The Pirate ID - New Changes

[sindroms]

Tushkie, the Pirate ID is still a generic ID and thus cannot hire anyone. Again, thanks to lolgroups.

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[Fluffyball]

I am just mad about the fact that "slight" Pirate ID change made the long-lasting roleplay useless, as we can't pick up targets like Unione Corse and Hogosha targets. Very well, prepare for abusing Freelancer ID by other players. C:

The main problem I can't use non-generic unlawful ID, because I would be breaking my own ID ruleset with cooperating the Argo.

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[Haste]

doesn't matter if they do so with an Outcast ID, a Rogue ID or a Pirate ID. Or a corporate ID or Navy ID for that matter...

That's the thing. It does actually matter. House unlawful factions are (or were) far less common in the houses than random independent pirates. A change like this allows players who truly want to play a "tradelane pirate" to still use the independent, Sirius-wide ID, while promoting use of house-specific unlawful IDs for those who want to go for a more terrorist/resistance fighter-esque approach.

I've always had a few Pirate ID'd ships scattered around Sirius for an easy PvP fix, but I really won't lose sleep over having to use less generic IDs instead.

The only Pirate ID'd ship I have that genuinely was used to pirate will likely not be affected by this change at all.

Oh, and something else this likely fixes: perhaps we'll see actual faction-specific gear in the regions we expect to see it. So fewer Ascos, Corsair and Hessian gunboats in Liberty, and more Rogue and Lane Hacker ones. That'd be real nice.

Also a bump for this, because it would solve a few potential issues I think:

Given Veygaar's valid point, I would like to suggest that the following line be added to the Pirate ID as well.

* - Can demand credits from any vessel with a generic ID (Miner, Freelancer, Pirate) and attack them if they don't comply.

[sindroms]

People are complaining that the change to the pirate ID will ruin their (lol) roleplay.
If that is the case, then accept that undesirable groups were the cause for this nerf. Their actions and disruptive behavior sacrificed your RP for the wellbeing of the server.

Do not blame the admins. Blame the people, who forced them to take such a drastic step. It would be foolish to think that the admin team didn't realize that this would mess with people's RP. But it was necessary.


The SRP, however, were made much easier to enter. If your pirate's RP is what matters to you, submit a SRP. It will also be something to brag about.

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[Danny-boy]

The change was made to the Pirate ID in order to avoid the OORP scenario of a pirate placing a demand on a Navy/Police player, knowing full well he wouldn't pay just to get around the ID restriction and have his pvp. I know there are some who feel that this is perfectly inRP, but frankly, we disagree. I would even go so far as to say that if a Navy/Police player did pay the demand, then he was acting OORP as well, in order to avoid pvp.

Any resulting OORP occurrences that may result from this change, in our minds, are far more favorable than the ones we have had to endure with the way things were before. No rules will be changed to accommodate this edit to the Pirate ID.

As far as Navy/Police making demands on Pirates? Well, I certainly hope so, since that is their role. It is to be expected that they would behave like that, protecting traders from pirates.

There will be no Terrorist ID, and if pirates didn't act like terrorists, this change would never have happened. So, instead of pissing on us Admins, go piss on the players that forced us to make this change in the first place.

Have a nice day!

I fail to see how pirating a House's Police force/Navy (henceforth 'House forces') is an OORP thing to do.

If the pirate side outgunned or outmatched the House forces (or the pirate pilot(s) had lost the plot) then why would they not pirate the Police/Navy if they thought they had a chance of winning?
They are pirates, by definition if they stand a chance of getting a little bit of money you would expect them to exploit the situation.

I also fail to see how the decision of the House forces to pay is an OORP thing to do.

If you did not stand a chance of winning a fight, would it not be better to make a tactical retreat and survive to fight another day? Or maybe the captain of a ship isn't in a situation where they are able to risk their crews lives. What if the main guns had failed or the shield generator was down or there was a VIP aboard and you could not risk their life? Etc etc..

The point is that there are a million and one ways to justify these actions INRP and removing the ability for people to engage in these sort of encounters is un-conducive to role play and creativity.



Surely it would be better to punish the few that are abusing the ID to get quick OORP pews rather than limiting everyone else's ability to use the ID to create a fun INRP experience for all parties involved.

Otherwise what is the point in having the sanction system if instead of the few that commit the violations being punished, everyone else who isn't violating the rules and are just trying to have fun with people and enjoy some role play also get punished? The idea of not only punishing the guilty but at the same time also punishing the innocent seems more than a little backwards to me.

[Tutashkhia]

Don't expect that pirate switching the corsair gunboat to rogue or hacker one after the change in the pirate I'd
Mob types terrrivble

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Tutashkhia Reports

[Lythrilux]

I fail to see how pirating a House's Police force/Navy (henceforth 'House forces') is an OORP thing to do.

