-game activity for other players; and you got a responsibility for that if you truly want the respect you seem to think you deserve.

You said you were paying attention, yet your replies doesn't really show that.

Ditto. You can keep saying that whenever you don't get the answer you want, and so can I. Let's fast forward over that part.

That for bases acting against IDs, I don't know if you have noticed or not, bases tend to do that.

And here is where I was of the belief that Factions should rise above that and ensure their bases act according to lore and ID, even if there are no written rules on the area. Afterall, how can you claim to be more capable of having bases when you stoop to the lowest level? For a neutral faction TAZ chose the most violent, bloody and hostile solution to their problem, when there was a range of other more diplomatic or subtle solutions available - just because they could and no one was there to stop them, regardless of what lore suggests.

Where was this the case? Where the hell did you pull that out? Who hunted who, and who had to beg for that? Seriously, are we talking about the same?

That base was shooting innocents for a period of time, and you said that the warning you posted on the forum was sufficient justification to do so, did you not? Would that be sufficient rp to you if we were talking player actions and not base actions? Don't you have an obligation to let all your entities and objects in-space represent TAZ and take full responsibility?

What everybody is forced to do is to bear the consequences of their own actions and inactions, again something applying in RL too.

And when there is no player faction to apply those consequences, then what? We let it slide? We don't have a commitment in our own RP to at least take into account both sides of the lore framework we seek to adhere to?

[Duvelske]

Now.. where to start.. o yes.. As i have said MANY times before it was needed at that time for malaclypse freeport at least. sure we did not like it, but what kind of choice did we have? I caught you flying intentionally an knowingly into that jumphole moments later you make a post that you where slaughtered. Ok thats up to you, but when someone makes a post on the forums to inform the people of sirius that due to certain circomstances something has to be closed. Do not QQ about it afterwards.

Now Ravenhurst.. Also meantioned several times. My guess why the devs did place the aquillon within baffin:
- there were 2 official factions back then. (if i recall correctly osi was not official when i came to disco)
- Omicromners had o-74 and for example the nephy which can be a good match vs the marduk to withstand as a final defense.

But to place it all within o-74 would give the Omicromners inRP a huge advantage. So for this i guess they did for this reason place the Aquillon within Baffin and the nephy within O-74. also it would generate RP between the factions if they wanted to aquire one. Note this is PURE speculation and reading the wiki's and information about several factions and such.

As that Ravenhurst is protecting our home.. I guess it is telling enough already. A simple request will do and it will be granted.

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