I'm not going to get into the he said she said thing. This appears to eba feedback topic, not a argument center.
Alright, for the Harvesters out there, especialy the ONE who is the core of it all:
So far eh, not to bad. Gave a slight different direction for me to play around with on my Zoner, I even pulled out an old copy of Cyberpunk for the Hackers rules and Programs to attemot to use...
And thats wher the slight negitive vcomes in: Your machines right? Well other than the Two times that a harvester even went with the RP with more than the Access Denied routine or some other simular line, its getting fustrating. The Rp I go through to make it supposedly Hard to trace or find where the Zoner is actualy at, for the most part gets ignored or instant location found.
Then theres the two harvesters so far that hid under the Trader ID tag. That was a real negitive to me to try for some RP and pretty much shrugs off or again with the Denied routine. One I was forced to destroy cause even after bringing it down to almost no hull, no bats or bots, it wanted to fight a GB and VHF in a Mining Ship.
So far, it appears that some Zoners are flat out giving up and wnat little more to do with this fustration, and I am having to ask the Council for advice. Normaly, I'd continue with this, attempt to "Hack" some more, but really, if there is no real leeway, why continue, know what I mean?
Anyway, thats my Feedback for the Harvesters, NOT an open invite for arguments or comments. Thank you.
' Wrote:I understand your point of view. But my I attitude towards almost all thing is a system of balance. No thing can be without a counterpart. And thus the Zoners needed one.
Myself for example: wehen I started playing on the Discovery server I get myself a Zoner ID, because I wanted to get money. Money for what? Right, for other characters, that may not be in such a economically independent position, like pirates or police. This circumstance reduces the Zoner faction to the state of money collectors, because they have no real counterpart.
Now the Harvesters come into the game. Imagine, now a Zoner pilot may hire a mercenary for protection, or another Zoner with a fighter, bomber, cruiser or so. (All Zoners I know use freighters or transports.)
This is a big addition to the ongoing RP, isn't it?
The balance is there - the Zoners are disoganized, dispersed, and as a rule non-militant. To balance that, they have great economic power, and the threat of a Zoner blocade is fearsome, since it can freeze a pirate factions food, water, arms and oxygen supplies, or cut a house faction off from deutrium and cheap raw materials from the edge worlds. As a Zoner, I've been bullied, denied docking, denied unloading goods, and, a couple of times, been attacked in the edgeworlds by desperate pirates. I have also been welcomed in almost every part of Sirius, bringing the goods that are needed. _That_ is what being a Zoner is all about, imnsho.
I'd be all for making the Zoner ID harder to get. I'd even support limiting the available transports for Zoners. I will not support killing the Zoner way.
By the way, there are Zoners in non-transports - I find that a very rewarding and in-RP job is to escort traders to and from Freeports/Canaria. Great times.
How - how - is making the Zoners into yet another carbon-copy trading faction adding to the ongoing RP? It is removing a unique RP experience and replacing it with more of what's already there in abundance.
Just because you created a Zoner to be a powertrader, don't project your OORPness on me!
/w - miffed
John Johnson - Master of Synth.Foods-Convoy|049
Hans Adler - Synth Foods escort wing
Cosmos: Fine. But OORP, YOU dictate that we don't have the code, amiright?
So you force a conflict on me that is nowhere in the original or disco story, that I have no RP way to resolve. What is that if not dictating the RP of others?
Here, have the alpha code. Now go away.
John Johnson - Master of Synth.Foods-Convoy|049
Hans Adler - Synth Foods escort wing
There are those out there who are RPing not just fleeing and shooting. There are some characters I can think of that tried RP with us while we were very busy, and got side lined. Sorry. I am a human playing a machine, I dont really have the ability to multi task on the level these machines should.
I know its an old sayiong but true. If at first you don't suceed try again. If you really want undestracted RP to dictate our RP or to have impact and I seem to be blowing you off then don't get offended. PM me we can RP out of space too. Like last night we were attacked by a Battle star, 2 Zoner destroyers, and a Huntress. Mean while I had the Binaries trying thier best to RP with us( I mean putting real effort into it), in short they got side lined. Not because I didn't want to RP I just had to handle the very local problems. Blaster fire.
I know why ZOner have us on KOS, I can't complain there. A character Janeen(I spelt it how it sounds) they tried RP when I was trying to get back to the Binaries and take more scan of a ship yard. Sidelined........Sorry.
That is the most recent event in my mind. But if you got side lined then PM or try again. we suffer from the same weakness you have and our list of people who call us hostile is rather long. Oh well, we continue like a persistant machine. Now since Mal don't want the Bag I will talk with a ZOner player to work out groud rules and keep things balanced.