The problem is it's not in the spirit of the ID and it's really just an excuse to get a pew. Hence why it's abuse.

If the pirate side outgunned or outmatched the House forces (or the pirate pilot(s) had lost the plot) then why would they not pirate the Police/Navy if they thought they had a chance of winning?
They are pirates, by definition if they stand a chance of getting a little bit of money you would expect them to exploit the situation.

But they shouldn't ever really. How do a small group of independent pirates, who have access to a lot less resources and are a lot organized, mount up an attack against the law enforcement of a house? It doesn't make any sense.

I also fail to see how the decision of the House forces to pay is an OORP thing to do.

You see a whole load of lolpirates coming your way and you can't really be bothered to engage in a pew with them, therefore you just throw your money at them in order to get them to go away. Or you even pay them in order to spite them and not let them have their blue.

Surely it would be better to punish the few that are abusing the ID to get quick OORP pews rather than limiting everyone else's ability to use the ID to create a fun INRP experience for all parties involved.

The problem is this just keeps getting abused again and again by different people. What's to stop another group or individual coming along and repeating the same behavior within the bounds of the (old) pirate ID?

Otherwise what is the point in having the sanction system if instead of the few that commit the violations being punished, everyone else who isn't violating the rules and are just trying to have fun with people and enjoy some role play also get punished? The idea of not only punishing the guilty but at the same time also punishing the innocent seems more than a little backwards to me.

As people have said, if you genuinely play the pirate ID for piracy this change shouldn't be a punished for you at all.

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[Kauket]

I still don't see why you can't let them pirate whatever class vessel when in non-house space, if they met a military person in there, well, they can act like they're too far from home, or that the guy should pay to survive -- "space is dangerous"

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[Danny-boy]

I fail to see how pirating a House's Police force/Navy (henceforth 'House forces') is an OORP thing to do.

The problem is it's not in the spirit of the ID and it's really just an excuse to get a pew. Hence why it's abuse.

Then punish those that abuse the ID not everyone else.

If the pirate side outgunned or outmatched the House forces (or the pirate pilot(s) had lost the plot) then why would they not pirate the Police/Navy if they thought they had a chance of winning?
They are pirates, by definition if they stand a chance of getting a little bit of money you would expect them to exploit the situation.

But they shouldn't ever really. How do a small group of independent pirates, who have access to a lot less resources and are a lot organized, mount up an attack against the law enforcement of a house? It doesn't make any sense.

So a band of pirates come upon a lone patrol of two-three ships and aren't able to take it down? That is complete BS, if this where the case then there would be no pirates left in the game because the House forces have ships that are 10000000x better than than that of pirate factions and only require 10 ships to remove every pirate in existence.

Offcourse INRP you wouldn't go up to the HQ of the House and try to pirate them, but if it is a small patrol then why the hell not?

Unless offcourse you are one of those pirates that has lost the plot, in which case you may try and pirate the House forces HQ.

I also fail to see how the decision of the House forces to pay is an OORP thing to do.

You see a whole load of lolpirates coming your way and you can't really be bothered to engage in a pew with them, therefore you just throw your money at them in order to get them to go away. Or you even pay them in order to spite them and not let them have their blue.

Not everyone is 'lolpirate' you know. In this situation both of the groups would be in the wrong, and they should be punished - not everyone else.

Surely it would be better to punish the few that are abusing the ID to get quick OORP pews rather than limiting everyone else's ability to use the ID to create a fun INRP experience for all parties involved.

The problem is this just keeps getting abused again and again by different people. What's to stop another group or individual coming along and repeating the same behavior within the bounds of the (old) pirate ID?

Most of the time it is the same people on different ships, those few people should be punished (be it via bans/sticking ships in Bastille/whatever) What is stopping them is the 1.2 rule against trolling as abusing the ID to get quick OORP pews pretty much amounts to trolling. If the behavior continues then make the punishment worse until they either realise what they are doing is wrong or they get banned from the server - either way, it is better than punishing everyone else on the server for their actions.

Otherwise what is the point in having the sanction system if instead of the few that commit the violations being punished, everyone else who isn't violating the rules and are just trying to have fun with people and enjoy some role play also get punished? The idea of not only punishing the guilty but at the same time also punishing the innocent seems more than a little backwards to me.

As people have said, if you genuinely play the pirate ID for piracy this change shouldn't be a punished for you at all.

Unless offcourse you happen to come upon a lone patrol and you are not allowed to pirate them because the actions of the few have meant that the ID has been nerfed and so the RP available to you has been quite severely limited, or unless your target happens to be a small mining ship that isn't a freighter.

[Haste]

I fail to see how pirating a House's Police force/Navy (henceforth 'House forces') is an OORP thing to do.

It's not every day that I read about Somali pirates pirating a US navy aircraft carrier in their speedboats.

Think about it that way.