A look back at the Junker and Hogosha IDs.

[JonahC]

The house lawful ID could be changed to "other parties commiting unlawful acts" and that would cover most of the necessary situations.

The above is a quote from Ursus, and I think this is really the best way to go. The whole idea of quasi-lawful, is that you are law abiding unless caught breaking the law. Simply allowing the law to pew with or without reason simply doesnt make sense.

And, I liked the days when Hogosha and Junkers could be pirates. It kept you on your toes. Now passing a Hog or Junker in a lane is like passin any other lawful faction. Then, you had to wonder if they were there to take your goods or not, and of course take appropriate precautions. I didnt always like it when Hogs could blow my transport full of ore up, and then sell it in the same system, but at least there was much more suspense involved in trading.

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[Blodo]

Reason why I disagree is one of gameplay. It's true that you had to prove your trustworthiness before lawfuls of all kinds stopped treating you as KoS pirate. However, it was not only kinda bad for beginning Junkers, those who know what they are doing can evade "infamy" easily: with a /renameme every so often. You get caught by lawfuls/unlawfuls/whoever? Renameme, done. Abuse all around, this is why quasi lawful IDs are limited. Otherwise it just allows you to be either a lawful pirate (if lawfuls decide to trust you first) or ruins it for other Junkers (if the lawfuls decide that enough is enough and they put you on KoS).

[Vulkhard Muller]

Had an interesting thought allow Hogosha to only pirate Kishiro and GMG with in Kusari house space and any one(except Samura) on the border systems ( Kepler Sigma13 ect). This I feel could be a valid solution atleast for the Hogosha

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[Jack_Henderson]

Didn't Hogosha get bases in the systems bordering Kusari, so they can pirate outside easily? I only know that there was talk about that at some point.

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[Curios]

Curious, there was a problem with the Hogosha. Especially around Narita. Continually using a bunch of gunboats and big dragons to blow up ore traders, then claiming to be innocent when the KN and KSP show - and the KN/KSP could not do a thing about it unless they actually saw them shooting traders. The issue with the junkers was before my time but from what I was told was similar. Both cases were considered gameplay problems, which led to the IDs being adjusted.

Please leave your tinfoil hat at the door next time. This is not flood.

Oh stop, you. Traders can't power trade and being pirated just one lane before sale point. Terrible thing, indeed. It's totally justified to ruin ID just because traders are, in 90% cases, too obsessed with getting as much cash as possible and thus fly 5k transports w\o armor upgrade full of ore and without any escort, but not only that - also they don't want to pay a coin. It's always simplier to cry a river how it's terrible and baaad for gameplay and stuff. I won't even explain how those traders are bad for pirate gameplay because it's simply stupid to hear here and there "kill me", "no", etc and see trader ships just F1ing and silently running to the closest dockpoint without giving even a half-arsed RP back. So no pls, fix the ID and let them pirate. I'm not playing hogosha but I'd rather be pirated by Hogoshas on one of my smugglers or traders with some RP involved then to watch tumbleweeds running across Kusari.

And also if you REALY care about GAMEPLAY then why don't you look at all those retardbases sitting on the Jumpgates\Jumpholes ruining the whole region, instead? Or it's not interesting for someone in dev team because it's not a concern for the factions that some of the dev team members are at?

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[TLI-Inferno]

Why don't you just save everybody some time and just delete all of the quasi-legal factions and turn this into a game of cops and robbers? You're destroying quasi-legal factions by basically declaring them unlawful shoot-on-sight targets without even giving them the right to do anything violently unlawful. They are basically a scapegoat for everybody to shoot when they're angry.

If you're not going to let quasi-legals play the game as quasi-legals, then you might as well just remove them. While you're at it, remove all the other factions from the game, too. And remove fighter class, they're overpowered. Remove bombers, freighters, transports, and capital ships as well; diversity ruins the game.

Everyone should have to fly one generic ship under a generic unlawful faction or a generic lawful faction where they are required to say "Shooting [name]" before killing each other. This mod is already headed in that direction, might as well speed things along.

[Fluffyball]

Hogosha is Yakuza, and in real life Yakuza does little bother with the Japanese police. You know, bribes and so on - aside of the fact they are... well, criminals but they follow some rules to not to piss of the police - but also they are to help the citizens (Yakuza and police in Japan worked together against the tsunami effect back in 2011 for example). Aside of that, yes. Pirating, but only the foreigners for Hogosha. And it was back in 4.84, as I remember?

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[Syrus]

I strongly oppose "lawful piracy".
If you wish to sell off the ore you just received by blowing up that trader one lane away from the next high-paying sellpoint after you made an insane demand which'd cause the trader to lose more than he makes you better get someone else to tractor it. We had this "one-lane-before-sellpoint-piracy" happening often enough. All the time at Naritan and during the H3 being well sold on SSR, we had it there as well...

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[Curios]

I strongly oppose "lawful piracy".
If you wish to sell off the ore you just received by blowing up that trader one lane away from the next high-paying sellpoint after you made an insane demand which'd cause the trader to lose more than he makes you better get someone else to tractor it. We had this "one-lane-before-sellpoint-piracy" happening often enough. All the time at Naritan and during the H3 being well sold on SSR, we had it there as well...

"I'm afk trading and I'm so angry"

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[nOmnomnOm]

I agree with everything in the thread post EXCEPT that Junker are allowed to pirate in House Space.

That will then still mean u can shoot them in house space dont you think?

I remember before it was that they can pirate in independent systems or out of house space. That is fine. Just dont expect a 'why you shooting me for' then your known to pirate in house space.

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