Also take note unless you were Gravedancer we have not flown through systems hunting Zoners. We kill NPC hostile and when a ZOner crosses our path we persue. That simple so its not like your hounded to the ends of the earth.
By the way I know where Bafflin and omega 49 are. You may have seen us in Omega 49 for a total of 15 minutes since the event. and never in Bafflin. So I dont by the Zoners have no where to go thread.
If you play a ZOner for peaceful trade your hideing behind an ID. Real Zoners stick it out and survive, thats part of being a Zoner. Now Alice Spire was on to a solution but this recent smear has obscured that.
The reason I have not planned another event was that I was giveing the Zoners time to have a breather and cordinate their responces. Make alliances and hire muscle. BHG is muscle for hire. They are dying for a paid fight.
Well, in character, if the Corsairs allied with a machine faction openly hostile to the Zoners, two things would be probable to happen
a) Worsening of Order/Corsair relations. Protectors of humankind? I assume the Order are hostile to you by now, since you go around harvesting humans, and attack their allies.
b) Starvation of Corsairs - who is it that supply their foods and meds again?
What irritates me about this is that _you_ thought up something with no support in-game or in the story, and are using to force others to change the way they play.
At first I thought it was great, as previously stated. Give a real downside to being a Zoner, to punish or discourage the powertraders. But - I have come to relize it does not work that way. This only forces the forum-dwellers and roleplayers to adapt to _your_ rules, since this is wholly driven by you. As I said, it is you who have the power over this code, so there is nothing a Zoner can really do, is there?
You have, in your mind, created an enemy that is invunerable to logistics and economics, and so you will force the Zoners to become like everyone else. Bah!
Edit: If Zoner powertraders are a problem, limit them to smaller ships. Don't try to change them into something they are not.
Edit2: This is my problem, put as short as possible: Roleplaying a Zoner is suddenly _all_ about the Bobforsaken Harvesters, and nothing about being a Zoner.
John Johnson - Master of Synth.Foods-Convoy|049
Hans Adler - Synth Foods escort wing
I seriously suggest putting some effort into RP'ing with them...
Remember machines don't lie and they don't expect to be lied to (till they learn)
If things get too rough...
see if you can use the knowledge about zoners having alpha code to your advantage.
Then I wonder why you bothered to post anything at all? Just curious.
In any case, I still intend to roleplay with the harvesters, though I still haven't really found a satisfactory explanation as to what the hell this Alpha Code is. Would be nice if someone could point it out. If i've missed it somewhere in this topic, then I apologise. Anyway, I can see this is really getting out of hand, and it needs to be resolved soon if we're to salvage what is ultimately (and hopefully will remain so) a fun RP project.
For one thing, i'm thinking maybe the harvesters should stick to mainly bombers. They're quite capable of taking down not only traders but also capital ships, and I virtually never see a Harvester alone, so there's no chance of them really running up against anything too difficult, as a rule. Also, stick to civilian only ships for all harvesters ideally (the Talarcas are fine to a point, but I dislike running into groups of two or three of them), and civilian weapons/codenames for fighters and bombers.
Can someone maybe explain to me why the Harvesters are friendly towards Corsairs? And why they are hostile towards Lane Hackers and Outcasts? It has probably been posted somewhere but obviously i've missed it along the line. Just for clarification.
Well I'm sorry for you there is in game story to it and it is composed of nothing but FL elements. It is an original idea, which is encourged I believe to alieviate the stagnic cops and robbers common theme. If you are finding it hard being a Zoner then get a Trader ID we dont attack traders. In fact the only folks we start fight with are those on the HOS, Zoners, Outcast, Lane Hackers, and enemies of the Corsairs in Corsair space and those who shoot at us if you want to fly and not have any threat of RP then play with a neutral ID and no one can shoot you. But to get that you will have to have some solid RP to get it from Admin. Since they know many would go neutral to "Power trade".
Sorry, you are intitled to your opinion but, not to imagine what I'm thinking.
We can supply the Corsairs if need be from the supplies harvested from the Zoners.
The Order we aviod them. If they found out, yeah they probally would bomb the crap out of them. We just havent shot them yet because of metagameing thier alliegence.
Plus our Alliance with the Corsairs is not common knowledge anywhere but here on these OOC forums. The Zoners dont know. I believe you even sought and recieved sheltter from the Corsairs yesterday on Crete, from Harvester 10. I didn't wait around for you like a PVP whore drooling at the chops. I said "Target lost. Proceeding on course".
Don't use them and bash them. don't play along there and come here for browny points and slander us.
If you want to make an accusation then support it with an accual event. Even a screen shot. I have had every complaint here made by folks not there, not yet involved, or totally misrepresenting the situation.
