Nomads.

[Haste]

I always assume everyone and everything can shoot me whenever the hell they like when I've flying a Nomad character. That's how it works in practice anyhow.

Anyone who's ever flown a K'Hara character knows that you'll see about 20 rule-breaking silent engages just by flying from Chester to Alaska.

Perhaps a line on the ID saying "May be engaged by anyone" (that doesn't imply you can silently engage, as far as I'm aware) would clear things up.

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[Trogdor]

WRONG!

There STILL has to be role-play done before ANY attack on here, period.

Remember, too, that even the Nomads have to have done SOME RP before they attack you - even if it's the simple 'Softskins inside metal skins must perish' or however we want to phrase "Destroy All Humans" ...

Apparently this is no longer the case.

Today I was near FP9 and two indie nomads came out of the O-74 hole a few K away. Since I wasn't in fighting condition (I lost some turrets somehow in the patch) I went to dock on FP9. As my battleship floated towards the mooring point they started shooting me without a word.

I contacted a Khara| who happened to be online, and he basically said the nomad ID allows this silent engagement in the Omicrons.

We're in the Omicrons, no rp anymore

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[Fyodor]

Nope.

I always assumed that if they're allowed to shoot you, you're allowed to shoot them.

Is there any other example than nomads where pre-emptive self defense is prohibited?

EDIT: I also just noticed that Trent would have been banned for rule breaking on discoveryGC.

[Trogdor]

Nope.

I always assumed that if they're allowed to shoot you, you're allowed to shoot them.

Is there any other example than nomads where pre-emptive self defense is prohibited?

EDIT: I also just noticed that Trent would have been banned for rule breaking on discoveryGC.

The issue is not whether they're allowed to shoot you. Nomads are of course allowed to shoot just about anyone.

The issue is whether they have to bother to say anything beforehand, and the golden rule up until recently has been 'yes' for everyone. But apparently now, for the Nomads, it's 'no' as long as they're in the Omicrons.

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[Fyodor]

Can Freelancers and Zoners attack them NOT in self-defense?

Can they offense them first?

Nope.

I always assumed that if they're allowed to shoot you, you're allowed to shoot them.

Is there any other example than nomads where pre-emptive self defense is prohibited?

EDIT: I also just noticed that Trent would have been banned for rule breaking on discoveryGC.

The issue is not whether they're allowed to shoot you. Nomads are of course allowed to shoot just about anyone.

The issue is whether they have to bother to say anything beforehand, and the golden rule up until recently has been 'yes' for everyone. But apparently now, for the Nomads, it's 'no' as long as they're in the Omicrons.

Uhm...

No, the question is quite clearly whether freelancers and zoners can attack nomads without being attacked first. But it seems some people are willfully misunderstanding it just so they can answer "no" or say something they've always wanted to say.

[Haste]

Technically, no, although I'd be fine if the K'Hara / Nomad ID stated they can be engaged by anyone (except Wilde / Iseijin / Nomads, obviously).

Why? Because that's already the case anyhow, and I can't be bothered to file fifteen reports for every time I take a Nomad out for a spin.

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[Trogdor]

Uhm...

No, the question is quite clearly whether freelancers and zoners can attack nomads without being attacked first. But it seems some people are willfully misunderstanding it just so they can answer "no" or say something they've always wanted to say.

Sorry. I thought you were replying to what I had just said in regards to what Agmen said.

It's a gray area, but assuming you bother to roleplay a bit, type out that you're attacking and why and whatnot, I don't think you'll run afoul of sanctions. They come up red on the IFF for a reason. I mean, Zoner caps go on nomad-system raids for POB-equipment parts fairly often and I haven't seen any sanction reports come of it. Even though they're going there to fight npcs they're still going out and attacking the nomads.

Also.. pre-emptive self-defense. Also known as attacking. lol

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[aerelm]

I always assumed that if they're allowed to shoot you, you're allowed to shoot them.

Is there any other example than nomads where pre-emptive self defense is prohibited?

Actually, no ID allows preemptive self-defense as valid engagement. Your ID either allows you to attack someone (be it in form of piracy, bounty hunting or open hostility), or the only way you can attack them is if you're attacked so then you can shoot back in self-defense. In case of the Freelancer ID, you can only attack another player if there's a bounty on them and you're registered to collect, or you're hired ingame to assist/escort another player in combat against the target. Other than that, you can only attack them if they actually open fire on your ship.

Yes, this does not make perfect sense InRP, but trying to adjust the rules to allow such scenarios to be carried out in a more realistic manner would just be opening a sizable can of worms, so having restrictions such as this is (sadly) necessary.

[djordje_petrovic]

Khara is small faction... and main battles are not in omicrons for now. Nomads are more interesting to rp than to shoot. They are rare sight in house space , pewing them xenophobically is one or 2 snubs down , but considering them specie older than mankind and so wise and advanced would give much more interesting feedback from those squidlings than raw blasters.

[Trogdor]

I always assumed that if they're allowed to shoot you, you're allowed to shoot them.

Is there any other example than nomads where pre-emptive self defense is prohibited?

Actually, no ID allows preemptive self-defense as valid engagement. Your ID either allows you to attack someone (be it in form of piracy, bounty hunting or open hostility), or the only way you can attack them is if you're attacked so then you can shoot back in self-defense. In case of the Freelancer ID, you can only attack another player if there's a bounty on them and you're registered to collect, or you're hired ingame to assist/escort another player in combat against the target. Other than that, you can only attack them if they actually open fire on your ship.

Yes, this does not make perfect sense InRP, but trying to adjust the rules to allow such scenarios to be carried out in a more realistic manner would just be opening a sizable can of worms, so having restrictions such as this is (sadly) necessary.

Zoners have a large ZOI and, according to the letter of the rules, can't pew anything unless pewed first.

Noms have a large ZOI, get infinite cloaks, and can now, apparently, pew anything in the Omicrons without saying a word.

Seems legit. @_@

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