The exception is Space foxx and thats sorted out, and a player named tic who I want to settle with but havent been able to reach in game.
IF YOU MAKE AN ACCUSEATION SUPPORT WITH EVIDENCE
You dont even have to have a screen shot, unless its real bad and you want compensation. Other wise I want numbers of the units, and what exactly they did.
If your not will to do this then I can only chalk it up to whineing, mobbing, and mud flinging.
This is to improve our RP not to just complain. I did say this is here to say what needs to be said. I also fully expect these sort of threads to attract more complainers than supporters but I still have and read it to address problems and make corrections where needed.
For example. Mal in short said the Zoner dessie had to go. POOF gone!
Space foxx had some probs with interpeting the behavior of one. POOF fixed, I even posted a public appology.
Theres just two. Other ones I used to sublely change behavior. I do have new folk and integrateing them takes time. Expect mishaps. But since its a game very little is final. If we are attrocious report us.
I seriously suggest putting some effort into RP'ing with them...
Remember machines don't lie and they don't expect to be lied to (till they learn)
If things get too rough...
see if you can use the knowledge about zoners having alpha code to your advantage.
I agree. Harvesters have excellent RP and a story to back it up even if most don't know all of it YET. Zoners will not remain the target forever. It seems that the only reason TEMPORARY Autonomous Zoners have a problem is because they might accually have to fight or make a decision instead of twiddling thier thumbs or flapping thier jaw as the credits roll in. If TAZ want to be neutral to "all", then they should have Neutral ID's in my opinion.
ZONERS by definition are not by any means neutral to "all", the fact that they are allied to The Order and GMG makes it fairly clear on which side they should be standing and where they should and shouldnt be welcome. It also makes it clear who SHOULD want to help them if they ask for it. ZONERS maintain thier neutrality between outcasts and corsairs, not everyone else. They CHOOSE to live in dangerous space and should EXPECT that they will have to defend themselves or strike out from time to time, militarily, politically, or economically just like any other faction. Thats a fact of "life". The only ones trying to force RP or NON-PVP on anyone is TAZ, and its because they want to be left alone to go back to the way it was before. They were ignored and left to make money all they want without the fear of having to fight from time to time. If anything sink's TAZ's preverbial ship it will be this indecision and unwillingness to stand up for what they believe in that causes it. "The Zoner Way" is what will ultimately lead to it's own downfall. Something a true ZONER would never do is give up.
' Wrote:Then I wonder why you bothered to post anything at all? Just curious.
In any case, I still intend to roleplay with the harvesters, though I still haven't really found a satisfactory explanation as to what the hell this Alpha Code is. Would be nice if someone could point it out. If i've missed it somewhere in this topic, then I apologise. Anyway, I can see this is really getting out of hand, and it needs to be resolved soon if we're to salvage what is ultimately (and hopefully will remain so) a fun RP project.
For one thing, i'm thinking maybe the harvesters should stick to mainly bombers. They're quite capable of taking down not only traders but also capital ships, and I virtually never see a Harvester alone, so there's no chance of them really running up against anything too difficult, as a rule. Also, stick to civilian only ships for all harvesters ideally (the Talarcas are fine to a point, but I dislike running into groups of two or three of them), and civilian weapons/codenames for fighters and bombers.
Can someone maybe explain to me why the Harvesters are friendly towards Corsairs? And why they are hostile towards Lane Hackers and Outcasts? It has probably been posted somewhere but obviously i've missed it along the line. Just for clarification.
I'll Pm you some data not too much to spoil the surprises.
We use the war ships we have to protect the larger cargo hold we like to have. We do have some bombers but we are not civilian level threat. We should be a credible threat to the houses sometimes should they attack. We are unable to trade anymore really so we must harvest our money in other ways. Alot of NPC BHG and Zoners get harvested and their goods and pilots processed/sold on Junker bases.
We have not downed a trader in a while that I know of. If we do it would be a Zoner however I've not seen a Zoner in a train in a long while. I've also restricted our Caps from attacking ZOner Trains due to the recent event and we have fighters and gunships for that.
We just had to get heavier metal to repel the attacks we've gotten. and as Zoner posers go extinct we move to other threats or for now we spend most our time doing missions. To get money. Someone said we had 2 H-units hideing behind trader IDs, who. I had one a month ago but it Junker now since after the event. Plus we end up fight most the Cap whoreing indies everyone complains about. If anything we are doing the ALG's job of recycleing the garbage both liveing and inorganic.
FACTION LEADERS YOU MAY HAVE ALL DATA YOU REQUEST, I WILL GIVE FULL DISCLOSURE TO RELATED FACTIONS, AND FIRST REPONCE IN MY PMs
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